Anthrax ?

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I have a question about anthrax that maybe someone can answer that has been studying this since it came up. If the potent and more dangerous type is put into a supply of drinking water such as a small resivour, is it just as deadly injested into the digestive system remembering that now it only takes just a few spores of this worst kind to be fatal? And would clorination kill the spores? If this can happen I'm buying stock in bottled Rocky Mountain Spring Water.

-- Boswell (fundown@thefarm.net), October 26, 2001

Answers

BOS, water & food=watch em.and whatever you do,STAY AWAY from

San Francisco!!

-- al-d. (dogs@zianet.com), October 26, 2001.


What will you do when/if they release small pox next or start detonating suit case nukes?

Boswell, you can run my friend, but you will never hide for long.

-- Life is short (Jesus is@Eternal.Life), October 26, 2001.


Boswell:

I am guessing that you don't know too much about this or you wouldn't have asked this question!

If the potent and more dangerous type is put into a supply of drinking water such as a small resivour, is it just as deadly injested into the digestive system remembering that now it only takes just a few spores of this worst kind to be fatal?

Answer is no.

Best Wishes,,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 26, 2001.


They could also infect bottled water, knowing that people will be afraid to drink the tap.

Will boiling tap water kill any dangerous organisms?

-- (just@wondrin.), October 26, 2001.


Rather then freaking out why not take a little time and do some research on the web? Start with a site such as this BBC site and continue elsewhere if you need to know more...

The more potent and deadly type of anthrax is inhaled.

"Anthrax is caused by the organism Bacillus anthracis.

In some parts of the world, this can be found in cattle or other hoofed mammals.

It is infrequent in western Europe and the US, and is more likely to be found in animals in south and central America, south and east Europe, Asia and Africa.

This bacteria can form spores which can either be eaten in contaminated meat, breathed in, or simply infect the skin directly through human to animal contact."

And BTW, that white powder on your co-workers shoulders is probably just dandruff, not anthrax so don't bother calling the emergency department.

-- The Toner (the.toner@home.com), October 27, 2001.



Cutaneous (skin) Anthrax is normally caught when one has cuts or abrasions on the skin and/or handles a lot of spore contaminated material. The stuff that is giving cutaneous anthrax to people who are just handling the mail must be extremely potent to infect them in the absence of cuts or abrasions.

Very scary.

-- Concerned Citizen (be@very.careful), October 27, 2001.


Everyone has cuts and abrasions on their skin. You keep confusing anthrax the disease with the organism that causes it. The organism is everywhere. There were outbreaks of the disease in cattle this year in ND [see the CDC page] and one case of skin infection in humans was confirmed there.

The strain involved in the mailings is the Aimes strain; it is not a super virulent strain. I don't know where that idea came from. Get hold of yourselves.

The press doesn't help a whole lot by publishing misinformation. Still I have become used to the lack of competence in the press when dealing with technical subjects.

If you live outside of Antartica, the bacterium is likely in your water supply and has been since your water company was formed. It is pretty common.

Best Wishes and drink water :),

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 27, 2001.


Thanks for the update Z. The government and news media are telling us it is the Ames strain. A lot of us believe them about as much as we believe Bill Gates is an altruist, so naturally this is suspect to many of us. Do you have any info from your collegues confirming that it is indeed Ames? And, why does it seem to take so little of this stuff to infect people vs the natural situations that infect wool sorters and third world people?

-- CC (appreciate@the.info), October 27, 2001.

CC:

It is not that easy to get information. It is part of a criminal investigation. They never release information under those conditions. So, in a technical sense, we may all be in the same boat. We can make some guesses. The fact that it is sensitive to beta-lactam antibiotics indicates that it wasn't developed as a weapon of mass destruction. No one in their right mind would develop a bio-weapon which could be countered with the cheapest antibiotic. I have 1/2 of a kilo of amphicillin in my lab fridge. Not to mention how much penicillin and other "cillins" I have. Does it take fewer spores to cause infection? I don't know since I haven't seen any data on the matter. In the case of inhalation anthrax, it isn't virulence, it is alteration of the physical properties which allow it to remain suspended longer.

I do have meetings next week. We will see. [Yes it is Ames, located on the beautiful Skunk River :)))].

Best Wishes,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 27, 2001.


Z,

The TV experts on anthrax have been saying that the anthrax used was specifically created by very sophisticated means to be extremely deadly. Any idea why they would be saying that if it weren't true? Why would they intentionally want the people to be alarmed if it weren't that dangerous? Maybe they are just saying that so that our government officials can justify the shutting down of their offices?

-- (hmmmm@contradictory.stories), October 27, 2001.



I have the same trouble understanding what they say as you. I took it to mean the the spores had been treated to prevent electrostatic clumping and would remain suspended in the air longer [that is what at least one said]. That increases the chance of respiratory infection. You might note that the chemical treatments aren't specified. Those are big time secrets. Keep in mind, I don't work in bio-weapons development.

Best Wishes,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 27, 2001.


By-the-by:

I would carefully analyze the experts that they put on the air. With so many broadcasts, there is a shortage of experts. I heard one on TV who kept referring to anthrax as a viral disease. They had a "epidemiologist" on NPR who didn't know the definition of an epidemic. He defined one case of inhalation anthrax as an epidemic.

Sometimes, they scrape the bottom of the barrel. ;<)))

Best Wishes,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 27, 2001.


Interesting discussion on anthrax from you people! I have another question for somebody who wants to take a crack at it.When we get the bug, my wife and I take livestock grade Calf Terramycin Powder antibiotic from the local vet clinic which we put in 00 gel capsules. No time at all you get to feelin better with no after affects. The whole bag costs about 5 dollars and that'll last you 2 years. Can this be used along with or as a substitute for Cifro or any of the other antibiotics they are now using to combat anthrax?

-- Boswell (fundown@thefarm.net), October 27, 2001.

Boswell:

I don't give medical advice. But if you are using the term correctly, this antibiotic works best against Gram-negative organisms. Anthrax is caused by a Gram-positive organism. It is not a good idea to use a member of the tetracycline group that was designated for animal use. It isn't all that stable and the breakdown products are toxic to eukaryotes; that's you Claude.

;<))) Remember that this isn't medical advice.

Best Wishes,,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 27, 2001.


That was pretty low, Z. What's going on with you? It seems that you offer nothing but insults lately.

-- Anita (Anita_S3@hotmail.com), October 27, 2001.


No insult taken on this end. Z, I threw this in here so people could look and evaluate it at their own discretion. There are many of us in the farm community that take vet grade medicine and this is one of the better ones. Vet grade DMSO is another one. Nobody has ever gotten sick and the meds have always worked great. But I'm going to tell ya, if you insult me one more time you're Boswell's shit list and it won't be pretty!

-- Boswell (fundown@thefarm.net), October 27, 2001.

Anita:

Please explain. I am just giving technical advice. The Claude thing refers to the post from "Hair" that I made the other day. Sorry if it offended you. Still, I find it dangerous that people are talking about storing tet pills for fish or cattle and using them. It isn't a problem if you plan to be cut up into steaks next year. Otherwise it could be. Just a warning. Talk to your doctor.

Best Wishes,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 27, 2001.


OK Anita:

Sometimes, I am too cryptic. Here is the quote from the aetheism thread [whatever that means].

Manchester England England

Across the Atlantic Sea

And I'm a genius genius

I believe in God

And I believe that God

Believes in Claude

That's me that's me

Hair circa 1968

Claude was used in a generic fashion [representing mankind as it was intended in the original score], not as an insult. Sorry Boswell. I assume that is what y'all considered an insult. Wasn't meant that way at all.

Best Wishes,,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 27, 2001.


Anita:

Of course, I had no intention of insulting Boswell. We folks from the west stick together. It just occured to me that you might be talking about the discussion that you, Flint and I had. Now, I was just trying to find out if you had some information on the subject. Surely, I don't have everything that is known. It appears that there is no new information. Nothing wrong with your opinions. I just wondered if there was other data.

Best Wishes,,,,

Z

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), October 27, 2001.


Z - what would happen if they bypassed the USPS and started spreading anthrax on dollar bills?

money laundering in our future?

-- just passin through (jpt@ontherun.com), October 27, 2001.


There are probably worse things on money, than anthrax.

-- (bet@ya.), October 27, 2001.

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