Okay, this is a gray area for me. Can anyone please provide me with some explanations as to the Right/Left stances on this issue? My personal stance is that I don't LIKE outsourcing for two reasons:

(1) I don't like the idea that there are companies that will work across borders paying people less than what they'd make in the States. That's immoral.

(2) I don't like the practice since they're American companies, and they should WANT to give jobs to AMERICANS to boost the economy and give the average working Joe a shot.

However, I don't guess it would be constitutional for us to illegalize this practice. Companies can hire who they want.

Anyways, I had heard that Kerry was against outsourcing, but I know that his wife is some kind of Heinz big whig and they're all about outsourcing. Also, when asked if he'd stop outsourcing, he said that no, he'd just try to provide a level playing field. Wtf does that mean. I imagine Bush would be for outsourcing just for the fact that it sounds like a good profit. He was asked about it and said that the key to filling these jobs with Americans is education. So my question is who the hell is on our side here? Are these the traditional Right/Left views on outsourcing?

What are you guys' thoughts on this practice?

-- I Like Pasta (lasagna@manicotti.com), October 26, 2004

Answers

Outsourceing. There really is no conservative side vs. liberal view on this, since it exsists on so many levels. I assume you are refering to the outsourcing of India in the field of computer programming and networking. Most big companies do this. Helps out Indias economy, plus saves them money.

On another hand some companies outsource product production [ Not like sweat shops, more of a "We can't do this, lets find someone else" ]. Some people are totally agianst "Outsourcing Jobs" since it does in fact lower the job market [ Though not by much ] in the United States.
However, these companies are saveing boatloads of money, there in effect lowering the prices of our consumer goods [ Atleast in the case of Outsourcing Jobs, if it was product outsourcing, like in my second example that may very well increase the price ].


So really are you for Jobs? or Cheap Prices?

The issue goes into a lot more depth, but I think thats the jist of it.


ILM

-- ILoserMan (ILoserMan@deflow.net), October 27, 2004.

Kerry's full of beans. You can't stop outsourcing if:

1. someone is willing and qualified to do a job for 1 dollar an hour when it would cost 30 dollars an hour to hire an American, and

2. people are willing to BUY the cheaper product made by the foreigner, and

3. the job is one that doesn't require you to be in the U.S.

For example, you can't be an overseas telemarketer if you can't speak English, but if you can, and work cheap, you dial phones as good as the next person. On the second point, if *AMERICANS* were willing to only buy products made here and promoted here, outsourcing would be a non-issue. The real problem is that AMERICANS are willing to buy shoes made in China for 5 dollars less than the American shoes next to them. Result? American firm goes under or outsources to compete. Get people to buy American, and the problem would disappear. Finally, there won't be outsourcing of jobs where you have to actually BE in the U.S. For example, if you are in a construction company building things, there isn't much chance you are going to have some foreigner imported to do your job, then deported again, the same goes for waitresses, shelf-stockers, truck drivers, mechanics, tradesmen, lawyers, doctors, etc. The only people who are at a big risk are those whose job can be done anywhere. - something to think about when considering a career, as for the first two (a skilled labor pool outside the U.S., and American consumers buying whatever's cheapest), those aren't likely to change.

Bazooka Joe

-- 2 (1@3.4), October 27, 2004.

One thing we have to realize: big buisiness is run by evil bastards. There's no two ways about it. You've got to be an evil bastard to make it in the corporate world. These people don't care about anything but money, and it happens to be cheaper for a company to move overseas because a) they don't want to pay taxes, and b) they don't want to have to follow those pesky labor laws. As a result, Americans lose jobs because their companies can get the same job done for a few cents an hour in a country like China, where the workers can't work within the democratic system (because there is none) to make their condition better (through labor laws). So as a result these companies suck money out of the US economy while paying no taxes and putting Americans out of work.

I don't get it, everybody's always complaining about "welfare mothers" and people sucking off the system...has it occured to anyone that bug buisiness "sucks off the system" more than anybody else? There are tons of big companies that move their "headquarters" to the Cayman Islands. They end up paying almost no taxes while they suck up government subsidies like a fucking Hoover. Guess who foots the bill for that one?

I think if a community relies on a company for jobs and said company up and leaves because it's cheaper to go to Guatemala, that company ought to pay the community some form or reparation. I mean look at places like Flint, Michigan...they helped the auto industry get where it is today...and then the big auto manufacturers decide to leave, and now it is one of the most impoverished communities in the nation. The people didn't deserve that. They deserve some kind of compensation...it's just not right.

-- Anti-bush (Comrade_bleh@hotmail.com), October 27, 2004.

lota big answers so much typeing cant do that so I'll stick with its umm bad.

-- Crisis (CrisisKils@hotmail.com), October 29, 2004.

Outsourcing is a complex issue.

You have labor on the one hand who would like to keep American jobs. You have business on the other who would like to make a profit, not only for themselves, but also for their stockholders (most of whom are Americans and own stock through their 401ks).

I think that buying American-made products is best in the long run for the following reasons:

1) Companies go to other countries to increase their profit margin because they can get cheap labor. It's almost like corporate slavery because when wages begin to increase in the given country, companies will move their operations to another country to start over. Factories overseas do not have to adhere to the same safety standards that are required in the US. In 1993, for example, 188 people were killed and 469 factory workers were seriously injured in a doll factory fire because they were locked inside the factory. The workers were locked in because the company wanted to prevent them from stealing toys. They had been producing items for Toys 'R Us, among others. They also produced the Cabbage Patch Doll and many other toys for many other manufacturers.

2) Outsourcing can be bad for the United States defense. Defense contractors outsource a large portion of their subcomponents and software to third party companies--much of which goes overseas.

Beyond the electronic and software items being offshored, there is a problem with the dwindling manufacturing base and steel production.

If there is a disruption in shipping, would America be able to produce enough steel for defense? Would American manufacturing be able to produce enough defensive weapons?

3) Outsourcing to a degree has caused a vicious circle. Because many Americans are making less, they have to buy cheaper items, usually made overseas. If Americans continue to make less, eventually they won't be able to buy even the stuff at Wal Mart. Companies profits will eventually suffer once people can't afford their stuff, so the stock market will go down.

4) There will be a time when the United States won't be able to pay for the huge deficit. It is close. If Congress hadn't passed the deficit increase earlier this month, the United States would have defaulted on its government bonds. It's that serious. The dollar continues to lose its value against other currencies. The only good to this is that it makes our exports cheaper, but it doesn't guarantee that they will be bought in other countries.

What makes this topic difficult for me is the thought that all the workers in the oversea's factories want is the American dream. They want to have a house and the ability to feed their families. I don't begrudge them the opportunity to make a living. I do blame corporations for taking advantage of the poor, companies who outsource to find a way out of the U.S. labor and environmental protection laws.

I think that workers who make products for American companies, regardless of where they work, should have the same assurances of working in a safe environment, as an American worker.

I don't necessarily think that the wages should be the same as Americans. Wages should be on a sliding scale, dependent upon the workers country's economy. That way, it will be comparable to a U.S. worker's wages, based upon their economy. In many places in the world, $5.15 U.S. is a fortune.

I think it should be outlawed for prisoners who were arrested for political dissent work in factories for free. China, for example, has many political dissent prisoners working who do not get paid at all. How does an American Worker compete against free labor?

It's complicated more because some U.S. industries have been so decimated that it is impossible to buy American. Have you tried to find a pair of shoes recently that was Made in America? Have you seen a T.V. recently that was Made in America?

Unfortunately, I have too much time on my hands today to think about these things. It's raining here. Forgive me for rambling.

Doodles

-- doodles (dragonmelt1@gowebway.com), November 27, 2004.

Sorry - did not get to complete the thought. The money saved by the companies that are outsourcing is being passed on to the American consumer and the company sells more of its product here and abroad by being able to offer it at a lower price which in turn will create more jobs here because they have to produce more.

-- Brad Schaper (BNDSchaper@aol.com), December 01, 2004.

Outsourcing sucks money out of the American economy. The money you spend on a pair of Nike sneakers goes to upkeep and overhead costs for factories in Asia (and into the workers' "salaries"- if you can call them that). If you buy American your money stays in America (for the most part). Buying American is the way to go; although it's getting harder and harder. Everybody thinks of GM as being "American-made", but if you look under the hood, you'll see parts from all over the world. Most GM cars aren't even assembled in the US.

-- Anti-bush (Comrade_bleh@hotmail.com), December 01, 2004.

Sorry anti-bush but your economic theory about where money goes when a US owned company manufactures a tennis shoe elsewhere is bogus.

If anti-bush incorporated made tennis shoes at a cost of $30 and sold them at a price of $40 in the US, AB inc. would have a net profit of $10 per pair of shoes. This profit is after all else has been paid for...factory, materials, wages, insurance, etc. what is the money used for?

It could go to the dividens of stock - (boosting shareholder income) or be poured back into development of the next brand, or into advertising to generate more sales.

But the money belongs to the US based company.

But if AB inc. builds the shoes in Malaysia or Korea or China, then the cost per shoes could be $10 per unit - thus making your profit $30! All that money is picked up in the USA and stays in the USA.

Plus, the long term effect of allowing 3rd world countries to have manufacturing jobs is two fold: as their middle classes grow, tyranical regimes must give them more freedom - so we have political pressures towards democracy.

Secondly, as their populations had more money and affluence, new markets are openned up for US manufactured goods - goods developed thanks to the R&D investments of US corporations who now have a new source of extra profits.

Thus its a win win for most people. The only group that suffers are the US manufacturing jobs - but then, they've always suffered - this is why we have public schools and public endowments and scholarships and a thousand ways for people to go to higher education on the public bill... so no one can honestly claim to be "stuck" in a low paying job because their skill sets are so basic.

America moved out of the horse and buggy industry and all those hoopers and coopers and saddlers and tansmen became rail road engineers or auto mechanics etc. People are free to move around in the USA (unlike in China).

Finally it is important to note that we are not the only country "outsourcing" German and Japanese cars are built IN THE USA - we get their outsourcing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! because it is cheaper for Toyota and Honda and BMW to build their cars here in the USA than build them in Japan and Germany and ship them over to us on a boat.

Anti-bush is anti-intellectual... sorry kid, but you really aren't doing your homework here. Having a stable economy (as we do) means lots of countries deposit their wealth with us... or Switzerland. In a way, that means they outsource their capital - and it benefits both us (who can use the money) and them (who don't have to worry about losing it).

-- Joe (joestong@yahoo.com), December 01, 2004.