Would appreciate info from people that know which generators are the best to power the whole farmstead and have enough left over to sell back on the grid.

-- Mike (mbliss@net-port.com), March 09, 2001

Answers

What is you average and maximum power usage per month? How much over the maximum (for future expansion) do you want to sell back?

-- Lynn Goltz (lynngoltz@aol.com), March 09, 2001.

Lynn, Sorry don't have much info, am checking for other party. But do know the place is heated by elect. and barns have lots of lights and heated waterers. They pay about $300/mo. Thanks..

-- Mike (mbliss@net-port.com), March 09, 2001.

Without knowing your electricity usage and if you're not going to build your own, I'd have to say generally that the Bergy XL 10 KW wind turbine is about the best on the market. Its efficient, mechanically very simple (only 3 moving parts) and extremely reliable.

They're a little spendy up front but if you consider that the lifespan of their machines is around 20 years the cost/kilowatt-hour is very low, and if you actually manage to sell back to the grid you can make money on the deal. Thats assuming that the net metering laws in your state arent the nasty mess they are in most parts of the country though.

Hope it helps

Dave

-- Dave (Ak) (daveh@ecosse.net), March 09, 2001.

There are alot of variables involved here but off hand, if their electric bill is now $300/mo I'd have to say they're gonna need a helluva wind generator just to meet their needs, let alone sell any back to the grid. 50-75 kw would be a wild guess and thats almost small commercial size.

-- john leake (natlivent@pcpros.net), March 09, 2001.

I agree with John, it's going to take one heck of a generator. Basically electric heating is done with a dead short unless you are speaking of electric heat via a heat pump. The waterer heaters would be like a short.

Work backwards. With a bill of $300, if paying 8 cents per KWH, that would give a consumption of 3750 KWH, which would be 3,750,000 watts. Over a thirty day period that would be 125,000 watts per day. If you figure that wind only blows 6 or so hours while the sun is up helping to create currents, that would be 20,833 watts, or 20.83 kilowatts. Figuring 100 percent efficiency would require nearly a 21 KW unit, and to sell any at all back----well like John said, it would take one heck of a unit.

Now of course that is if my thinking in not flawed, which it may well be. Any of you feel free to set me straight.

-- Notforprint (Not@thekeyboard.com), March 09, 2001.

Yup, after it is all said and done you will have a BIG windmill and a BIG battery bank. Cost will be $40-50K. Of course with a unit this big you will need a large steady prevailing wind to provide all the needed power.

-- Lynn Goltz (lynngoltz@aol.com), March 10, 2001.

Notforprint: I checked your numbers and you're right---about twenty kw providing the assumptions are in the ball park. I remember seeing a 20KW jacobs complete with tower a while back in homepower mag for $17500, but that was some time back.

-- john leake (natlivent@pcpros.net), March 10, 2001.

The 20KW number looks good, but it should be noted that that is an AVERAGE usage. There will be times the usage was almost zero and times when it was much higher than 20KW. To cover the requirements you probably would need a 30KW generator and use load controllers to limit maximum usage. This would also satisfy your requirement of power to sell back to the grid when it was very windy. You would still need batteries and inverters to cover the times of little or not enough wind. You are talking of a BIG complex installation.

This is why most alternative power plans never get off the drawing board -- the scope is too large. A suggestion would be to start small, say 3-5KW and build from there as you gain experience. Forget about selling back to the grid (not cost effective) and use the grid as your battery. Interconnected to the grid like this would require professional design (if done wrong you can kill someone) and perhaps installation.

-- Lynn Goltz (lynngoltz@aol.com), March 11, 2001.

Hi,

Before spending money on anything, I'd recommend spending the money on the CD-ROM over at www.homepower.com. Buy 'em all. Then start reading the reviews and articles on wind gennies and make up your mind accordingly. If you're going to spend enough money to buy or build a system to power your entire farmstead, then the $100 or so dollars on the CD-ROM will be a _very_ worthwhile investment.

Just a thought...

j

-- j (jw_hsv@yahoo.com), March 11, 2001.

We have an old 32 volt dc Jacobs generator from the 1930's or 40's that we rebuilt in the 1970's and used for 12 years to power our home, then we moved and it is in use again, working well, and should last until it is actually damaged by something other than regular use. Of course, it isn't large enough to run a modern"energy hog" home, but the later large Jacobs generators were pretty reliable, and so are the large Bergeys. Other brands are either smaller, larger, or of unknown reliability.

Jim

-- Jim (jiminwis@yahoo.com), March 12, 2001.

Thanks for all the help. The place will have to be made energy efficent before the wind generator is installed. Trying to estimate the cost of everything before they buy.

-- MIke (mbliss@net-port.com), March 14, 2001.

The other thing is also to look at where the KW are going. Can more energy effecient products/appliances be used? Also we directly run dc on lights etc rather than losing some power running through inverters. PS. We are not off grid but slowly changing certain areas over.

-- Terri in NS (terri@tallships.ca), March 15, 2001.

Mike, You can pretty much bet you can not make a profit selling electric back to the grid. Depending on your electric company and state laws you might not even be able to. If you can you will usually find that you need a lot of monitoring and meetering equipment to feed power back. You dont (at least legally) just connect your power to the grid. The high cost of the require hardware and the fact that the electric company pays bulk prices usually means you dont make any money.

As for the best wind generator, you need to determine if wind is even an option for you. How much wind is avaiable on a daily basis. Many small generator require a 7mph hr wind just to start. Once started 3-5mph is needed. http://www.homepower.com/windmap.htm has some maps with wind averages. The south has little wind, midwest and costal area have better wind patterns.

good luck

-- gary (gws@redbird.net), March 16, 2001.

If you can wait a couple of months, I should be able to supply you with a solid state (no moving parts) wind generator that would cost 5% of the next least expensive system on the market.

-- Paul Clint (smithja@sisna.com), April 03, 2001.