Puttin' Freedom! self reliance back on the "active" list...

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Hello, welcome back!

-- joj (jump@off.c), August 12, 2002

Answers

Hello,welcome back!

-- joj (jump@off.c), August 12, 2002.

Joe , this forum is so empty lattley , I could hear the postings echo. I been hangin around my home waiting for people to show the place to . I have my place for sale( been getting some lookers) and when it sells , I'll probably be moving to Oregon. My brother talked me into coming out there and since I earn my megar living through playing music, I figure I'd get some work up and down the coast. A few people who visit this site are now posting at Countryside Families. http://www2.nature.nps.gov/ard/parks/grsm/grsmcam/grsmcam.htm This web site is a pollution monitoring station a few miles from my place, check it out if you have time. It gives new meaning to the words " Smokey Mountains ".

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 12, 2002.

Correction , that's countyside family. I've even got to post some UFO stories there, with no resistance.

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 12, 2002.

Ufo's are interesting at all times. I don't really know what they are, but I have no doubt THAT they are.

Thanks for bringing it back up, Joe.

How are the fires? I have been in serious isolation for awhile.

-- Doreen (bisquit@here.com), August 12, 2002.


Doreen , now that your here , I saw something on the history channel you'd find interesting , It was either jets or airplanes and they were making chemtrails about 50 ft. over the ocean that would spread downward toward the water and it made a curtain that was supposed to obstuct the vision of enemy submarines when they looked for ships through their periscopes. This was back in the World war 2 era. Why I mention " no resistance" when refering to my UFO story , some might feel my beliefs in UFO's and beings other then Human are cutting attacks at their religious beliefs , so I try to be careful where I express my beliefs , as I don't want anyone to be offended . I've expressed some of my views here before when this board was more active and you and the others seemed to not take it as offensive. But there's not to many people here now , so there wouldn't be much feedback or participation on the subject if I started a thread on it . And JOJ , that was me who tried to give your post an echo effect .

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 12, 2002.


Since I have the forum in my favorite list I don't use the lusenet guide to see what is active. Besides you need 7 posts for active status I think. Anyway the server was down and i couldn't answer a post that I thought needed an answer from me. Sadly though I do not remember what the heck it was called. Oh well. Such prose unread, 'tis a pity.

As for a UFO discussion, I would be interested. During the war they had what was called foo-fighters; aircraft that chased UFOs, the discloser project is about government persons that have UFO experience. Personally I have not seen one, though I sit up late looking for them. I also look for angels and stuff that I would like to see.c Still I guess it is like seeing "god" comes only to the "believer". Yet i believe and have not seen, why is that? You will have to convince me of its reality, but I won't deny your belief in them. I hear stories of "aliens" giving people technical data, and they don't know what to do with it. Why do the "aliens" waste such "knowledge" on person who can't use it? Hell give the advanced knowledge to me. I would love to be able to figure out what it is that they are trying to express.

JOJ you must be by JOJ Creek? Nice area. The bisquit fire is definately south of your area. South of wher I am too, but the smoke is quite heavy. Hope that it will not block the meteror shower. Yea I know sounds crass, but they said that they won't be able to control it until November, no sense getting all worked up about it, and I want to see the meteror shower.

Wish you all a hearty be well.

-- jonathan (jonathan_sz@yahoo.com), August 12, 2002.


Her's the web link that made me start my post .......... http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A8131- 2002Jul26.html .............. And I just have to say to Jonathan; : To believe in UFO's differs a bit from seeing one. Before you see one , you can believe in them. After you see one , you don't know what to believe. And it's always more forturnate to see one while with other people. Unless your with other people and your the only one who sees it. Never flag one down with a flashlight , they get real nasty when someone shines a light in their eyes. Next thing you know , there's missing time you can't account for and your eyes balls feel sore. Being that only a few people will talk about this subject leads me to just a few theories ,no one wants to admit they've seen UFO's cause they fear men in balck will come to visit at their homes ,cause they fear men in white will come to visit at their homes , people won't believe them , or all you others were actually abducted and only hypnosis will bring back the memory.

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 12, 2002.

This was only part of a UFO posting I wrote somewhere else. As far as convincing anyone about things I've witnessed , that's like forcing my beliefs on someone else . If I can convince someone to believe something than surely someone else can convince that person to believe other wise. It stops free and creative thinking and detours someones ability to find the truth . Don't believe , follow your heart . It's seem like a big priority in some people to see a ufo as if they are missing out on something great that others are getting to experience.I get a similar feeling when I hear about someone who owns their own organic tropical fruit farm in some mountainous land where the temputures are never to cold that you'll need to cut and split fire wood and never to warm where you'll need airconditioning.

-- SM Steve (Unreal@Home.com), August 12, 2002.

steve, what you say may be all well and true about believing and not seeing. That is like religion and in particular Christianity. "Blessed are you who believe without seeing" or something to that order. Still I would like to see UFOs, angels, Jesus, God and maybe some gold/money fall out of the sky at my feet.

It would seem to me that there must be some essence of truth to the "Close encounters and abductions", Like there must be something to the crop circles, the ancient monuments that modern man cannot duplicate and sensitives who can "feel" (lacking a better word) energy and such. I know to the Christian it is all the works of the devil, but seriously, can the devil be so powerful or God so weak? Besides, Christians are supposed to be able to heal the sick, raise the dead and feed the hungry multitude with a bisquit and sardine; all in the realm of the supernatural, yet they don't. Why is that, when Jesus said that we could because he went to the father? (sigh) So I am of the opinion that truth is truth and it is everywhere if we but open our eyes to see it and yes, believe. Still I want to see for myself. Thank you for the warning regarding visitation and the instructions regarding MIB and MIW. Be well

-- jonathan (jonathan_sz@yahoo.com), August 12, 2002.


My opinion of the one who is now called Jesus ,but had a hewbrew name that was changed for reason I believe was racially motivated , might be out of the normal concept of the Christian beliefs.The word Christain is derived from a Latin word refering to light. As once theorized and now proven in a science lab on Long Island , N.Y. ,the substance the materialized world is made of is light moving below the speed of light. Like water when heated is a gas, when cooled to a temperture between 33 degree ferinhiet to just before the vaporizing point ? , it's liquid ,and below 32 degress is solid , materialized matter has a flexibility that's similar. Only speed instead of temperture is the changing factor .Speed is controled by gravity . Gravity is a vibrating frequency . In the teaches of Jesus , it seems consistantly stressed , that attachment to the materialized world is best described as ( sinful ) lustful . He's selabate , he has no attachment to money ( gold ) doesn't own land and a home , no family ,if someone trys to take away your possesions he says , give it to them and lift no sword or weapon toward your enemy , infact he's says let them be your stepping stone . A stepping stone to where ? My guess is, what is called Salvation . And he goes 40 days without the essencial for material exisitence , food . He is not defying the laws of physics , which is nature , and nature is God , he is breaking the illusion of being traped in the limitations we created in our ( consciouness ? ) unconsciousness would be the accurate term. Do I believe he walked on water ? I do, Do I believe he feed a large amount of people with a few fish and loaves of bread ? I believe that also. Was he the son of God that came to save man ? I believe he was .More like God in a material form . Do I believe only through him do we come to God . I believe that's how I will find my way to the path . Do I believe people of other religions or faiths will be dammed because they don't believe like I do ? No , I believe anyone who is sincere in their quest to find the truth and the way to God will find it .And might find it before I do . Am I naive ? yes .Am I blindly folowing beliefs and falling under the spell that because I believe , it is so ? I search for my beliefs and need proof like is done in a science experiment . Again science is the study of nature , nature is God .has a spirit , an angel ,or Jesus come to me and change my once doubtful beliefs because I didn't have visual proof? Some things are better left unsaid . I still have alot to learn and I'm always stuck in some kind of illusion . Will I try to convince others this is the way for them also , No . I believe people need to find the truth on their own other wise it's value-less . I believe in reincarnation as purification of the soul and I'm dammed for these beliefs by others who see Jesus as their salvation. I also get disapointment when I hear of people claiming to have faith in Jesus , and have fire-arms to protect them selves and claim they' ll use them on others. I believe this goes against the teachings of Jesus , and proves that people are so attached to the materialized world , they will alter his teachings to maintain their lust , attachments , and weakend faith , and not fully trust his words.They put their salvation at risk to protect an illusion made of material. I won't harm another man to support my illusion of freedom.I won't try to force my beliefs upon another . The only bonds that keep me from freedom are the chains of my illusions that I bond myself with. Jesus came to break the chains of materialized illusion by teaching us not to feed off of them but to feed from the light , to set us free. Because of the ever changing physical laws of the material world ,we could create a perfect government and world peace , but ever changing will mean it's only temporary and will change again. There fore what happens here is an illusion , because truth has a stable and unchange-able consistency .You can't find that in a material world. As far as UFO technology by reversing gravity to 0 and becoming non material (light) as a means of travel, and is it the work of the devil ? Like mechanical tools such as a calculator can solve a mathematical equasion. But some can't do it without the calculator. Others can do a complicated mathematical in their minds .

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 13, 2002.


Doreen, thanks for asking; the fires are terrible! Now almost 400,000 acres, with 25% containment. If they'd have sent a couple dozen firefighters out the first day (or even the second or third), this would not have happened. There's been a lot of acrimonious finger pointing, but hopefully we'll eventually find out why the government decided to let this one burn for a while, with the result of this huge fire, threatening six or eight communities now, and at a cost (so far) of about 60 MILLION bucks, and not expected to be controlled until our winter rains are here.

SM Steve. Smoke? You've got smoke? Hahahahahahahahah choke.

-- joj (jump@off.c), August 13, 2002.


Jonathan , the part of my UFO storie I put here was just the foolish humor part . And as far as my religious beliefs I almost never display them in private or public. They could be taken as offensive by Christians or non Christians of other religions and I don't want to offend or stimulate anger in people. ..I could also be misunderstood . And my motives misread . Why did I displayed them today ? I keep asking myself that questains but I can't find an answer that's senseible . It kinda makes me feel open and exposed . But the main reason for keeping my beliefs private , Like a good carpenter doesn't get his reputation from talking about how well his work is , he gets one from his buildings and displaying his skills in practice ..I believe it's the same for A good Christian , if he talks about his faith too much , how will he ever find time to do the works and practice his skills that are needed to gain a good reputation of his works . Talk is easy and plentiful , and should not replace the works in practice. And to label myself as a Christian , it's only a word ,so I usually don't take that title. It seems to have different meanings to different people. Words are also a form of comunication that can also have a motive of wanting submission from others .This is a motive I stay away from and would recommend others to do the same. And Jonathan if money falls from the sky and you happen to get some extra ,would ya be a kind fella and sent some this way ,to help pay my electric ,I'm planning on moving and all my work is going toward making my dwelling appealing to someone who might want to buy it .Leaving me not active in buying and selling goats and playing my music for money.

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 13, 2002.

JoJ , you talk as if it's the biggest fire in the recorded history of the United States. Holy smokes!!!! 400,000 acres it is ! Now here's a fire that will be talked about for a few generations. Joe I complain about the stuff here that's been burning my eyes and decaying my lungs for the past 5 years, and I'm finally gonna be leaving soon and where do I want to go .To the state that has the biggest fire and the most ammount of smoke. Not much could be said about the gene pool I get my thinking traits from. I'm surprised these genes made it this far in time. My brother who was here in the Smokies 2 years ago and is in C.J. right now called me yesterday. He said even with all the smoke , he'd rather be there than here in the Smokies. I guess he might be using the logic that it's only gonna be smokey in Oregon til winter takes hold , or til there's nothing in Oregon left to burn. Which ever comes first. Those wern't his words ,just my foolish thoughts. It's probably a real sad time for the forrests of Oregon and the inhabitants that surround them , plus the wildlife . I wonder if the fires have an unseeable purpose that will benifit the forrest there , in the future , or if it's all just for nothing and only the destuction of a natural monument that took forever to be created and will take forever to be restored. I hope you don't take it as me being out of place for me to share my comments on something I'm so far away from and know so little about .I do realize only you all, who are experiencing this magnitude of destruction to your area can compehend what's really happening over there. May you guys get some unexpected rain , you could use a miracle right now .

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 13, 2002.

Hi, Jonathon, yep, I'm on Jumpoff Joe Creek, but up on a ridge where I can watch all the "fireworks" down in the Bisquit area. Where do you live??

SM Steve, it's not the biggest fire ever in the US, but I'm told it's the biggest in Oregon history. I'm also told it's the fourth biggest, so who knows?

As far as the result of the fire, I got a contract doing some water monitoring and consulting after the Silver Fire, which burned 100,000 acres in 1987. Also lightning caused, and also not fought for a few days to give it a big head start on the firefighters. The first time I was helicoptered into the area, I was very happy to see that maybe 90-95% of the trees were still green!

I don't know about the Biscuit Fire, insofar as how bad the devastation is, but I'm hoping it's no worse than the Silver fire.

Unfortunately, the Silver Fire didn't start until Sept 1, while this current fire began July 13, which gives it a LOT more time to do it's thing.

-- joj (jump@off.c), August 13, 2002.


Well Joe, I am thankful you are okay....very sorry about the fires though. I sure don't know enough about the blame game to state an opinion. Most likely several people are responsible for failing to act. I just hope you get a weather break to help them out.

Steve, I won't get into it- but that was pretty interesting, and thank you. Have you ever looked into quantum mechanical proof of existence of God? You don't have to answer that, it is just something to think on since you ae drawn to that type of science.

Ufo's.....I've seen a few, and I wasn't on drugs or over tired. Luckily there was another person with me one time. No MIB came, but it was very interesting without them!

-- Doreen (bisquit@here.com), August 13, 2002.



joj, Eaglepoint up near boise-cascade land. news says that this fire is the biggest in OR history. Yet some is in NO.CA so who knows. Sky is quite smoky and I have heard that the alerts are on a two hour basis instead of 30 minutes. damn hot today though 105*. Wind is from the NW and quite hot as well. No AC as that costs money, which I don't have enough of. Take care.

Steve, I haven't rad you post in depth yet, I will do so soon. Sound interesting.

Also, it seems like everyone here is not using their "real" addy. I am assuming that it is to keep the spammers at bay, yes? Seems like that is what is up, especially with those stupid and useless posts about visa and wire transfers and such. I guess I will need to go to that method as you all do. I suppose that being naive on the net about such things can be vexating to the mail box. I do get a lot of spam that I have no idea why I get it. I presume it somes from the forums I am on. Why do these people think that i want their advertising sent unasked for? OH well, I have vented.

-- jonathan (jonathan_sz@yahoo.com), August 13, 2002.


A correction to my long posting , not that anyone cares besides me . I wrote in one sentence : Because of the ever changing physical laws of the material world ........... I ment to say : Because of the ever changing nature of the material world .... I need to re-read my long post before I hit the submit button.

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 13, 2002.

Well steve I had not gotten there yet as I am seeing a lot of similarites in our points of view. I had posted weeks ago something similar on another forum. I appreciate your correction. I hope you will forgive my blatant typos in my last post. I will add your correction to the doc. I have made to read it offline. I will reply to your stuff soon. Thanks for engaging in some interesting things. Have a day as you wish it to be.

-- jonathan (jonathan_sz@yahoo.com), August 14, 2002.

Hey Doreen , you wrote ............. "Steve , Have you ever looked into quantum mechanical proof of existence of God? "....... I thought that sounded interesting. I'm not much of a reader. I'm also kind of stubbon and try to think on my own . It might sound crazy and I'll try to explain it in words and language which is real difficult because words and language is a material substance and when I have ,what can be best discribed as an opened window to let the light in , it's not thought of in language or words . So it hard to explain . I believe truth is all around us . And in a relaxed state of mind , when we don't think about how to pay the electric, or do the goats need water , or what should I cook for dinner , that type of stuff that just captures our attention and occupies our mind and keep us away from a vast pool of endless knowlege ,that in the right state of mind we can draw from it , food for thought and even energy to do physical stuff. Sound crazy so far ?. Most people think we only derive our energy from food to do physical work. If that were true , we'd probably be able to just eat , and could stay awake 24 hrs a day without sleep .But we sleep . And through sleep we absorb energy,we recharge our batteries in a sense. Now sleep is more than just resting .We become unconscious and even dream . I believe there's a place inbetween our dreams and the awake world we call reality. And there we feed from light and actually become conscious of truths .I believe that we don't have to be asleep to enter the place inbetween dreams and the awake world we call reality , but too much stimuli out side our minds causes us not to enter this place through distactions . Books, words and language ,slow my conscious down. Even if they hold truths, they are a distraction from finding truth on my own , which is the only way I can value from these truths. Why do so many people read the teachings of Jesus and yet so little of them fully apply those teachings into action ?. Some are still violent and condemful and can't open their heart toward their fellow man over a slight diffence of opinions and some would tear at anothers throat just to defend their own , almost meaningless opinion. These are not his teachings . I believe it's because they found the truth in a book and looked no futher on their own to verify the truth through their hearts and spirit on their own .And because they didn't find the truth on their own , no matter how much they say they believe , they have doubt hidden in a corner of their subconsiousness , and they won't admitt it to themselves.That doubt leaves them unsure of themselves and deffensive ( violent )because of their doubts . Now again this is only my opinion........... Other opinions can be derived from the saying that came about when some guys asked their friend to eat and the friend replied "no thanks I ate food you guys don't know about ". What was he feeding from ? If my opinions are offensive in anyway Doreen , I will post on subjects that are more easily digestable. I'm kinda interested in the quantum mechanical proof of existence of God , ( I'm curious ) , do you know a web site that might explain the basics ?

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 15, 2002.

I need to add: The reason I stress these are only opinions is because I'm a searcher of truth.I make no claims that I know what truth is ,Only that I search for it. Some believe they know what truth is , and this leaves them little room to learn because they are already set in their beliefs. This is one of the main reason the world is consistently at war because people are so sure of their beliefs, they will kill to defend them...........How else can I learn the knowlege of truth , but by accepting my own ignorance.

-- SM Steve (Unreal@home.com), August 15, 2002.

And We Bid You Goodnight

Lay down my dear brother, lay down and take your rest, Won't you lay your head upon your savior's chest, I love you all, but Jesus loves you the best And we bid you goodnight, goodnight, goodnight.

I would never ride, well, I would never ride (goodnight, goodnight) But His rod and His staff, they comfort me (goodnight, goodnight) Tell "A" for the ark, that wonderful boat (goodnight, goodnight) Tell "B" for the beast at the ending of the wood (goodnight, goodnight) You know it ate all the children when they wouldn't be good, Walking in Jerusalem just like John (goodnight, goodnight) I go walking in the valley of the shadow of death, And we bid you goodnight, goodnight, goodnight.

-- Jesus Bob (heavens@inn.com), November 27, 2002.


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