"Of what use is patriotism these days?" is all she wrote....

-- Tisiphone (tisiphone@the-contact-network.com), July 02, 2000

Answers

Doctor Johnson said it was the last refuge of a scoundrel, but I think Ambrose Bierce was right when he said it was the first. The dictionary defines it as "devotion to ones country" but that's too vague. Devotion to the people? The culture? The landscape? The history? The way patriotism has been hijacked by the right makes it a hard topic to even think about. There are some things about this country that I'm proud of, but these are rarely the things most self-claimed patriots would tolerate, and most of them probably aren't specifically British/English anyway. And the things that are generally considered the icons of this country by tweedy old sentimentalists (as opposed to the neo-nazis and football hooligan school of patriotism) are usually sickmakingly twee and reactionary.

-- Nicholas Grinder (me@impolex.demon.co.uk), July 02, 2000.

At the moment, it seems to be useful for a four-day weekend, fireworks, gallons of beer and much outdoor burning of meat on the North American continent.

And I'm stuck in Stockholm. Rats.

MMF

-- Melanie Miller Fletcher (xanadu1@ibm.net), July 02, 2000.

It's awfully hard to be patriotic if you're English, really. I am very fond of England (and, indeed, of London), but many of the enduring symbols of Englishness have been adopted by hooligans, or were a bit odd to begin with, for that matter. The British Bulldog?

Spending some time living abroad is instructive, because it gives you a chance to appreciate some of the features of England which are not available in, eg, Texas.

Of course, we were at a 4 July barbecue this weekend (Tim & Marcia Illingworth's), so we got to celebrate patriotism with the consumption of blackened meat cooked outdoors, too. Could have done with some fireworks, though to be fair fireworks are difficult at 4 July celebrations in the UK. This is the reason that the Whitchurch fireworks got moved from their traditional July date and near midnight firing-time to a more child-friendly September.

-- Alison Scott (alison@kittywompus.com), July 04, 2000.

It pays the bills for the people who produce This England - A lamentable rag, which I recall Mr Grinder referred to in a previous journal. Featured in this summer's issue is an advert for their latest CD, Rarities vol 1, a volume so obscure that I'll bet even Mr Grinder won't have it. It includes the following must-have recordings: 1. Tommy Farr (the boxer) sings Remember Me accompanied by George Formby (1937) 2. Lord Baden Powell on the history of Scouting (1933) 3. Christopher Stone presents the best of C.B. Cochran's musicals (1935) 4. Edgar Wallace narrates one of his thrilling short stories (1928). 5. Sir Oswald Mosley's "Black Shirts" sing The Marching Song (1936) 6. King George V & Queen Mary talk to the nation about Empire Day (1924) 7. Don Bradman plays Old Fashioned Locket & Our Bungalow of Dreams on the piano (1930) 8. Don Bradman talks about cricket (1930) 9. John Watt introduces several well-known variety acts including Jack Hylton, Cicely Courtneidge, Florence Desmond, Roy Fox, Sir Harry Lauder, Gracie Fields and Paul Robeson(1936) 10. H.R.H. The Prince of Wales (Edward VIII) talks about sportsmanship (1924) 11. Cavalcade of more than 20 famous film stars including : Charles Laughton, Evelyn Laye, Katherine Hepburn, Leslie Henson, Mae West, Jean Harlow, Bobby Howes...and many others (1934) 12. Gypsy Smith, the evangelist, sings the hymn He Satisfies Me So (1924)

I'm not sure how they let Paul Robeson slip in there...

-- Donkey Lasher (donkeylasher@rose-hill.demon.co.uk), July 07, 2000.