Passenger Cars : LUSENET : ACL and SAL Railroads Historical Society : One Thread

A few questions for the experts:

When did ACL purchase coaches 270-275 from the C&O? What happened to ACL 100? Still on roster in 1960 but off the roster later on. What happened to SAL Camden and Southern Pines? Looks like they never transfered to SCL. Sleeper Raleigh? destroyed in derailment but still on the roster in 1964. SAL 6002 was rebuilt into SAL 6053...when? Ex-FEC South Bay, what ever happend to this car? Not transfered to SCL it seems. Thanks.

-- Scott Lofreddo (, February 03, 2005


I checked the photos I have of the second Dillon wreck-the 1954 onewhere a train hit a gasoline tanker. All of the baggage cars were heavyweights-no lightweight baggage cars.

A favorite assignment for the South Bay was on the Gulf Wind where it served as the meal car, once full dining service was discontinued and a limited menu was available. see the Florida Passenger Train issue and Ted Shrady's article on the Gulf Wind. There is a copy of the limited food service menu shown.

-- Michael W. Savchak (, February 08, 2005.

Well,I know that "South Bay" was on the SCL for awhile.I have an undated photo of it in SCL lettering leaving JT.

Uncle Joe

-- J.Oates (, February 08, 2005.


I will check on the second Dillon wreck of 1954. That involved a secondary train and there was fire, but I do not remember that a lightweight car was destroyed. But-I will check the photos and the ICC report again.

I am not sure if the Cordele was destroyed on the L&N-apparently the loss of the Philadelphia may have influenced the "memory".

As far as I know, the two ACL cars were renamed during the SCL renumbering/re-naming.

-- Michael W. Savchak (, February 08, 2005.

Mike, thanks again. I vote for #6. Seriously, In addition to the fore mentioned cars, there are a few other "mystery" cars out there as well. Like ACL 151 believed destroyed in the Dillon wreck of 54, but scrapped c. 57, and diner Cordele wrecked or burned on the L&N but not at the same time as diner Philadelphia (57). It seems amazing that a piece of equipment can be scrapped at the "local" level without a notification to the bean counters at HQ.

Last question....any idea when ACL Camillia and Gardenia were renamed to Everglades and Okefenokee? Thanks again.

-- Scott Lofreddo (, February 08, 2005.

The South Bay was an interesting car indeed. But some speculation as to why it did not go to AMTRAK.

1. The car was damaged in a wreck/fire and was placed in "heavy repair" status and eventually sold for scrap. 2. The car was found to have structural damage from a combination of structural rot caused by cleaning solutions/water corroding the carbon steel framework under the Stainless steel skin. This rot could also have been exacerbated by the conversion to a tavern lounge car by the FEC. The FEC cut two additional windows into the car sides. This could have caused a structural problem that made the car undesireable to AMTRAK. 3. The car was held for possible sale to the Southern. The Southern had similar cars that it used for service on the Nancy Hanks and other trains when a diner lounge/tavern car was needed. 4. SCL decided to keep the car for its own use and then changed its mind. Just like the three ex SAL coach observation cars, perhaps the car was slated for some non-revenue use and then eventually scrapped. 5. The car was sold to another railroad for parts-trucks, mechanical systems, etc. Or-it became a "Hanger Queen" and kept other cars running. 6. The car was abducted by space aliens and is sitting on Europa "on ice". :-)

As for the other cars-damaged cars were often kept on the roster under the "Heavy Repairs" classification. These cars then became "Hanger Queens", where they became the source for needed parts. Basically, it was a slow form of scrapping, but did serve to keep other cars running. Expensive parts such as trucks, generators, brake rigging, seats, body parts, you name it, all could be used elsewhere. Might even be used to keep office cars and instruction cars operational. Wonder why some of the AMTRAK wreck repairs are so expensive and time consuming-guess what cars were used to supply parts to other undamaged cars?

-- Michael W. Savchak (, February 08, 2005.

RB&BB has some of those exSAL 4-5-2-1 or whatever they were,but I don't know which car names.And,yes,everyone wants to know what happened to South Bay.It did go to SCL,but then where?

-- Joseph Oates (, February 08, 2005.

Thanks Mike. From the information I have, it seems there will always be a mystery as to the final disposition of the cars I have listed. It seems to me the Camden, Southern Pines, South Bay and perhaps the Raleigh were left on a "siding" and "forgotten". The Camden, Raleigh and Southern Pines by SAL (no numbers assigned by SCL) and the South Bay by SCL (sinnce there is no ATK # assigned).

-- Scott Lofreddo (, February 08, 2005.

The C&O/NKP car article was in the 3rd QTR 2004 Lines South.

-- Michael Savchak (, February 03, 2005.

C&O coaches 270-275 were purchased in 1950-please see my article on ex C&O/NKP cars in Lines South-It has all the information on these cars.

ACL 100 was wrecked at Dillon SC in 1953 when the EC Champion went through a switch. The car was wrecked and ACL ordered a replacement car body from Pullman-Standard. This replacement car body was delivered to ACL, but was never finished or put into service. This is one of the mysteries/what might have beens that will appear in a future article in Lines South. Both cars were taken out of service prior to 1967, but interestingly, the Southern Pines was still shown as being in service in the 1970 Equipment Register! The re-numbering scheme left room for these cars, if ever they were deemed to be placed back in service. Often when a passenger car was severly damaged in a derailment and payments were due on its equipment trust, the railroad kept the car on its roster as a "heavy overhaul" unit until the car was paid off. SAL 6002 was wrecked in 1946 and was rebuilt by Budd in 1947 as part of the new order for Budd cars. FEC South Bay was indeed transferred to SCL-it was numbered SAL 6620 and it became SCL 5837. This car was originally built as a diner- lounge as part of the FEC's contribution to the New Royal Palm. FEC converted the car to a Tavern-Lounge by removing a part of the kitchen and adding a seating bay and windows. FEC did lease the car to the Southern for a while and then sold it to the SAL in 1966.

-- Michael W. Savchak (, February 03, 2005.

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