H&MD hits home and now I am scared

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Ok I do not know if I should panick or remain calm. Let me start from around 1 pm today,my Brother-in-law stops by to say hi and take the girls to lunch,no big deal. We are chit-chatting while I am showing him all the new babies,he then mentions H&MD,then adds he just got back from England and was talking to farmers about it. Well I almost died then and there! I said something to the point of what the HE-- are you talking about! He was over there for 3 weeks with a maryland based company studing something or another,he then said he spent alot of time talking to farmers about the problems and livestock killing,he got back last night! I started to freak and scream that he could be breathing it all over my animals and told him to get the hell off the farm,he said he did not know people could carry it! Ok I panicked called the vet and told her not to come here for a sick calf I have,she agreed that it would be best to stay away,what now? how long to I sit and wait? what would you do if you were me? please help,i feel like this is the end for us,I know the chance is slim but I cant shake the feeling. Why does our country allow travel over there? My B-i-l is not a moran but he did not even know he could carry it! do we not warn people at the airports? I am so tring to remain undercontrol but I cant

-- renee oneill{md.} (oneillsr@home.com), April 02, 2001


Renee , did he have the same shoes on ? Was he on affected farms ? Where his shoes infected ? Find out how long the incubation period is .And calm down now ! Do not mention this to anyone else near by , keep it to yourself for awhile .

-- Patty {NY State} (fodfarms@slic.com), April 02, 2001.

Patty, mum is the word around here! I wont dare say anything to anyone or call any agency either. He said his shoes were cleaned but get this only the ones on his feet not the ones in his suit case DUH!!! He was not at farms but bars w/ local farmers who do /did have it at there places,i swear my husbands family needs to go.

-- renee oneill{md.} (oneillsr@home.com), April 02, 2001.

First off..... Don't panick!!! You will not be able to think clearly.

Second, watch your stock.

I wouldn't tell anyone unless they start showing signs, but watch very, very closely. If they do show signs.... I have to say.... call the vet immediately!!

I was the one that started all the questions on this, so I feel kind of responsible here.... Having had Ken and Vicki help me with their research, and doing some on my own, here is what I think:

While FMD will not kill the animals, it will render them useless for production and for breeding. It would be better to let the government reimburse you than to keep the animals. Because of all the ways this thing can spread, I have to say that - were it me - I would report this at the first sign of trouble.

As for your brother... I am sorry... I can't see how, if he was talking to all these folks that are already involved, he could have missed the point, either. But, he aparently did, so, please try to forgive him....

-- Sue Diederich (willow666@rocketmail.com), April 02, 2001.

Deep breaths...again...Okay. You already told your vet, right? Mum is not the word anymore. Just relax and call Bil and ask him which shoes he was wearing in the bars and at your house. Then YOU take precautions. Change your shoes at the end of the drive and put plastic on the floorboards and leave it at the end of the drive. If it's as virulent as everyone says there are bound to be occurences here for just the reasons you listed. If it happens...I don't know what you'll do, but praying isn't out of line...that's what I'd do:) No offense intended there. Incubation can take some time from what I understand. Research it. I know I need to. Take care and please stay calm. Best wishes.

-- Doreen (animalwaitress@excite.com), April 02, 2001.


I've been reading the USDA site to try to understand how contagious this is. It sounds like that if your B-I-L showered and put on clean clothes and shoes before coming over you should be ok. Customs is supposed to ask if you have visited a farm or been around livestock . Go read their site, it has alot of info concerning incubation times,etc. To be on the safe side don't let him come back for 5 days. usda

-- nobrabbit (conlane@prodigy.net), April 02, 2001.

This has been my biggest fear also. I am already a freak about knowing who has what stock before they go into my pens. Some folks who visit I simply only let look at the goats, moving the for sale animals into a sale pen. And that's only because of CL.

Now this. I would also be watching my stock very carefully. If he didn't go out to the pens and pick up a baby and breath directly into thier face, I would GUESS that you will be fine. You will be watching for soremouth type symptoms in the mouth, and on the tongue. You would also see limping before you will see the lesions around the corenary band (where the meat of the leg, meets the hoof).

I have taken photos of all my does and bucks, having the animals and their semen insured. I was embarrassed to even bring this up on this list, and also to my insurance agent. Much to my surprise I am far from the first person to do this locally (and remember locally is between a town of 5,000 and 1,000, oddly all I have to do is bring in 3 other sales lists with animals with similar pedigree, even downloaded from internet sites are fine. Anybody else going to insure their stock? Fair market value of $35 to $50 a goat wouldn't even begin to pay for my stocks paperwork. Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh TX (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), April 02, 2001.

I agree with the others, just stay calm, and be carefull. I don't see how anyone could NOT have known about spreading it, and I don't understand about the lack of knowledge at the airports. How many other people did he visit, and do they have animals? We will all help research some more. I've been reading all the articles I can find every day, and it seems to change day by day. Hang in there Renee.

-- Cindy in Ky (solidrockranch@hotmail.com), April 02, 2001.


I'm with the others. Don't panic. From my reading if he had direct exposure to an infected animals - which is virtually nose to nose - he might be a carrier for about 24-hours. On his footwear, the virus is fairly easily killed, even through drying out on the way home. Rather than being a personal carrier, I would be more concerned about some unprocessed meat or dairy product he might have smuggled through customs. Unless your B-in-L is a complete idiot, he had to have seen the F&MD signs at the airport. Hey, it is a good excuse to ban your in-laws from your place for a while.

Susceptibility period is up to two weeks.

On the vet treating your calf's naval hernia, it's your call. As long as he can pee normally repairing it can be delayed for a couple of weeks. If it is causing a urinary blockage, then he may die through neglect.

Someone earlier on the forum said they had refused to attend a wedding in which relatives from Britian were also to attend. At the time I thought it a bit extreme, but now don't. On my upcoming trip to Europe, I will take all practical steps, including staying away from my cattle herd for a least a week upon return.

-- Ken S. in WC TN (scharabo@aol.com), April 02, 2001.

Renee, Your BiL told you this on April 1, right? You might want to call him up and see if he's still laughing. Hope that's the case.

-- David C (fleece@eritter.net), April 03, 2001.

Here's some things I found:

Disinfectants: Inactivated by sodium hydroxide (2%), sodium carbonate (4%), and citric acid (0.2%). Resistant to iodophores, quaternary ammonium compounds, hypoclorite and phenol, especially in the presence of organic matter

-- Cindy in Ky (solidrockranch@hotmail.com), April 03, 2001.

We all knew it was only a matter of time. Not that your brother-in- law brought anything back. But multiply him by all the un-informed folks traveling the world and someone will. He probably did all that he was told to do, and unless he was in areas where there were infected herds shouldn't be carrying anything in his throat. Welcome to the world of global travel and the "one world" philosophy. I'll pray for you and your animals.....there's very little chance of transmission.....but I understand your panic. Try to calm down and remain vigilant for the period your vet suggests. Things will work out.

-- Bear (bearwaoman@Yahoo.com), April 03, 2001.

I recently began a new discussion group at yahoogroups to discuss the recent situation with FMD. For anyone interested in joining here is the addy to the group. I hope to see you there.

Bernice here is the addy:



Not sure if this is our Bernice or not, but I thought this would be a great place to learn more. Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh TX (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), April 03, 2001.

Yep, it twas me...... I figured it might be interesting to have a discussion group, i looked and didn't see any so i figured, "Why not?"

-- Bernice (geminigoats@yahoo.com), April 03, 2001.

Was at our annual livestock shipping association meeting just last night. H&MD was discussed - they said the bug can live in the nasal passageways of humans for several days. If he got it over there, and sneezed around your animals, he could transmit to your cattle.

If I were you, I'd quarantine the place for two weeks and watch your cattle closely. WHATEVER you do, KEEP QUIET about it!!! The last thing we need is the media getting ahold of something like this and starting a panic!

-- Thomas Langan (thomas@langan.org), April 05, 2001.


Is your stock still doing okay?

-- Deborah (bearwaoman@Yahoo.com), April 17, 2001.

Bump. Renee, any word?

-- Cash (cash@andcarry.com), April 17, 2001.

I found this news item 'along the way' and thought it appropriate (or maybe not...)


-- j (jw_hsv@yahoo.com), April 18, 2001.

Does Renee post here anymore? Does anyone know if she's active on another thread here or another forum? Starting to get worried. In this case I'm not thinking no news is good news.

-- Cash (cash@andcarry.com), April 19, 2001.

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