Structural Insulated Panel - Homemadegreenspun.com : LUSENET : Countryside : One Thread
Has anyone tried to make their own SIP's ? It seems to me if a person wanted to build a house using this "becoming popular" alternative, it could be done cheaper by simply purchasing OSB, and the required 5 1/2" poly-(styrene, urathane) sheets, and using manufacture grade contact cement. Apply the cement to the enire surface area, and use a 4x8' weight until dry. My SIP would be the same as the purchased SIP at a fraction of the cost. Any thoughts from you on this subject would be great!
-- Marky (email@example.com), October 17, 2001
Cool idea, Marky. I haven't done much research on the prices of SIPs, so I'll have to take your word on the costs. Sounds like a simple enough process, just make sure to take into account your time. Time is money, so "pay" yourself a good hourly wage and see if the costs are still reasonable. Do you have an inside area to build your SIPs? Doesn't sound like the kind of process you'd want to get caught in the rain.
Do you know of any contractors using SIPs? If so, try and talk to their lead carpenter about what works and what doesn't with the whole process so you can avoid manufacturing flaws that the big guys don't even know about.(lead carpenters love having their opinions valued and they often know more about the specifics than the bosses and are more likely to be upfront about what's a pain in the awapuhi...)
Where do you get your 5 1/2" poly sheets?
Good luck and let us know how it goes!
-- gilly (firstname.lastname@example.org), October 17, 2001.
If you're running your wiring through the walls, you'll also need to route the channels in the EPS before assembling the SIPs. The EPS in each SIP does not run to the edges of the OSB, there is room for splines. Therefore you'd either have to trim the EPS before or route it after assembly. To assemble enough SIPs to build even a small house would be a long, labour intensive process.
-- Jake (Jake@home.com), October 17, 2001.
part of the saving from them are the time saved, since they are manufactered somewhere else. Gues you could,, but it would be cheaper still to make your own forms, and pour a portion at a time,, could move them forms when one is dry,, that way you wouldnt have to buy so much lumber. But again,, the time thing
-- stan (email@example.com), October 18, 2001.
I'm a big fan of SIP's and hope to build my new home using those above ground and ICF's (Insulated Concrete Forms) below. I have to admit I've never even considered building my own SIP's. I'd certainly want to make sure I was using the same flame- and insect- retardent material for the core. Another concern would be making sure everything was done right because with SIP's THEY are the support structure for your home rather than 2x studs. If the angle is at all off you could have a problem. Personally, I think I'll just buy mine for the house.
I would consider using something like that in my pole building as interior walls to divide heated and unheated areas. If you want to see how they're built you might want to contact a manufacturer of SIP's. Most are happy to have you come tour their facilities and examine the product and process.
I'd also be interested to know about your source for the cores. Please post that info as soon as you can or email me directly.
-- Gary in Indiana (firstname.lastname@example.org), October 18, 2001.
I don't lile the SIP's your talking about because they are made from a formaldahyde soaked plywood, foam insulation (which outgasses some nasty stuff, and large amounts of concrete(the production of cement is very unfreindly to our Earth). There are other options that can be used to build "good" walls. Cob uses the Earth itself and has been used and lasts for centuries. Papercrete, is somewhat newer but has great potential. These are just two examples of possibilities that exist out of many that are more friendly to this Earth and many times are less inexpensive. Of coUrse if you are talking about earthbermed walls you caN look into Earthbag and Earthship Construction. We all need to be more friendly to our good planet. OAK
-- OAK (email@example.com), October 19, 2001.
I've read nothing which raised concern re. the environmental issues surrounding SIPs. Their insulation properties (less resources used to heat/cool a structure) and the fact that OSB is made of easily renewable wood products all make sense environmentally.
-- Jake (Jake@home.com), October 19, 2001.
Good point, Jake. OSB is far easier on the environment than building with dimensional lumber. SIP construction is way more energy efficient (a 4" SIP wall is superior to a 6" stick built insulated wall), SIP structures are stronger against natural disasters such as earthquake, tornado and hurricane. I just think they're a better way to go in every way.
-- Gary in Indiana (firstname.lastname@example.org), October 19, 2001.
I'm not arguing the fact that they are more efficient and much stronger than a block wall. In fact I have thought of buying or constructing my own a few times, but I would only use it below grade such as in an earthbermed situation. For the Earth I do look for any alternatives to whatever. And I don't want to burn any more wood to heat than I have to. As an example, above grade you could use papercrete, which is mostly paper. Papercrete has an R value of 2-3 per inch. So a 12" wall will have an R value of between 24 to 36, where an sib using two 1/2 styrafoam on both sides of poured concrete will only give you an R value of what? mayby 6? And no waferboard. Yes the concrete is stronger, and doesn't absorb as much water, but in many aplications I see papercrete as being far superior "above grade". And who knows, mayby below. Know one has tried. I have my doubts though. OAK
-- OAK (StrugglingOak@aol.com), October 21, 2001.
Do SIPs contain Formaldehyde? The answer to this question is technically yes, realistically no. This is the case because the amount of formaldehyde in the SIPs emitted only by by the oriented strand board (OSB used in SIPs is less than 0.1 PPM (parts per million). This is well below levels established as acceptable by the U. S. Department of Housing and Urban Development, (HUD). In fact, the HUD Standard now in effect exempts OSB that is produced with these phenolic type adhesives.
Large chamber testing demonstrated that emissions of formaldehyde from OSB is less than would be encountered in the normal atmospheric levels of an urban environment.
Testing done by APA - The Engineered Wood Association, has been extensive and conclusive. With their permission, a report that provides more detail on this subject has been reprinted and is available from the APA or SIPA offices.
The rigid foam cores and the structural water base adhesives used in the panel manufacturing process have no formaldehyde content and are inert plastics prior to leaving SIP manufacturing facilities.
Further information is available from SIPA manufacturers nationwide, for a list of manufacturers see GET SIPs!, or call (253)858-7472.
-- Greg in Indiana (email@example.com), January 08, 2002.