anyone believe in ghosts : LUSENET : TB2K spinoff uncensored : One Thread

-- richard (, August 08, 2000



-- LinkHelper (, August 08, 2000.

I never COULD understand why some kids did not want to go to school. Yep-I was a nerd. But this takes the cake! PLEASE.

-- FutureShock (gray@matter.think), August 08, 2000.

Where are Akroyd and Murray when we need them?

-- (, August 08, 2000.

Do I believe in ghosts?

Let's just say I can think of many more good arguments to disbelieve than to believe in them.

-- Brian McLaughlin (, August 08, 2000.

The real question, Brian, is whether ghosts believe in you.

-- Oxy (, August 08, 2000.

No Richard I don't, but, if that toilet lid keeps getting left down and nobody confesses the cat is going to suffer big time.

-- Carlos (, August 08, 2000.

Well,can anyone explain why some houses have a dreadful atmosphere and some feel just sad; others seem to project a happy atmosphere.I've sold houses for a living; current owners,decoration & location seem to have no bearing on "the vibes".

-- Chris (, August 08, 2000.


-- (@ .), August 08, 2000.

"There are no haunted houses, only haunted people,"

I've been in many a haunted house and place, and I've never seen anything that couldn't be explained.

-- Tarzan the Ape Man (, August 08, 2000.

Just because I've never actually seen a ghost doesn't mean they don't exist. (IOW, I have an open mind on the subject.)

-- Patricia (, August 08, 2000.

Prove It.

-- Guess Whoo (, August 08, 2000.

>> Well, can anyone explain why some houses have a dreadful atmosphere and some feel just sad; others seem to project a happy atmosphere. <<

Only guessing here, but there are a very large number of elements that make up the "atmosphere" of a house. I would bet my bottom dollar you could ask a feng-shui specialist about these sad and happy houses and receive a very detailed answer that has nothing to do with ghosts.

How a house is oriented to its surroundings is very important. How it lets in light (or doesn't). The size of the rooms. How the doorway enters a room. The character of the door itself. What you see out the windows. The acoustics. Subliminal (rather than overt) smells.

Very little of this changes with new owners or new furniture or what colors the walls are painted. You can work to minimize a house's flaws, but you can rarely get rid of them.

Anyway, there are many ways for past occupants to saturate a place with their spirit without actually haunting it as a ghost.

-- Brian McLaughlin (, August 08, 2000.

Prove WHAT? That they exist? Or that they DON'T exist? Or that I've never actually seen one? Or that I have an open mind on the subject? Clarification please..........

-- Patricia (, August 08, 2000.

I have a friend who's wife has one of those spooky houses. It's almost 100 years old and has a lot of personality. There's a room that's always cold and has an unearthly stench in the winter. It's said that one of the former occupants committed suicide in the room and consequently she believed the room had a ghost She was so unnerved by it that she wanted to have a scenance. Fortunately cooler heads prevailed, and her husband convinced her to look for a more earthly cause.

It turns out that that the heating duct in that room (there was only one) had been blocked by a rat's nest. The room never got very warm because there not much heat was getting in. The horrible stench was, well, barbecued rodent.

If it hadn't been for her husband, this woman would still be convinced her house was haunted.

-- Tarzan the Ape Man (, August 08, 2000.

Do evil spirits exist?

If the leader of the religion that has had the most profound effect on all of human history can be trusted; then yes, they do.

Jesus spoke to "unclean spirits" who knew Him...there are several accounts to that effect in the Gospels. "I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven." -- Luke 10:18.

These aren't the departed "spirits" of poor departed lost human Shirley Maclaine-type beings...these are fallen angels. Spirits who existed before there was any such thing as a human -- but who were cast out with Lucifer when he rebelled.

Yes, they exist. And they affect human events, each and every day. On every level. International, national, local, household. You bet.

They do impersonate dead people, oh yeah...that's why people believe in ghosts. But it's a sham.

And there is only One Power Who is able to deal with them effectively -- and it ain't Mr. Rogers, or Cap'n Kangaroo.

"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places." -- Ephesians 6:12.

Satan and his minions are alive and well on Earth. But so are God and His infinitely much stronger armies. The Great Controversy continues. Lucifer still argues that he knows how to run things better -- but he lost his case, for all practical purposes, 2000 years ago on a hill called Golgotha, outside Jerusalem. God allows ol' Scratch to "show his ass", so to speak. So the universe knows that Lucifer was wrong. And God was right.

Lucifer's way of doing things has resulted in death, war, disease, all that. On Earth. The result of sin. These conditions don't exist anywhere else, in the whole wide universe. Only here. Only on Planet Earth. Because of Lucifer's confinement here. And all his "buddies".

We're living in the tail end of the "cosmic denouement". The whole universe is watching. Planet Earth is center theater.

-- Chicken Little (, August 09, 2000.

I don't believe in ghosts in any way. I was beginning to not beleive in Satan either; but then I was watching "The Usual Suspects" and Kevin Spacey said, in one scene: "The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing people that he doesn't exist." That made me go hmmm *and* oops...! ;-)

I belive there are dark squares and light squares all over the world. Have you ever gone over a friends house and all the couple does is fight? Right in front of you.

In those houses it seems their cars are always breaking down, they're always at the emergency room for nailing themselves with a nail gun, or breaking an elbow because they fell off a curb. In other words: Dumb accidents. They seem to always be one the phone arguing with the phone company, or electric company or the credit company about some problem or other.

These people, I think, live in/under a "black square." I think most of these people bring these "black squares" with them--no matter where they live. And only people with "black squares" find these house desirable in the first place.

Then you go over someone's house who is in a "white square." The couple gets along fine. People like to go over there and just relax and talk about what's bothering them. By the time they leave, they feel much better. Even though they can't explain it.

I know this whole theory of mine sounds wacked. And it could be. But I believe people, in some cosmic way, get what they give. Be it "black" or "white."


-- Not now, not like this (, August 09, 2000.

Mar, no, your "theory" is definitely NOT wacked. What you said is **IT** exactly -- "But I believe people, in some cosmic way, get what they give."

Of course they do...if you're a miserable sort, all you're going to attract is misery. If you're a happy, contented sort, then that's what you're going to attract.

I had a friend once some years back; seriously overweight and one of the most miserable people I had ever known. Everything used to go wrong for her...and I do mean EVERYTHING. Anything she touched turned to crap (and yes, it seemed she was ALWAYS on the phone arguing with some utility or other; or always had some illness or accident or whatever to talk about). I wasn't such a happy type at the time and so we kind of got along just fine. Well, one day I realized that misery was just, well, miserable and tossed it out of my life (uh, it wasn't as easy as that, but for brevity's sake...). Suddenly, she was no longer my friend. Yes, I did "distance" myself a bit, but didn't want to cut the ties completely (I'm just not that cruel). But she got worse and it got to the point where she was spreading rumors about me and all sorts of nastiness behind my back. Point is, as long as I was miserable like she was, then I was a good enough "friend" for her. Once I became "happy", she had no use for me. Come to think of it, I didn't have much use for HER either. Over the years it became apparent that not too many other people did either. As far as I know, she hasn't changed a bit (I still keep in touch with some "common friends" we had). Truly sad in many ways.

-- Patricia (, August 09, 2000.

Patricia: Wow! We've shared the exact same experience. (How did you know I was talking about someone specific ;-)

My "black square" person is miserable to this day. She just recently broke her leg... she slipped on the mail in the front hallway. Doesnt' that beat all?

When I got married and asked her to be my Maid Of Honor, she accepted. But then never called me. I asked her to go shopping with me for my wedding dress, but she was too busy. (yada, yada) So I shopped by myself.

On the day of my wedding, I couldn't reach her. I didn't know if she was going to show up or not. I had to ask one of my guests to fill in for her "if" she didn't show up (much to my chagrin).

Finally she walked in the church 3 minutes before the wedding. There was my friend and I standing there, just about to take the long walk up the aisle.

Anyway, you should see the wedding pictures. She is pissed in every one of them. Man!

Just recently I was at a b-day party for her SO. I helped in the planning and all. I was my usual self and the next day, people told her how nice I was and that they liked me, etc. She told them all that it was because I was drunk. That was 2 years ago and the last time I will ever speak to her.

The one thing that really sucks about this? She's my sister. Damn!


-- Not now, not like this (, August 09, 2000.

Mar, that DOES suck, and I kind of know how you feel. I have one brother (no sisters) and we just don't get along. He's kind of one of those "miserable" types who blames everything wrong in his life on someone or something else (when he was young, everything was MY fault). Sad that the person who COULD have been one of my best friends turns out to be someone I don't really like.

But we go on, because the alternative is unacceptable :-)

BTW, I like what you (and the others) had to say on the other thread about the recent spate of childishness and hate that has been on the board. I do hope school starts soon. Don't we go through this every time there's a "break from school"? These people are pathetic.

-- Patricia (, August 09, 2000.

"But we go on, because the alternative is unacceptable :-) "

How do you spell ce'la'vie??? ;-) (but it still bites!)

"BTW, I like what you (and the others) had to say on the other thread about the recent spate of childishness and hate that has been on the board. I do hope school starts soon. Don't we go through this every time there's a "break from school"? These people are pathetic.

Amen to that. I almost wish Unk would be the moderator, imagine the size of the bat he'd swack them with? But...


-- Not now, not like this (, August 09, 2000.

If I may take this topic off the trend toward black squares and white squares, has anyone else besides me noticed that every house has a somewhat distinct odor? [I haven't really noticed this lately due to olfactory nerve abuse], but as a child I remember visiting my aunt's house and noticing the odor of her house. There was a comfort there due to the odors. Perhaps it was the wax she used on the furniture, but it was distinct. As my parents aged, I noticed a distinct odor to THEIR house when I visited. My kids noticed it, as well.

Now that I've said that thing about the distinct odors, I'll contribute to this black and white square thing. I suspect the black/white square thinking becomes fixed somewhere in our youth. I've already discussed this offline with Patricia, Mar, but if we've always had good luck and good breaks, we've always lived on one of the white squares. I believe that *I*'ve always lived on a white square. The last two years or so, however, have shown a reversal of this trend. I'm suddenly living on a black square, yet I still have a white square philosophy. For a year and a half [or more], I was able to laugh at everything that went wrong. LATELY, I've stopped laughing and realize that I have to do SOMETHING to get back on the white square.

I'm not suggesting that black squares and white squares don't exist. I'm suggesting that your early experiences being on a black square or a white square "cloud" the experience of the squares changing. In this I mean that folks who grew up on a black square find it hard to accept that they may now live on a white square, just as folks who grew up on a white square find it hard to accept that they may now live on a black square. Having lived on a white square all my life, I could laugh off adversity [at least for a long while.] It's just as hard for those who have lived on a black square all their life to notice that the adversity no longer follows them.

Do all people change square colors? No. I suspect only SOME people change square colors, while some remain on black squares their entire lives and others remain on white squares all their lives. I DO purport, however, that the square of which you became familiar in your youth is the square that determines your attitude about life.

-- Anita (, August 09, 2000.

Scent is very powerful, even for us humans with our puny noses. My grandmother kept cedar shavings in her linen closet and if I close my eyes and try really hard, I can still evoke the smell of that closet and the wonderful, safe feeling I had when I would help her re- arrange that closet.

The smell of oil paint reminds of my mother, who's an artist. Last time I was home, I helped her clean out her old basement studio. It's gotten too damp for her to work there anymore, but the very smell in the walls brought back a flood of memory.

I don't think there's anything supernatural about scents and odors being tied to one place. My girlfriend likes to wear Chanel #5, and it seems to be on every piece of clothing she owns. I'm sure that if someone came into our bedroom they would notice her perfume in the air. Human beings surround themselves with the things they love, and the things they love often have a particular scent.

Personally, I don't believe in white squares, black squares, fate, or luck. Each of us is the captain of his or her destiny. It's up to you to decide what happens to you, whether it's what kind of day you're going to have or what kind of life you're going to live.

-- Tarzan the Ape Man (, August 09, 2000.

Hmmm, Anita interesting theory. But I do not know which square I lived on when I was young. I was put in a foster home when I was 2. My foster father was about as bad as they come. My foster mother was pretty bad too. I ran away from there when I was 14 and then had to live in about 10 different houses. Each one I ran away from.

I ended up back in the same town as my first foster family, but with different people. By then I was way too scarred to take any sensible advise.

Then I met Jake (or so Ill call him). We got married when I was 18 and he was 19. It was then I figured out that if all this stuff hadnt happened to me  exactly the way it did  then I never would have met Jake. Weve been married for 19 years last May.

My sisters and brothers all went through the same things, basically. I got through it by using a sense of humor and music. So I guess I was put on a white square when I arrive here.

My sister has neither a sense of humor, nor a love of music. She is bitter about her past and I suppose will remain so until the day she dies. I tried to help. I tried for the 20 years we were "friends." But I just had to give up. For sanitys sake. That was 2 years ago.

To me, she is a walking "black square."

But I have a brother-in-law who did seem to change squares. Addicted, in prison, all that sort of stuff. He had 2 kids. His wife wanted nothing to do with the children and neither did he. She tried to commit suicide. The kids were taken away and he has custody. You should see the change in him. Hes off of everything, including smokes and hes become a great father and someone I admire. His kids love him madly!

So, yes, I understand that "squares" can sometimes be changed. I saw it happen.

I guess whatever color we live on can change, at different times in our lives. What is it some say about changing completely every 7 years? Maybe that has something to do with it. I think Ive been on some "black squares" and some "white squares" throughout my life.

And, fwiw, I think the place Im living in now is *turning* black. Not that it isnt nice or anything. Ive just been there too long and maybe Ive used up all the white it has to give me. Dumb, huh?

One thing I can be pretty sure of is that everything happens for a reason. So if you are a "white square" person for the most part, then you will be again. Maybe you just used up all the "white" where you are too? Sometimes it just gets to tiring to laugh. And sometimes the music just makes you blue-er.

I hope you move on soon, as I hope I do. From what Ive read of you, you seem to be a strong woman. With any luck at all, youll be back where you belong because you wont *allow* yourself to remain where you are. Thats just the impression I get from you.

Strange discussion, ey?

-- Not now, not like this (, August 09, 2000.

Ships sail East,

And ships sail West,

While the selfsame breezes blow,

It's the set of the sails,

And not the gales,

That determine the way they go.

Like the winds of sea,

Are the ways of fate,

As we journey along through life,

It's the set of the soul,

That determines the goal,

And not the calm nor the strife.


-- flora (***@__._), August 09, 2000.

"What Lies Beneath" (PG-13) is an edge-of-your-seat ghost movie playing in the theaters, starring Harrison Ford and Michelle Pfeiffer. If you like that sort of stuff.

-- WD-40 (wd40@squeak.not), August 09, 2000.

I do believe in ghosts, I do believe in ghosts.

Cowardly Lion, 1939

-- Friendly Ghost (heain', August 10, 2000.

WD-40: I do not believe in Ghosts, but I can't wait to see "What Lies Beneath" I'm in love with Ghosts stories! Saw the trailer at the theater during the Perfect Storm and it looks GREAT!!!

-- Not now, not like this (, August 10, 2000.

Very good film but scared the hell out of me :-)

-- Patricia (, August 10, 2000.

boooooooooo, boooooooooooooooooooooo, BOOOOOOOOOO,

boooooooo, boooooooooooooo, BOOOOOOOOO,



-- (woooo@boooooooooo.wooooooo), August 10, 2000.

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