http://www.canoe.ca/CNEWSTopNews/passenger_sep21-ap.html

Thursday, September 21, 2000

Passengers blamed for death

SALT LAKE CITY (AP) -- The FBI wants to interview a Canadian man who says he tried to stop passengers on a Southwest Airlines flight from beating to death a man who had tried to break into the cockpit.

An autopsy report released last week said Jonathan Burton was killed by passengers who tried to restrain him after he kicked in the cockpit door on a Southwest Airlines flight Aug. 11. The U.S. Attorney's office, said the 19-year-old's death was unintentional and that criminal charges would not be filed.

The passenger sought by the FBI, Dean Harvey, told the Edmonton Journal that a large man climbed on a seat and repeatedly jumped on Burton's chest while four men held him still.

"I asked him to stop," Harvey told the paper. "I said, 'You've got the guy subdued, what more do you want? You don't have to pound his head in.' The guy was being held with his arms outstretched. He had no chance to absorb the shock."

FBI agents said they want to interview Harvey, who contacted the Edmonton newspaper after reading about the autopsy results. Harvey, his wife and 11-month-old son were traveling from Las Vegas to Salt Lake City when Burton became combative 20 minutes before Flight 1763 was due to land.

"We weren't able to locate him before now," said Bill Matthews, special agent for the FBI's Salt Lake City division. "We were trying to interview everyone on the flight, but there were some people on the manifest where all we had was the name."

-- viewer (justp@ssing.by), September 21, 2000

Answers

So one crazy guy tried to crash the airplane -- logical conclusion if he had reached the pilot -- and another crazy guy killed him. Crazy guy number 1 just got unlucky enough to run into crazy guy number 2 when he did. Bernie Goetz all over again.

-- helen (b@r.d), September 21, 2000.

I have no pity for the fool. If I am on a plane and you are trying to break into the cockpit, risking MY life, I may very well lose control and mess you up, tough shit on you. Stay in your frickin seat and you will be fine.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), September 22, 2000.

Bernie Goetz all over again.

There's a name I'd hoped never to hear/read about again. An already bad morning made even worse. Strapping on the safety harness, this one's gonna be a pisser.

There's excessive force involved here it seems. Kicking a guy's ass into submission is one thing. An accidental blow to the wrong spot on the body can cause death. Jumping repeatedly on a person's chest while they are pinned down is not the act of a person in control of hmself. While I can understand the reflex to snuff the threat, social contract dictates capital punishment should not be dealt out without a trial by jury. IMO, of course.

Rich

-- Bingo1 (howe9@shentel.net), September 22, 2000.

I agree with Bingo on this one (will someone please pass Bingo the smelling salts?). Restraint is good, continuing to pound someone while they're down is assault. I think at a minmum Mr. Attack Butt should be charge with man slaughter.

I thought of Bernie Goetz, too. I also thought of the assasination of Harvey Milk, the first gay city councilman of San Francisco. The man he defeated used a revolver and shot the current mayor three times, then shot Milk six times (meaning he had to reload). He got off with only two years because he said that low blood sugar made him do it. They called it "the candy bar defense".

-- Tarzan the Ape Man (tarzan@swingingthroughthejunglewithouta.net), September 22, 2000.

{That's "Twinkie", Tarzan }

-- flora (***@__._), September 22, 2000.

Deedah,

You've never been a school bus driver, have you?

-- flora (***@__._), September 22, 2000.

"...a large man climbed on a seat and repeatedly jumped on Burton's chest while four men held him still."

A 19 year old tries to break in the cockpit, FOUR men pin him down, and a large man CLIMBS on seat and repeatedly jumps on his chest.

There's got to be more to this story. As it is reported in this article, it sounds like a ridiculously vicious over reaction. Was the 19 year old kid holding a gun? Was he on coke or crack and absolutely unmanagable? What and how exactly did the kid do to provoke such vicious response from 5 men?

The 4 other men pinning the kid down were willing accomplices in this killing.

-- (smarty@wannabe.one), September 22, 2000.

According to an interview with an eye witness, several passengers were "beaten up" by the young man before someone else "lost control" and killed him.

-- helen (b@r.f), September 22, 2000.

My understanding is that the idiot kicked a hole in the cabin door and was shouting "I can fly the plane" while attempting to enter the cabin through the hole. He punched out female flight attendants. Then he wailed on some passengers that tried to stop him, punching and kicking them. The guy was psycho.

Was it an over-reaction to jump on his chest while he was held down? Sure. I still say too bad though, people who's lives are put at risk often panic and lose control. These are not policemen we are talking about, they are frightened passengers, panicked passengers trying to deal with a raving lunatic.

So now momma is suing the airline, because they didn't control her effed up son, which is too bad. He brought it upon himself.

Overall, one less jack-ass in the world is how I feel about it.

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), September 22, 2000.

Uncle Dee: Are you going to Vegas? Lol.....

You will BE the life of the party, I'm sure.

Hey whatever is clever as far as I'm concerned, I'd say given what unc has pointed out, drastic measures WERE called for. I know I dont wanna die because of some nut-case loose on an airplane.

so mom is suing, Go figure, so part, she'll collect.

-- consumer (shh@aol.com), September 22, 2000.

Looks like there is indeed more to this story which I haven't seen. In the light you put it Uncle, I agree with you.

-- (smarty@wannabe.one), September 22, 2000.

Hell, I'm nervous on a plane when everyone's sleeping, let alone trying to comandeer the cockpit. They shouldn't have kicked him to death though, they should've just tossed him out the emergency exit.

-- wild wingz (@ .), September 22, 2000.