Consolidate Thread on World Trade Center Disaster (Please post updates here)

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Please post further updates, comments, etc. against this thread so poeple don't keep to jump back and forth between so many.

-- Ken S. in WC TN (scharabo@aol.com), September 11, 2001

Answers

Crash in Somerset Co., PA....More unaccounted for in the air....one headed for D.C.

-- Mike (smfine@yahoo.com), September 11, 2001.

Get praying, people - all these innocents...

-- Judi (ddecaro@snet.net), September 11, 2001.

Does anyone know the number of aircraft involved. Obviously at least for (two at the trade centers, one at the Pentagon and one crashed in PA). Was there a fifth which also crashed elsewhere? I wonder where the one which crashed in PA was heading.

If there is a bright side to this unmitagated disaster, it is the two pilots which crashed into the World Trade Center buildings apparently weren't highly experienced in that they chose to hit high up in both buildings. If they had come in on say the 40th floor, they might have brought both down essentially to ground level.

I wouldn't be surprised if the dead go up into the five digit figure.

I know airport security has become somewhat lax, but one still has to wonder how 4 or 5 aircraft could be highjacked.

I have been in the Pentagon on maybe 100 occasions. It is built about like a fort with thick walls and the rings are separated by open areas/air shafts so that may have reduced damaged/casualties there. That pilot apparently did know what he was doing, but I am surprised they didn't come in from the Potamac and hit that side as that is where the most senior personnel are located.

-- Ken S. in WC TN (scharabo@aol.com), September 11, 2001.


they think the fourth plane that crashed was heading towards camp david.

well, i guess this means war. as a nation, everyone acts like nothing like pearl harbour could ever happen to us again. such arrogance.

airport security lax? hmmmm. i have always felt them hyper paranoid, and seen no laxness, though I don't use them a lot... they wouldn't let me carry on duct tape with my two kids incase i wanted to try and overpower the kids.

i am so sad and can't stop crying for all these people.

-- marcee king (thathop@mwt.net), September 11, 2001.


The United States will never be the same!

-- Ardie from WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), September 11, 2001.


I've always found airport security to be very inconsistent. Sometimes the buzzer goes off with one nickel in the pocket, and others it doesnt with a pocketful of metal.

-- Earthmama (earthmama48@yahoo.com), September 11, 2001.

They have tailed the tiger, an act they will regret for few are as determined nor outright mean when riled as an American. We may argue and squabble amongst ourselves, but as in any large family, when one is threatened we are all united. This is an act of war, the war of the flea and we will now be the can of Raid.

-- Sandra Nelson (Magin@starband .net), September 11, 2001.

Well said, Sandra!

-- Cheryl in KS (cherylmccoy@rocketmail.com), September 11, 2001.

My husband is Iranian, and he told me today that his family called him from United Arab Emirates where they saw on television someone claim responsibility on behalf of what I believe is the Red Army of Yemen. However, I haven't heard anything about that here.

-- Leslie A. (lesliea@home.com), September 11, 2001.

Kick some ass,America!

-- Denver Kessler (kandkprod@hotmail.com), September 11, 2001.


I am reminded of a statement attributed to Japanese Admiral Tojo after the Pearl Harbor attack: "I fear we have but awakened a sleeping giant."

-- Ken S. in WC TN (scharabo@aol.com), September 11, 2001.

An eye for an eye? I fear the whole world will be blinded before all is said and done.

-- Sojourner (notime4@summer.spam), September 11, 2001.

I personally feel we may be directing too much attention toward the Palestinians...using them as a scapegoat. It has long been know that they had a hatred toward us which would explain their (sick) celebration at the massive loss of lives of American civilians, officials, and rescue team members. What I find strange is that it was not too long ago that we had an issue with China over a spy plane they confescated in their air space. At the time tensions were high and they felt that war would be a result. Then everything is ok. Out of nowhere we are attacked by a very well trained and intellagent group of terroristic kamakazi pilots. Let us not forget it was the Japanese that were known for use of kamakazi pilots durring WWII and ironically enough the last major attack on American soil was by the Japanese in WWII when they, "out of nowhere" attacked Pearl Harbor...now, about 50yrs later we get in a quarrel with Chinese leaders and "out of nowhere" we are attacked by kamakazi pilots. The Chinese, much like the Japanese are not very tolerant of such things as the spy plane incident in which WE were in the wrong. We violated air space laws and now, if this were a retaliation of China, here are American civilians paying the price of our countries leaders mistakes. Im not saying that Japan and China are the same, nor am I implying that it is, beyond a shadow of a doubt China, Im just saying that we need to keep an open mind to all possible suspects.

-- Joshua Lowry (kornfreak6969@hotmail.com), September 11, 2001.

I posted the following earlier today at another Intersite site; it seems appropriate to repeat it here:

Yesterday here in my studio office, I had occasion to look for a certain picture I wanted to scan for a digital copy. I found it, did the scan, returned it to the file, and put the file back on the closet shelf. This morning after watching the New York tragedy unfold including the collapse of the landmark twin towers of the World Trade Center leaving Manhattan shrouded in a surreal cloud of smoke and dust, I returned to my office where the first thing I saw on my desk was a photograph that had fallen from the file when I had it open yesterday. It was a 1993 picture of a friend on the dock at Ellis Island with the Manhattan skyline and the twin towers in the background. How different that picture would appear today.

-- Harold Arnold (hhullar5@texas.net), September 11, 2001.


It's 10:30 pm, and they said that 260 firefighters and 80 some police personal are believed to have been crushed when the tower fell.

-- Cindy in KY (solidrockranch@msn.com), September 11, 2001.


Sojouner you may be right, but its too late and war has a history of killing the civilians. think about it. The world has been blind for a long time. We have to do what we have to do. its us or them. How would you and everyone else here feel if we lost loved ones because we were too peaceful? i don't think we will ever see world peace. And lets be real, w ekill civilians all the time in foreign countires, its just not mentioned a lot. Its too late.

-- Bernice (geminigoats@yahoo.com), September 11, 2001.

The whole world had been thumbing its nose at us since our politicians tied the hands of our military in Korea. Everyone knows that we have the biggest stick,but lack the political guts to use it. We are not respected in the world. This time the world is watching,because we now have been given a mandate by the events today to flex our muscle and get back respect. If we fail this time we will become the worlds favorite victim.

-- Del (dgrinolds@gvtel.com), September 12, 2001.

Bernice, you just made my point for me. We are not innocent, as a nation. Two wrongs don't make a right. Yes, certainly, find out WHO is responsible and punish them.

But all you folks out there who are screaming for the blood of innocents, who want to kill and bomb and maim, who want to target civilians ON PURPOSE, you are all no better than the terrorists you hate and rage against. ANYONE who proposes killing children and civilians as a primary military target is no better than a terrorist, and every bit as reprehensible and evil as whoever did this. Your souls are steeped in evil. If there is a devil, he owns you.

This is the greatest evil I can imagine, that out of one side of your mouth you maunder about the innocent victims here, and on the other you spew forth the kind of poison that says its alright, no, it's REQUIRED, to slaughter THEIR innocent civilians.

They're just people. We're just people. Whoever was directly involved in these attacks are evil people. And ANYONE - ANYONE - who wants to do the same to some nebulous, unidentified "them" - is evil as well. You are angry at "them" for doing to us exactly what you are proposing we do to "them", and "they" did it to us for exactly the "reasons" you give for doing it to "them".

You all forgot the Vietnam War? I can remember seeing dancing in the streets here after some US "victory" ... ticker tape parades ... we're no better than "they" are. "They" are no worse than we are.

"Their" babies don't deserve to die any more than our babies.

I am not a pacifist. If someone comes on my land and tries to do me or mine harm, I would act to protect myself. But I'm not about to take a gun and polish off the family down the road just in case they MIGHT be the ones who burned down my barn, or they MIGHT be HARBORING the ones who burned down my barn, or they MIGHT know someone who knows someone who suspects they might know someone who might have been involved in burning down my barn. Or killing my one and only son. Who might very well be killed anyway in the war you bloodthirsty goons want to start by bombing civilians, of what country you can't even begin to guess. I guess any old country will do, as long as its full of feelthy furriners. Just any old body you can hate without even having to think about it.

I'd tell you to go to the devil, but he's obviously already found you.

-- Sojourner (notime4@summer.spam), September 12, 2001.


Indiscriminate revenge is not the thing, but those who feel that blowing up a trade building by flying a hijacked plane into it is appropriate activity for furthering a fanatical political religious viewpoint need an acute attitude adjustment or the world's children will never get the opportunity for the future they deserve. Whether the USA likes it or not, we are the big boy on the block and if anyone is going to do the adjusting, it will have to be us. Yes, we have a checkered past and present. Altogether too much greed influencing this country's decisions. But, there is no waffling in this. What occurred today was pure terrorism by people who find it easier to kill to further their view than to persuade, easier to dominate by creating fear than to work at the negotiating table. We must stop second guessing right and wrong and come down soundly on the principles expressed in our Constitution and in the Bill of Rights and cease apologizing for our position.

-- Sandra Nelson (Magin@starband.net), September 12, 2001.

Ken,Admiral Tojo also said a wise man would find away not to go to war! I agree with sojourner to a point get who is responsable not go on a killing spree.As Anne murry sings, sure could use a little good news today!

-- kathy h (ckhart55@earthlink.net), September 12, 2001.

I agree with Sojourner on this. Also wanted to comment on "eye for an eye;" before I became a Christian this was a grotesque thought to me--that a loving God would demand retaliation. Well, from what I've since learned, God said, "an eye for an eye," to *limit* retaliation, not to demand it; to say go no farther, exact no more than that. It is natural but certainly not Godly to want to strike back harder than you were struck.

-- Elizabeth in E TX (kimprice@peoplescom.net), September 12, 2001.

This thread appears to have split along gender lines and I must admit to being with the ladies on this one.

-- john hill (john@cnd.co.nz), September 12, 2001.

My thoughts travel to you from New Zealand - today I realised how lucky I am to live in a "neutral" country.

Like yourselves we here are all worried about what stance America will take in response to this act of violence, I just hope there are a lot more people like Sojouner (sp?) out there - especially in your government where undoubtedly it counts.

-- Jenny Butler (heavenleigh2938@hotmail.com), September 12, 2001.


If some third party were to bomb the crap out of Iraq, do you not believe that there would be much dancing in the streets and such merriment here? The Palestinians have their reasons for feelings, as we would have in my hypothetical situation. That does not make them any more evil than ourselves. In my belief system, an event like this is a test of our resolve to be good and kind, forgiving and generous, strong and principled. It is easy to be good when all is well. It is when disaster strikes, when one is hurt, when one's family is at risk, that who we truly are is tested and displayed for review by Himself.

-- Soni (thomkilroy@hotmail.com), September 12, 2001.

Sojourner I have never seen film of Americans dancing in joy and tossing their children sweets upon hearing of terrorist attacks elsewhere in the world.

-- Dianne (yankeeterrier@hotmail.com), September 12, 2001.

Dianne: I agree for the most part. Since the U.S. is seen as 'the great Satan' in much of the Middle East, the response there could be expected. In the U.S., wait until Fidel Castro dies and see what will happen in South Florida. There are contingency plans to try to deal with the celebration and the Coast Guard has plans to try to stop maybe thousands of small boats heading for Cuba.

War against terrorism. Against who? Likely this terrorist cell contains less than 50 people. They look like the local population, they act like the local population, they speak like the local population. Thus, they can become virtually invisible.

What will be the long-term impact on the U.S.? The complex wasn't called the World Trade Center without reason. Much of the world's commerce was handled out of it. Paper today is saying the attack will likely be the trigger to cause a recession, not only in the U.S., but in much of Europe and Asia. Certainly airport security will be heightened. Expect a return of sky marshalls on domestic flights. Read these two as an increase in your flight cost. Likely buildings like the WTC towers and the Sears Tower in Chicago will not be build in the future, now that it has been seen how vunerable they are. Damages are certainly to be in the billions. Even the construction of other buildings will be affected. Look at Building 7 in that complex. The bottom floors caught on fire and eventually the entire building, all 42 floors, collapsed onto itself. There may be prices increases, particular for fuel, if there is a temporary disruption between supply and demand.

When I spoke previously of airport security becoming lax, how long previously to yesterday was the last highjacking? Those running the scanner are paid minimum wages and, in my opinion, just give a cursury glance at the content of carry-on luggage. On the way back from Croatia I forgot to put my pocket knife in my suitcase. I just put it in the pan at the metal detector and it was handed back to me. On the way over I had a several hour layover at Frankfort, Germany so I wundered around the concourse area. One door to the outside was propped open to allow for deliveries to vendors there. I went and stood at the door for a while to enjoy the fresh air. No one paid me the least bit of notice. If weapons were smuggled in this way, there would be no further checks to anywhere in the world and I had already been through the detector in Nashville, TN. At least on the flight from Germany to Croatia, the cabin door wasn't even shut. Coming through customs at Dullas on the way back seemed to be a formality than any real control.

My guess is that every American will eventually feel the effects of this attack in their pocketbooks.

-- Ken S. in WC TN (scharabo@aol.com), September 12, 2001.


Yes, Ken, that is one thing I greive for. I know many people died, and I grieve for their families. I'm almost numb from the shock of the incredible loss of life here. However, I am grieving just as deeply over our children, as they will never know America as we knew it, before this happened. The greatest casualty will be our freedoms, I fear.

-- daffodyllady (daffodyllady@yahoo.com), September 12, 2001.

O.K. a bunch of you are missing the point .I don't think ANYONE is saying go bomb civialian sites .It would be military targets hit , always has been .And yes sometimes we miss.You are also missing that we plan to go after countries who harber and help these sick people .We as a country have shown we are weak and back down to easy.We need to show a strong united front and a strong military force to discourage this from happening again .I do not want to see inocent people killed ,I want the bastards responsible for this to die a horrible death .

-- Patty {NY State} (fodfarms@slic.com), September 12, 2001.

Most of what has been said in these posts regarding the horrible tradgy yesterday has been said in anger, hurt and feeling of being violated. In other words, we're re-acting. In my humble opinion, we need to act, NOT RE-ACT. I don't believe we should become trigger happy and attempt to "out shoot" those who are responsible.

Apparently, attempts on the lives of Bin Laden and other terrorist leaders have been made and failed, but the solution is to not completely wipe out a whole nation of people in an attempt to eliminate the problem. The local news has indicated that a terrorist cell has possibly been uncovered in New Jersey. Should we just nuke all of New Jersey to eliminate this cell? I don't think anyone would agree with that. What we need to do is to "out think" them. I don't believe our country is going to roll over and ignore this, but I would like to see realistic, thought out plans that would actually show results put into action.

One area that definitely needs a trememdous amount of attention is airport security. Some of the people responsible for gate security probably couldn't get a job at a burger joint and very few of them have much of a grip on the English language.

I agree action is needed but let's not go off half-cocked and make this terrible situation worse.

As American's we should show our support by flying our flag and donating blood.

Wishing you enough.

-- Trevilians (aka Dianne in Mass) (Trevilians@mediaone.net), September 12, 2001.


I agree Patty,but many on this thread are pacifists. Pacifists didn't help much when we had to deal with Hitler, and they won't help now. Perhaps we could avoid unnecessary loss of life if we put a 1 billion dollar bounty on the guilty person or persons head. If nothing else the guilty would never sleep again.

-- Del (dgrinolds@gvtel.com), September 12, 2001.

Del, you should re-consult your history books about how Uncle Sam became involved in a war with Hitler.

-- john hill (john@cnd.co.nz), September 12, 2001.

John, I fully understand how we became involved in WWII and Hitler. And it was a pacifist culture that kept us out almost to long and questioned our involvment throughout and after. The pacifists would have had us goose stepping.

-- Del Grinolds (dgrinolds@gvtel.com), September 12, 2001.

"He who forges his swords into plowshares ends up plowing someone else's fields." Source Unknown.

Even neutral countries like Sweden, New Zealand and Switzerland have military forces.

-- Ken S. in WC TN (scharabo@aol.com), September 12, 2001.


Sojo, what if someone harmed a member of your family in town, then ran to your nieghbors to hide out. Then, if that wasn't enough for them, they finally came on your property and harmed your son, then fled to the neighbors house to hide and all the while, the neighbor protected them. Wouldn't you be angry at the neighbot too?

-- Annie (mistletoe@kconline.com), September 12, 2001.

Ken,

How right you are. I still remember when I discovered, through reading, that Switzerland has a very strong military. They have a milita (citizens' army) instead of regular armed forces. At the age of 20, all Swiss men are required to begin military-training periods. Up until the age of 50 they can be called into service. Those not able to serve must pay a special tax. They must participate in shooting events during the year and they take their guns home with them. I just think that's all interesting.

-- Terry - NW Ohio (aunt_tm@hotmail.com), September 12, 2001.


I've been out of the loop her for almost 12 hrs and haven't ahd time to check the news except for what little blurbs i got on the way to and from work on the radio. I did hear though, and i will agree with Ken's comments about the security personnel and airports vs minimum wages after listening to a man comment about it yesteray. I DO think we need to ahve more sophiscated training for thos epersonnnel, after all, we entrust them with safety and lives. And this is an oversigh by the US govt, but then there ya go, we need to ahve more govt control? Thats another apple entirely. And, we did ge tlaxed as one commentator mentioned when we stopped putting air marshalls on board flights.

I have been thinking about this and have to say, we need to unite as a country and wake up and s,ell the coffee. We really NEED to look at where we are headed. by that I mean where are our youth headed? many, especially those in urban areas don't care abour education, don't even attend school, have to raise themselves, join gangs, etc. I would hope that this would at least spark a fire for our youth in this country, then this would not be in vain. this is a sensless tragedy to me so far and I don't know even we had laid down the best laid plans if we could have averted it. I say we need to get the respect back from our youth and folks in this country first. We have deteriorated so fast. We should challenge everyone to think about this and the ramifications for our futures.

Just my humble opinion.

Bernice

-- Bernice (geminigoats@yahoo.com), September 12, 2001.


I beg to differ, Del. Pacifists may not go out to the front lines and shoot, but we've always been more than willing to take care of things on the home front while everybody's at war, not to mention running hospitals, serving in the military fields that do not require violence (such as tactical support and administration - all very vital for the survival of warring soldiers) and other non-violent support processes. Many pacifists also toured with USO groups to help raise moral, despite their personal objections to the wars. Anyone who's old enough to remember will tell you the joy and hope that hese shows brought the soldiers in the field. Pacifists may not volunteer to shoot, but we do not shirk other honorable duties when called upon in times of war.

-- Soni (thomkilroy@hotmail.com), September 13, 2001.

I can't help but wonder if those that live far away from New York or the East Coast are somewhat detached from what has happened here. As people sit here and debate morality, I wonder if they'd be so confident in their views if they had lost people dear to their heart, as we have. While intellectual discussions about war, peace and religion are relevant and are an important part of the healing process, please know that many of us that are *living* the pain and suffering are just not ready or able to forgive.

I live 90 miles from NY City. My husband was a Wall St. investment banker for 15 years before he left the "rat race" to live in the country. My husband's best and dearest friend in the world worked for Kanter Fitzgerald on the 101st flood of Tower 2 of the WTC. He is dead. He leaves behind four children. It grieves me to see my husband in so much pain over the loss of his friend. My husband's friends who worked next door in the World Financial Center watched the Towers collapse as they ran uptown to 14th Street. One spent hours fearing that his son, who also worked in the WTC, was dead. He was lucky--the son worked on a low floor and got out. My husband can think of at least 25 former colleagues and acquaintances who are now dead....and I could go on.

I grieve so much for our friends and their families, for my heart- broken spouse, for the school children in my sister-in-law's class in Westchester County who are now parentless, for the firefighters and policemen/women who are dead, for the death of two beautiful buildings in a city I have always loved, for our country, and for the world. Life is never going to be the same.

-- amy (acook@in4web.com), September 13, 2001.


Amy,

I am sorry to hear of your loss. I cannot imagine the pain and anguish that folks are feeling as they learn loved ones have died. To answer your pondering about folks feeling or viewing events differently if they were not so far removed form the east coast: We were born and raised in western NYS. We moved in 93 to VA and then in May sold our farm and moved 1,000 miles away to Arkansas. I find that folks here are as concerned, however, I think for them that are from here they cannot relate to the magnitude because they ahve not perhaps been there and visually seen the Pentagon or NYC. but that is a subjection and speculation. i do find that its difficult for anyone who ahs not been there to fathom the extent of the impact. You would perhaps ahve to physically see the area to understand how far reaching it is. By that I mean location, etc. But overall, and i mean this, folks here I find do care and don't diminish the incident.

-- Bernice (geminigoats@yahoo.com), September 13, 2001.


Amy, I am so sorry for the losses your husband has endured. But, believe me, the rest of America feels your all's pain, too. There are prayer services being held all over Indiana, flags flying at half mast, and many homes are flying the flag as well, we're donating blood and anything else you all need. We're standing beside you all, through all of this. Please give your husband an extra hug for me.

-- Annie (mistletoe@kconline.com), September 13, 2001.

Amy, My family lives in Central Maryland about 60 miles from DC and about 30 miles from Camp David.

As close as we are don't really see any difference in daily life around here. Flags are popping up everywhere but I'm sure they are all over the nation as well. If we made a point of driving past a military base, we would surely see the difference there but they are not on our regular routes. There seem to be just as many military aircraft as usual.

The difference is in our hearts and minds. I cried when I first saw the film of the buildings colapsing Tuesday morning. I cried for all the people inside and their families and friends. I cried out of fear for the ramifications of these disasters and what it will mean for our country.

The difference will be in our decision making as well. We were to go to the National Zoo next week with some friends. We will not go now out of fear for our own safety.

With love and prayers (no offense, I hope) LBD, Maryland

-- LBD (lavenderbluedilly@hotmail.com), September 13, 2001.


Amy, you make a good point about detachment. While all of us are shocked and angry, I have picked up on some interesting things. People that I work with have made statements like ," I wish they could get back to normal programing"(TV) "I hope this doesn't ruin my trip next week." I think we have been so desensitized by the media that we don't let it effect us personaly. Especially for many who have never been to NY and Washington.

-- Del (dgrinolds@gvtel.com), September 15, 2001.

I can't turn the TV off of CNN. If I try to watch something else for a minute, I feel guilty. I've had the big screen on CNN or FOXnews since it happened. I need to know what is going on, hoping for someone to be found and hearing about the investigation. I feel like I'm not "with them" if I change the channel. I havn't even watched the local news since it happened.

-- Cindy in KY (solidrockranch@msn.com), September 15, 2001.

Amy,

I live in the South, and am about as Southern as you get. We down here feel just as badly for New Yorkers, Washingtonians, and those who were trapped on the planes as the rest of the nation. Most folks down here have the attitude of: "even though Y'all are yankees - you're our yankees." What I am trying to say is that we look at this as anyone who has family would. Families may fight within the family, but the whole family comes together when an outsider tries the same thing. I have been to the WTC, had dinner in the Windows of the World restaurant and was amazed at the view. I was also amazed at how many people we could put in one place (originally coming from a town which only had 1,000 folks). I also think that some people will always be insensitive and perhaps they are the ones who need help dealing with this. People want normalcy as the overwhelming media coverage hasn't allowed time for people to absorb what has happened. I guess it may be more than some folks can bare. We haven't had to deal much with terrorism over here compared to other countries, most of us have never been involved in a war (talking about the younger ones). And now we have this new kind of war, where we can't see the enemy, or it's tanks, or it's organization. But yes, down here in the South we feel very anxious, compassionate and would like to do anything we can to help. In my town there was a blood drive set up - and there were so many people who went to donate that we overwhelmed the Red Cross and they had to turn people away. Now the Red Cross will set up a second blood drive next week, to accommodate those who tried to give and couldn't the first time. There are people crying, people wearing red, white and blue, and more flags flying than I have ever seen. And people are trying to talk and make sense out of this. We are praying for the victims and their families, hoping that somehow, one more survivor will be pulled out of the buildings. We are collecting money, and supplies to send up. All this is being done by Americans everywhere to try to help our extended family. Our actions will never replace the pain you and your husband feel at this time, but we sincerely hope that by coming together to share the physical and emotional burdens, that you will take comfort in knowing we stand with you during this hard time. Our thoughts and prayers are with you, Cindy

-- Cindy (colawson@mindspring.com), September 15, 2001.


Amy, So sorry for you loss, and as others have said, you are not alone in your intense grief. The debates over religion and tolerance etc. etc. seem terribly out of place to me also, but I try to remember that people all cope in different ways. Everywhere I have been here in Michigan I see people crying for what has been lost here, which IMHO is just the very tip of what we have and will lose as a result of this event.

My sons and son-in-laws are all in uniform of some type; police, fire or military. My grandchildren are all being sheilded to the best of our ability from this event, but are in a state of fear and trauma none-the-less. I started a thread on post tramatic stress syndrome and wish that I had not. We have so many "experts" on this forum that would tell you how you should feel, worship or not worship. "Back seat drivers" and "grandstand quarterbacks" are a dime a dozen.

My prayers go out to you and to the millions of others in our great country that will survive this and walk through the pain.

-- diane (gardiacaprines@yahoo.com), September 15, 2001.


A little thought would show that those who want "everything to go back to normal" and don't want this to "ruin their trip" will show that although their comments and expressions are insensitive, they are not. The very fact that things AREN'T normal is scaring the piss out of them and they are afraid and fear what may happen next and are overwhelmed by the scale of what has already happened. Every day that goes by without regular programming and normal travel is another giant whomp in the gut of a people who haven't had their lives disrupted this badly before in their personal lifetimes. Think about it - most of these people were, like myself, to young to remember the Vietnam era, and the Gulf War was "over there" and you could watch Seinfeld in any case.

These people are the ones who need the help of those of us who aren't greiving for personal losses. Those who have lost loved ones need to grieve and those of us who are here to help can do so by deflecting the "insensitive" behavior of others who are afraid and hurt by the change in their safe and comfortable worlds, like a neighbor helps deal with a scared and angry child when a family member dies, the child who goes around demanding his dinner and wanting everyone to stop crying and get back to normal. The fact that things aren't normal and won't be for some time is just too frightening to consider for some people.

-- Soni (thomkilroy@hotmail.com), September 15, 2001.


Thanks, all, for the kind words and support. I agree that people cope in different ways. Wishing for normalcy is indeed a coping mechanism.

We have been keeping busy in order to deal with the stress and emptiness we feel. We split two cords of wood today and my husband is now cleaning out the barn. We are trying hard to avoid the "talking heads" of CNN and Fox Cable. I guess we are seeking out some normalcy, trying to carry on.

-- amy (acook@in4web.com), September 15, 2001.


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