What can one say about American political debate? Americans are arguing about the spice in the paella while others are starving. Bush is not a facist like Pinochet. Gore is not a communist like Castro. Despite all the rhetoric, America has no secret police, no death squads, no opposition members assasinated or disappearing in the night, no suppression of speech. To borrow a phrase, perhaps your debate is so bitter because the stakes are so small.

The are countries where people are fighting and dying for basic human rights. America squabbles over an election where only half of the people voted. There are places where elections, real elections, are a distant oasis in a totalitarian desert.

Much of the world admires America but despises Americans. I do not know that this is justified, but I can understand why some people say that America is a better country than Americans deserve.

Why not rejoice that you have a new leader without bloodshed? Reading this bulletin board, I would think the Supreme Court commanded tanks and soldiers. Why not marvel at the miracles of peace and prosperity? A full belly and a quiet street should make a person grateful, even gracious.

-- Jose Ortega y Gasset (j_ortega_y_gasset@hotmail.com), January 25, 2001

Answers

It is'nt lunch time yet Ken Decker.

-- (My civil @ servant.doesn't act like this), January 25, 2001.

JOSE' most americans are=spoiled & blind!!! and most of all=proud-------the modern-romans-before the =FALL!

IMMORALITY-ALWAY'S PRECED'S JUGMENT!!

-- al-d (dogs@zianet.com), January 25, 2001.

Is this a compliment or a criticism?

Forgive me, but I think the punctuation of a contraction should substitute for the missing letters. Is not becomes isn't. For one who knows my identity and dinner hour so well, a simple rule of grammar should pose no problem.

-- Jose Ortega y Gasset (j_ortega_y_gasset@hotmail.com), January 25, 2001.

JOSE' most americans are=spoiled & blind!!! and most of all=proud-------the modern-romans-before the =FALL!

IMMORALITY-ALWAY'S PRECEDE'S JUDGMENT!!

-- al-d (dogs@zianet.com), January 25, 2001.

Ken Decker, coming back under a fake handle doe'snt become you. It fits your personality, but it doe'snt become you. What time is your lunch time anyway? It must be 11:00 to 12:00 because thats what time you posted. We had a chance to get rid of you and blew it.

-- (My civil @ servants do'nt act like .this), January 25, 2001.

J.O.G,

A term I am partial to is living in a fish bowl. Special mention to the Pink Floyd lyrics: "Two lost souls swimming in a fish bowl, year after year...".

We all construct and deconstruct our personal fish bowls regularly. We make repairs, expand them to include new friends, enlarge them to include larger concepts and contract them - a circling of the wagons - whenever we feel threatened.

Our fish bowls provide a certain measure of security for our psyches. They allow for each of us to better handle the incredible complexity this life dangles over us like a sixteen ton weight (borrowed from Monty Python) ever threatening our bodies, our principles, our livelihoods, our toys, our relationships, our standard of living. You see, each of us is but a few seconds, a few inches away from death at any given moment in time. This state of affairs would be entirely overwhelming if it were not for our fish bowls.

We are inundated with information of varying quality. We are subject to whims and emotional outpourings from those around us. We are pelted with government regulations which no one person could possibly hope to understand. Our spirits are housed in fragile shells which require regular feeding, shelter from the elements, sleep.

My point is that it is understandable to me that we lose sight of conditions outside our respective fish bowls. I thank you for stating your views. I appreciate having my fish bowl jostled once in a while. You've provided that wake-up shake with passion and civility.

-- Rich (howe9@shentel.net), January 25, 2001.

Jose- Well said. Really puts things into perspective.

To borrow a phrase, perhaps your debate is so bitter because the stakes are so small.

I've not heard that phrase before. How fitting.

(BTW - Love your Ortega Roasted Garlic Salsa Prima!)

Rich- Re: Living in a fishbowl... excellent post!

-- CD (costavike@hotmail.com), January 25, 2001.

Welcome, Jose.

If I read you aright, you are more or less saying that we should all stop arguing about politics and be grateful instead. While this sounds very reasonable, it strikes me as a false dichotomy. Participation in a political debate does not imply or require ingratitude for one's full belly and quiet street. Both are possible at once.

I quite agree that such a debate could be carried on more graciously than at present. But that is a seperate issue. The disagreements reflected in the ongoing debate are real enough. Folding one's hands and sitting quietly will not make those disagreements any the less. Politics, by their nature, strike sparks of passion and inspire factions to form and clash. When has it ever been otherwise?

If you had entitled this thread "The Ungracious Bush-Gore Debate", I would not quibble with your point. But it is one thing to say we debate our differences in a foolish manner, and quite another to say we are fools because we debate our differences.

-- Miserable SOB (misery@misery.com), January 25, 2001.

M-SOB wrote: If I read you aright, you are more or less saying that we should all stop arguing about politics and be grateful instead.

My take on Jose's piece is that our lack of gratitude, our inability as a people to truly understand how great we have it here in comparison to much of the world serves us as a blinder does a race horse. The race horse is served well in that it must run for but a few minutes and a mile or so in order to complete the race. Our track is considerably longer in time and distance to the finish.

We are ill-served by our blinders when they shut out from our consciousness even a grain of perspective on the human condition. Our thoughts, words and deeds often grossly distort the reality of our situation as individuals, a society and a species. Failure to acknowledge the bounty we share each day, and the unique success which is this republic is a common mistake, IMO.

Gratitude brings with it a certain mellowing, a softening of the passions for harsh disagreement and the general negativity which seeps into every crack and crevice of our beings like molten lava flowing down the sides of a newly-active volcano, laying waste to all in its path.

I would argue that much of the political debate of the past few months has looked to me both foolish AND ungracious. I have chosen not to engage in it myself. But some folks enjoy tossing barbs, calling names, rubbing noses into verbal piles of shit. To each his own.

-- Rich (howe9@shentel.net), January 25, 2001.

Rich, I can't agree with you that Americans are unable "as a people to truly understand how great we have it here in comparison to much of the world". I think a very considerable number of us know that we are among the fortunate few just by living here.

What you and Jose seem to suggest is that the fact there is lingering dissatisfaction over the resolution of the recent election, or vocal opposition to the policies of the new administration can somehow be taken as evidence that Americans are a foolish, 'blinded' and ungrateful people.

If the connection you Jose draw were true, real and substantial, then the corollary would be that if political discourse in the USA became a steady murmur of rejoicing and complacency then it would prove we are a wise, visionary and grateful people.

I don't know about that. This whole discussion seems to me a bit like being told to eat my mush and be happy because there are starving children in a foreign country. That is pious nonsense. Children know that instinctively. They know that mush is mush. It is as good as mush is and no better. It is much better than starving. No one would deny that. But it doesn't matter how many children starve in Africa, that fact can't turn mush into ice cream. It will always be mush.

-- Miserable SOB (misery@misery.com), January 25, 2001.

You honor me with the eloquence of your responses. I do not suggest the problems of America are trivial. In reading some of the arguments, however, I am surprised by the hysteria. A casual observer might think Bush was going to unleash a wave of pogroms against the Democrats.

One might think a country so blessed with peace and prosperity would debate issues with more grace. After all, you are not fighting for the right to live, vote, speak or assemble. You are quibbling for preferences, a few dollars less in taxes or a few more public programs. Most of the world would enjoy this luxury.

If you were standing next to a group of starving children, would you scream profanities if your steak was not cooked enough?

-- Jose Ortega y Gasset (j_ortega_y_gasset@hotmail.com), January 25, 2001.

Most Americans know little of international events. Foreigners are drawn as cartoons; other nations treated like theme parks. Americans do not think they act like they are spoiled, but ask the residents of other nations how they feel about touristas. Most Americans do not understand the gap between the wealthy nations of the world and the poor. They have no reference for mass starvation, despotism, genocide, political upheaval, civil warfare... and they show little concern about these ills in the rest of the world.

I do not say Americans should not argue about politics, but instead I say Americans should have perspective. A free people can never be complacent, but they need not be hysterical or full of hate.

You can complain about your mush, but you will seem ungrateful and uncivilized if you complain bitterly if you are the only with anything to eat.

-- Jose Ortega y Gasset (j_ortega_y_gasset@hotmail.com), January 25, 2001.

"A free people can never be complacent, but they need not be hysterical or full of hate."

I can accept this as a truism. The question then becomes one of perception.

As I go about my daily life, I see few or no signs of hysteria and hate in the Real World, as opposed to the cockeyed world of the Internet or the electronic media. The very peacefulness you earlier claimed we do not sufficiently rejoice in is also pretty conclusive evidence that the country is not overcome with hysteria and filled with hate.

I recall the Sixties well enough to know our country is at peace and fairly calm, all things considered. Things were hopping back then. It was tense. No comparison to today.

-- Miserable SOB (misery@misery.com), January 25, 2001.

Jose,

Most Americans do not much care about the opinions of dead Spanish philosophers. Most of us only care that the power stays on long enough to see if Ali McBeal gets laid tonite. Ask the man on the street who "you" are and I doubt that 1 in 100 could answer correctly.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), January 25, 2001.

Make that 1 in 1000.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), January 25, 2001.

M-SOB, your reference to the Sixties is a good one and I too witness no hysteria of such scale in those around me IRL. Perhaps the hysteria Jose refers to was that which he read on this board and others. I would unequivocally call a goodly portion of the political posts I've read over the last several months hysterical in nature. At the very least I've witnessed much posturing and divisiveness stemming from blinding, raging partisanship. Perhaps it is easier for me to see than some because I hold no allegiance to any political party. Perhaps I am hallucinating. Call it as you see it.

The results of your proposed corollary, BTW, is not at all what I am driving at. I don't experience gratitude as explosively as all that! (And I thought I was a champion at using hyperbole!) :)

Instead, gratitude is a cornerstone to be built upon, a builder of inner calm. A solid foundation from which to go out into the world each day with a greater sense of compassion & a stronger sense of security. I'm far less likely to build walls between myself and others when in this state because I am more likely to feel connected to others rather than disconnected. And this is the main thrust of my comments. When time and again we look to adopt an Us vs. Them attitude we create an environment which is distasteful, unbalanced, negative and serves to separate us as a people rather than unite us.

As Americans we have a duty to speak out, to use our freedom of expression, to participate in selecting our representatives. Pick your battles and fight hard. I simply suggest Jose has brought valid points to our attention and once again I gently try to nudge, nudge people to consider that which so often goes overlooked in this land of plenty.

-- Rich (howe9@shentel.net), January 25, 2001.

OK, I'll play the straight guy here- Who is/was Jose Ortega y Gasset?

-- Sam (wtrmkr52@aol.com), January 25, 2001.

Jose Ortega y Gasset is probably one of the best known Humanist philosophers even in the English speaking world.Revolt of the Masses, was written during the early uprisings which led to the Spanish Civil War. This work predicted that increasingly authoritarian regimes would lead to revolution that would either succeed or end in the tragedy of fascism.He was a supporter of the Republic against the Monarchy and the Fascists.

-- American (with@high.standards), January 25, 2001.

Yeah I know American but for today's Jose;

You miss the point of a successful democracy. Namely that the fight over whatever, however insignificant goes on. Every day, every hour & every minute and most importantly that the fight is a normal course of events and proceeds without government interrtuption. THAT my friend is democracy.

-- Carlos (riffraff@cybertime.net), January 25, 2001.

Democracy, undisciplined and unrestricted, will end in Dictatorship.

-- American (with@high.standards), January 26, 2001.

American, who do you propose be in charge of discipline? What sort of restrictions did you have in mind and who will they benefit most?

-- Miserable SOB (misery@misery.com), January 26, 2001.

The Gore-Bush debate is foolish because when increasingly authoritarian regimes will lead to revolution and that will either succeed or end in the tragedy of fascism. We must be supporters of the Republic against the Monarchy and the Fascists. This can only be done by Libertarians. The flap-jawing of the other parties will not and cannot keep this country free to enjoy the gains of unrestricted Capitalism.

-- Don Jose Ortega y Gasset (don j ortega y gasset@hotmail.com), January 26, 2001.