The starved colt I posted about (your favorite horse supplements) has been down for 12 hours now. He was standing when he greeted me this morning, even took a few steps to get water. But he laid down after that and has basically moved very little since then. I think I can feel my hair turning gray over this. We go from one extrmeme to another...down & dying, to up and vigorous, back down, then eating and drinking, then sighing and laying still. My nerves are shot (though I don't show him this.) I have never had a horse this bad off before. The auction colt was in much better shape. Will someone tell me, can a horse that has been down for 24 hours (it'll be that long tomorrow) still recover? What if he lays all day tomorrow, too? Strangely enough, he eagerly eats all that I offer. He just won't get up. Won't even try. Poops and then just lays in it. Yet he nickers to me and responds to me with his eyes, etc. He does not have the "I give up" vibe of a dying animal, but his body is so far gone... I went to K-mart and bought a dozen pillows, which my husband and I propped under all his pressure points and his head. He seems reasonably comfortable and pain free. I'm just discouraged. He got here Tuesday night and seems to be going in the wrong direction. I'm not expecting miracles, but I thought I'd have some noticeable improvement by now. Does anyone have encouragement to offer? Success stories? Knowledge of saving starved horses? I'll settle for a quick prayer on his behalf. Thanks.

-- Shannon at Grateful Acres Animal Sanctuary (gratacres@aol.com), February 28, 2002

Answers

Shannon.........prayers your way. What an angel of mercy you are for animals. I really don't know if he will get up, but if he seems reasonably comfortable and pain free as you say, well than even if he dies you have done a good deed and made him comfortable in his final hours. hugs

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), February 28, 2002.

I don't have an answer for you but I'll be praying .You poor things .My heart breaks for the both of you .Hope he gets better .

-- Patty {NY State} (fodfarms@hotmail.com), February 28, 2002.

Shannon, Will you contact me off forum. I have the phone number of a woman who ran the Minnesota Hooved Animal Rescue. She is a wonderful person and has saved many horses who were worse off than your baby sounds. She has rescued barnfulls of show horses with absessed feet who had been locked up to be forgotten. I have helped her in the past and seen her work. She will help if she can.

Susan

-- Susan in Minnesota (nanaboo@paulbunyan.net), February 28, 2002.

I don't have any advice, but I hope the prayer helps.

-- bergy (bergy@psbnewton.com), February 28, 2002.

Shannon, I have lost much sleep over sick and injured animals.As i lay in bed, with the wind howling as it did the last couple of nights with the chill factor down around zero, I worry for all those animal souls trying to stay warm and get enough to eat.This night my thoughts and prayers will be with you. Wish I had more to offer.

-- JB (JBakerBosco@cs.com), February 28, 2002.

Shannon, I think this colt is still telling you he wants to try. Does his manure look good? Is his appetite good as well? Remember, if he is a young horse, (under 2 years) he will be inclined to lay down longer than a mature horse even when healthy, so. . . Is there any way you can rig up a sling type arrangement for him? I would definitely try to change his position for him now and then if he doesn't get up soon. Can you get some foam waffle mattresses? If you have a friend or know anyone that works in a hospital, they toss these after the patients are through with them and they are twin bed size. . . Just a thought. I sure do admire you for taking this guy on and I hope to hear good news. Keep us posted. -- Renee M.

-- Renee Martin (icehorse@altelco.net), February 28, 2002.

He is eating = he is trying. Keep him fed, warm, move his joints, bend him where he is supposed to bend. Touch, caress, whisper, lock foreheads and "will" him to keep going; I pulled back the best dog I have ever known from distemper with this action. Food in, food out - horses do not have house manners; it does not matter to him. If he is not strong enough, it is not your fault - but we both know he is able if he tries hard enough.

-- mitch hearn (moopups@citlink.net), February 28, 2002.

As long as he is eating/drinking and it is passing through, he has a chance for recovery, but any horse that is down and can't get up should be rolled over several times per day, this is done by taking the legs and pulling the horse around to where there is room to flip him over on his back and over to the other side, pad the withers with hay or a blanket so the horse can go over easily, [or put the animal in a sling/harness feet just on the floor], what did the vet recomend for him?

Any way that is what I was taught, it has been many years since I worked with horses, if there is a better recomendation now, please post it, It is hard to keep up the new care and treatment info, if not doing it every day.

Much luck to you and a prayer for him.

-- Thumper/inOKC (slrldr@yahoo.com), February 28, 2002.

Hi,

Am very glad you are trying to help him!! :O)

If your colt keeps spending large amounts of time lying down there is a good chance he will become weaker and get pneumonia.

A special sling would keep him upright, but should only be done by someone that has done this before.

You need to get a Vet out there, or someone one that has had to deal with this experiance.

Good luck, Bergere

-- Bergere (autumnhaus@aol.com), February 28, 2002.

Don't give up yet. If he's alert and all , thats a good sign. I've seen horses down for weeks and get up and move. Did you say that farrier trimmed his feet? He may be just a little sore. Keep food and water and clean bedding in the stall.

-- handy (nmhoofer@paulbunyan.net), February 28, 2002.

I LOVE what Diane and Mitch said! Will him to live! I'm sending positive vibes your way and Heaven's. :) :) :)

-- Wingnut (wingnut@moment.net), February 28, 2002.

Shannon, prayers going up!

-- Terran in VT (homefire@sover.net), February 28, 2002.

Shannon....

You might want to call Best Friends...they have an Emergency Help Line all over the US...They can post your plight on the internet and also have lists of Vets, etc...who might be able to help.

The food and water is a Great Sign...remember his system has not functioned normally for a long long time. Also he definitely needs to have some blood drawn and tests done. Urine, etc. There could be significant parasites or viruses. His weakened condition exposed him to all kind of stuff and it will hit him harder. If you will send me an e-mail with his symptoms, I will call my vets here to see if his symptoms fall in line with something particular.

My home sends hugs and kisses to your home...please hug and kiss the colt from his friends in FL.

-- BC (katnip364@aol.com), February 28, 2002.

Shannon, If you want some help I'll drive down. But I would need a fenced area to put my two dogs. I can sleep in the barn, done it lots of times. Let me know if you need me.

-- Susan in Northern LP Michigan (cobwoman@yahoo.com), February 28, 2002.

Could you use the food to motivate the horse to move or at least stretch to reach the food???

Good Luck,

Be Blessed!

-- Rick in SW West Virginia (Rick_122@hotmail.com), February 28, 2002.

So sorry you're going thru this. If you don't get the horse up on his feet, I'm afraid you're going to lose him. The horse's anatomy isn't made for laying down for long periods. Get whatever help you can from folks to get him up. Can you fashion a sling to keep him standing?

-- ~Rogo (rogo2222@hotmail.com), March 01, 2002.

Hi Sharon, I have not been on for a couple days and I had to go a huntin to catch up on this colt story. First I would like to say,once again, I do admire you and thank you. Now for the baby..the first impression is, hey, he is two and made it this far through a miserable period. He is smart in getting by, he is a survivor, and I think he was waiting for you to find him!

I am gonna come at this in a totally different view probably. Here goes..You said his feet were trimmed big time...if they did not hurt him before..they are now, big time. Kinda like us tearin a nail or cuttin it too short..he feels his trim. That being said, I do believe a truly good farrier, in the long run, is going to be his best friend. If he has absesses .. I would take the hydrogen peroxide and apply it to them several times a day to eat out the infection. Plus it should ease the pain of the absesses. I would dress his hoof walls with any kinda cookin oil you have on hand. I would NOT be doin too much with his feed right now..especially if he is not able to get up easily. I would make sure he is eating his hay and drinking his water...I would started him out sparingly with a simple grain..cracked corn/oats MAYBE some molasses. Again, I would not throw supplements and big time feed at this baby..he is not able to get up and work it off..and right now, bless his heart .. his feed and water are going in and they are coming out..a huge change to his diet in my opinion, might well throw him into colic, etc. There will be plent of time to supplement him when he is up and more active.

If he has oozing sores..hydrogen peroxide..when it gets the sores cleaned up..you may have to throw some oil or salve on em to encourage hair growth and soften em up. If you after you have tried to heal any of his body sores..and you have one that is not responding..(I know this is gonna sound weird) throw a coating of sugar on it..I have seen it heal horse wounds and people wounds that would not heal any other way. Do not know why..it just seems to work on the stubborn spots.

Last and probably the least appealing to you, me and everyone else..The person that said this colt has to be moved..is right..or at least I was taught that too. Myself..I would force him to get up and move himself. He is surviving..and under much better circumstances than he was. He is smart enough to get off his hooves because they hurt..but I am a big believer in making him get up..even if it is just enough to lay back down again..I really feel he has to get up and move or shift his position under his own steam. I am guessing this will require you getting after him..which will be the distasteful part..but I would hate to see him lose any ground on what mobility he has.

I personally think this colt will come through this. He made it this far..I do not know how..he just has alot of heart. I could not find exactly when you got him..but if you have not had him long..do not rush him..it took him two years to get into this mess..it could and should take a good while for him to recover.

Sorry this was so long..just my dimes worth..this touched my heart..thank you for being you ..

-- Sher in se Iowa (riverdobbers@webtv.net), March 01, 2002.

You guys are just amazing. I am so incredibly thankful for your concern and advice. I spent many hours with "Job" last night. I stayed out there til it felt like my nose was frozen. It was a loooong night. Half a dozen times, I thought he was in death throes; limbs extended, lips curled back, neck stretched way out, etc. But he came back each time. I laid on the floor and held his head, and that really seemed to comfort him. This morning I went out at first light, knowing there was a good chance he had not made it through the night. (You better believe my DH was praying as I headed out the door; he has seen me lose animals before, and this one is so very special!) In the barn, I saw that not only had Job survived, but he had gotten up on all four feet and changed his position sometime during the night. He was down again, but was upright, eating his hay nonchalantly. I swear, I felt another few hairs turn gray on my head. We've been allowed another day, it looks like. Thank you, Lord. In answer to a few of your questions: I've thought many times that I needed a sling for Job, but the barn he's in would not support such a thing. I sure appreciate that picture though, Mitch, and will print it out for future reference. Susan, you're a saint to offer to come help. I am touched. I actually have enough help at this time. As of today, Job is getting about a handful of mare & foal grain three times a day. In the morning ration, I add calf manna, corn oil, and a biotin supplement. This is ok'd by the vet. By the way, the vet says Job's color and attitude are excellent, and that he feels optimistic about his chances. Once again, I am so thankful to you folks, and I hope that someday I can be as helpful to you as you have been to me.

-- Shannon at Grateful Acres Animal Sanctuary (gratacres@aol.com), March 01, 2002.

I'm agreeing with Sher, the geldings feet hurt pretty bad, paring off the excess toe has caused his legs to hurt also, and he's discovered that if he lays down it takes the pressure off. He does have to get up though, and I'd make him get up today. Go in the stall and mess with him, get him on his chest and rock him back, hopefully that alone will be enough to get him up, otherwise you may have to try more drastic measures.

IMHO, down for 12 hours isn't that bad as long as he is alert and eating, if he wasn't alert I'd worry.

Stacy in NY

-- Stacy (KincoraFarm@aol.com), March 01, 2002.

I'm glad he was up, Shannon! Sending good thoughts for Job.

Did your Vet say anything about giving him something for the pain? The Vet can give you Banamine or Rompum, but I've had good luck with an herbal Devils Claw mixture called BL Solution (used to be called Buteless). The pain relief may be enough to keep him up for short periods of time, you have to keep his gut active.

Good luck and we're thinking of you.

Stacy

-- Stacy (KincoraFarm@aol.com), March 01, 2002.

I forgot to mention that yes, he is on Banamine.

-- Shannon at Grateful Acres Animal Sanctuary (gratacres@aol.com), March 01, 2002.

Buddha is smiling on you today Shannon, you have been granted another lovely day with the colt, whether he makes it through or not, you are trying your best and the colt knows this, he can feel your love and devotion flowing to him.

Keep him warm, encourage him to get up and move about as much as possible, if he is eating, pooping, and passing urine, and it all looks normal, he should make it. Regular movement, even if you have to have two people holding him up, will keep his intestines working normally and help clear the built up mucus from his lungs.

Never give up if the will to live remains, you will know when it passes.

-- Annie Miller in SE OH (annie@1st.net), March 01, 2002.

Shannon, How big is this horse? Would a bucket on a bigger tractor raised over head support his weight in a sling? Just a thought. My dad did this once for a half-grown cow. Seems like we used folded canvas tarps for belly band. Just a crazy thought. . .

-- Renee M.

-- Renee M. (icehorse@altelco.net), March 01, 2002.

Shannon, you're feeding him about what I'd feed a critter in his condition. Corn oil is good(and cheap), I also like Redglow or Redcell and Clovite. Until he's up and moving about, don't give him much more than that handful of grain. I'd feed both alfalfa and grass hay. Alfalfa can be bit rough on the kidneys(high protein), but it is calorie and nutrient dense. It's definitly a good sign that he's eating and drinking! My skin and bones rescue wouldn't drink- had to let her out on the heavy dew-covered grass for short periods of time to get some water into the old girl.

I agree with the others that you need to either make him get up or completely roll him over several times a day.

I once refused to give up on an old dairy cow that went down for no apparent reason. Dragged her on a skid out behind the barn, brought her food and water, propped her up on her sternum w/ hay bales, covered her with a blanket at night(she was outside) and rolled her a couple of times a day. She was down for nearly a week. One morning I went to the barn and there she was- wandering around happily munching grass like there was never anything wrong with her. Your guy sounds like he has more will to live than that old nag of a dairy cow did- so don't give up yet!

Oh, you might want to ask your vet if there's another painkiller to try- Banamine usually works great, but maybe it's not doing the trick for 'Job'.

-- shakeytails in KY (shakeytails@yahoo.com), March 01, 2002.

Shannon,

Another thing you can do with absessed hooves is soak them twice a day in empsom salt and warm water. The salt will help draw whatever is left in his hooves out, it will also help sooth the pain (it will sooth where he was clipped back so severly to) and clean the wound out in places you can't get to. You can do this with a bucket under each hoof or with platic bags, don't tie the plastic bag around the hoof or leg just leave it loose or you can soak cotton and lay it in the hoof and bandage it onto the hoof with vet wrap, with this it is best to pour the salt onto the cotton after it is wet and before it is on the hoof. The next thing I would do is put him on antibiotics (pills) now! With an absess he could be developing a infection and at his wieght would most likely die from it if it spread. You also might want to treat him for mange, just a a precaution, very few things will take a healthy horse down to a rack of bones faster. Get him up on his feet and moving a little, if he can't I would agree with the others about putting him in a sling. Have you had a vet look at him? If you haven't yet I would just to make sure there is nothing else taking him down.

Good luck,

-- Mt Storm (mtstorm@usa.net), March 01, 2002.

The only thing that I can add to the excellent advice already given is perhaps some liniment rubs to help keep his circulation going and to keep him from getting stiff. A friend had and old gelding that would lay down to sleep, the old guys legs would go to sleep and then he couldn't stand. What an ordeal that was, he was huge and the two of us weighed about 100 lbs. each. Can you put a horse sheet on him? It might help to keep him limber and the warmth will help him to put the food into strength rather than to keeping warm. Good luck and I'm sending prayers.

-- nancy (stoneground@catskill.net), March 01, 2002.

It sounds like he is foundered. Foot problem that affects their behavior drastically. Call the vet out. One shot and 10 days of a cream to feed and he will be better. Cost us around $60.

-- (stephanie.wilkerson@experian.com), March 01, 2002.

Great picture of a sling! Yup, yup, yup! Gotta get him UP! He will absolutely damage his muscles if you don't. Sounds like he is trying to get up. At least pad his area HEAVILY with straw and roll him as someone else suggested. Even laying like a dog will help him not destroy his muscles... Hope and thoughts your way...

-- Gailann Schrader (gtschrader@aol.com), March 01, 2002.

Shannon, it was Rogo that put the picture in there, not me.

-- mitch hearn (moopups@citlink.net), March 01, 2002.

Rogo's picture is good for horses that can stand but need to be kept up, if the horse can not stand you must use a full belly sling or the back end can go down and the horse will hang by the "armpits", the pictured setup would work with two such slings, one as shown and the other at the back, the two slings would need to be attached across the belly and sides, so that neither could slip too far forward or too far back, the back one would be the most likely to cause problems if it slipped.

-- Thumper/inOKC (slrldr@yahoo.com), March 01, 2002.

The Anderson Sling is used when a critter needs to be flown below the plane. I wonder if it's over-kill for the barnyard critter.



SHANNON, my personal opinion ~ your horse shouldn't be fed anything but grass hay.

-- ~Rogo (rogo2222@hotmail.com), March 02, 2002.