I am trying to get a really brown/black look in my shadows like most older prints that I have seen. I use selenium mostly so I have no idea what to expect with these. I tried kodak poly toner 1+9 and it looks too cool so I am going to up the solution, however I was wondering if anyone else gets a bunch of insoluble crap in the solution when they use it? Also what is the shelf life of the working solotion?

thanks rwb

-- Robert W Boyer (rboyer@mindspring.com), October 22, 2000

Answers

Response to Brown/Poly toning help

For the tones you are seeking, I suggest sepia toner. Kodak makes a pre-packaged kit for 1 quart, and the formula is readily available.

This is a "bleach and redevelop" process. For dark tones that are fully brown, you bleach until the image disappears entirely. For brown-black shadows and brown only highlights, you don't bleach fully.

I like the fully bleached images better than partially bleached.

Your prints need to be darker than normal, as you loose density in this process, unlike selenium where you gain density.

The bleach in this process seems to wear out quickly, but it's just a potassium ferricyanide solution, so if you like the toner it's more economical to fix from formula. The Kodak mix, however, is a cheap and easy way to try it to see if it's for you.

-- Charlie Strack (charlie_strack@sti.com), October 23, 2000.

Response to Brown/Poly toning help

Polysuplhide is just one toner formula. Use thiourea (or thiocarbamide) toner for varying tones. This toner can be controlled to give a wide range of tones between yellow and deep brown.

Toner formula aside, toning results also vary when you use different papers.

While it's a good idea to make the print a little darker if you intend to tone it, for a really antique look, Hicks and Schultz, in their book on monochrome, suggest to keep the print a little lighter and harder before toning. You may have to experiment a little to get the look that is most pleasing to you.

The bleach-and-redevelopment sepia toner is actually a solution of sodium sulphide, the bleach is ferri plus potassium bromide. If you are interested, I will look up quantities in one of my books.

Interesting effects will also result from split toning in selenium and sepia. Selenium will tone the dark areas first, while sepia eats itself down the tonal scale from the highlight end.

-- Thomas Wollstein (thomas_wollstein@web.de), October 24, 2000.

Response to Brown/Poly toning help

Hi Robert,

I work with Poly-Toner a lot. It does not give me [Ilford MG paper] the dark brown tones it talks about on the label. So, I use it very diluted, and get a reddish/brown cast, that varies with the density of the print.

I am still working on a bottle I bought about six years ago, and the working solution seems to last 'forever' also. Have not run into having insoluble stuff in the solution - the water used probably has a lot to do with that.

There is a lot of good toning info in Eddie Ephraums book: GRADIENT LIGHT [The art and craft of using variable contrast paper.

I have a friend who is banging his head against the wall trying to get those brown tones you are talking about.

The other day he saw one of my prints and said, 'that's what I have been looking for.' Problem is, I did that one on the computer.

I think the above posts have good inf. & you might also try using warm tone paper & toning.

chris

-- Christian Harkness (chris.harkness@eudoramail.com), October 24, 2000.

Response to Brown/Poly toning help

Hi Robert, The sepia toner I use is a 'hand me down '....from the early days of photography. It yields a true sepia tone and is very, very fast....with fresh stock at 20C ( 69F ) less than 30sec for each bath. You can cool the tone down by using less potassium bromide in the toner ( more if you want a warmer tone color etc ). The stocks are reuseable ie...don't dilute them as a 1 shot + don't forget to wash the bleach out before you tone ( I do know photographers who don't!!!! )

A...Bleach potassium ferricyanide 50gm, potassium bromide 10gm, water to 1 liter. B...Toner thiourea 5gm, potassium bromide 40gm, sodium hydroxide 15gm, water to 1 liter.

Cheers, Peter Dinnan.

-- Peter Dinnan (pral@paradise.net.nz), October 25, 2000.