Are Mark and Elizabeth in Love? : LUSENET : ER Discussions : One Thread

I ask this because several people have expressed an interest in seeing Mark and Elizabeth get married. To each other. :)

But, watching reruns and reading the reviews here, I've started to wonder if they are actually in love. I don't believe I've ever heard either of them say those three little words, "I love you." I may be mistaken, there may have been one I missed, but if they were really in love, wouldn't they say so every once in a while?

They seem like a very nice, stable couple. They compliment each other fairly well: Mark is reliable, considerate, just an all-around nice guy, and a good doctor. Elizabeth is smart, with a wry sense of humor and a sharp wit, and she's also an excellent physician. They don't have the passion that Carol and Doug had, or the (ugh) heat that Peter and Cleo have, but they seem comfortable together.

But are they in love? If you think so, why? I personally am glad to see Mark in a stable relationship with a non-psycho. I just wonder what others think, and if they can back their opinions up with examples. (Although I know that many people consider M&E to be the most boring couple on television...I'm prepared for remarks like that, too.) :)

-- Cecelia (, June 20, 2000


I don't think they really are in love, but I may be reading too much into their behaviour. Thay always seem a little reserved when they're together (like at the end of May Day - where was the connection? They were being really dull). Also, when Elizabeth gave the pearls back to Mark, she told him not to read too much into it, but I think she was subliminally telling him that she wasn't ready for a deep relationship.

-- Rosie (, June 20, 2000.

What, exactly, would it take to make you think they were in love? As far as I could see passion was all that Doug and Carol had, it'll burn out quickly. (Soulmates? what drivel.)Do they need to act like dogs in heat to prove they love, respect, and need each other? Why can't they have a grown up relationship? Not everything is based on your sex life. We are supposed to believe that Doug and Carol had some kind of psychic communication, why not Mark and Elizabeth. The writing has changed a lot, we don't get to see a lot of what goes on anymore. So, back to the original question, What do you need to see to assure you that they are in love??

-- Casey (, June 20, 2000.

i agree 100% woth casey! cant they have a mature relationship wih out doing it allday in the er? they havent had much screen time yet,but i think they will have plenty in the new season.if anyone noticed they are like love bunnies.....what i mean by that is that if one is going somewhere they allways kiss each other goodbye....example..mayday,great expectations, for those 3 little words...i think more emotion will come out this season. i think the writers probably like a nice,sweet stable relationship.m and e are a keeper

-- rachel (, June 20, 2000.

I think they are in love. I think that the way they act at work is very respectable, they shouldn't act totally infatuated all of the time. But the way Elizabeth came over when David was dying and then after David died, how they always seem happy when they're together. How Elizabeth said Mark is "lovely" (cue Mark acting like a chicken). How Mark allows his daughter to sleep on the couch so he can sleep with Elizabeth. They click well, and I do think they are in love.

-- Joanne (, June 20, 2000.

I was just thinking about this the other day, Cecelia. I believe you're right, they've never verbally expressed love to one another. And actually, they don't really seem to be in a hurry to. Maybe Mark's bad experience with marriage soured him on it a little bit. I'm not sure why Lizzie wouldn't be in a hurry to formalize their relationship, or even talk about it, but maybe it has something to do with her parents.

Things occur behind the scenes on ER and every other show. That's not in dispute. The writers, however, have always taken pains to let us in on what's going on in the character's personal lives, even if it's only the tiniest hint. We all knew about how Mark felt for Susan, how Doug and Carol retained feelings for each other during the third season, and how smitten with Carol Luka was, long before any of them acted on it. We also knew much Benton had come to care for Carter, how much pain Carter's been in lately, and how close Kerry and Jeanie had become before she left. Some of us could even read the tiny signs and predict Lucy's demise even before the story broke. We don't need to be told everything. We just need to see. Thus far we've seen Mark and Elizabeth spend a lot of time together, we've seen how much she cared about his dad, and we've seen a lot of affectionate moments. We've also seen a lack of spontaneous, passionate moments, and we've seen her refuse to keep something of extreme importance to Mark's family. In my mind, the lack of an expression of love between them speaks volumes. Sure, it's POSSIBLE that this is just an oversight by the writers, and it's POSSIBLE that we are meant to look at them and say, "wow, what a stable relationship. I hope I'm in such a boring," whoops, sorry, "LOVING relationship some day." But I'm not CONVINCED, not at all. And I would say anyone who is is just burying their head in the sand.

-- joy (, June 20, 2000.

When Mark cried in Elizabeth's arms and she comforted him without words after his father's death, it sure looked like love to me! I don't know if it was "passionate, till death do us part" love, or "we will always be there for each other because we are friends" love, but there was so much trust and emotion between them then.

I agree, Doug and Carol were like teenagers, especially compared to this mature love of Mark and Elizabeth, where both are secure and neither feels the need to prove their love, or test the love of the other. Mark and Elizabeth's relationship is great and I hope it lasts.

-- Annie (, June 20, 2000.

I think Mark and Elizabeth have a very loving relationship and I think next season it will continue to grow. I think they are taking it slow...Mark because he has been burned before and Elizabeth because, well her parents marriage didn't seem to be a very good role model. They want to make sure it is right. As for not saying "I love you" yet, that is a really big step in relationship. When my husband and I were dating we did not say those three little words for a long time. Some people say them so often that they have no meaning. I think Mark and ELizabeth want to make sure it is right. But, the little signs that show love and respect for each other are there. I really hope TPTB keep them together and maybe next season we will hear those three magic words.

-- amanda (, June 20, 2000.

I think Mark and Elizabeth, funny or strange as it may sound, are still in the "getting to know you" phase of their relationship. It's not a bad thing, but they're still trying to know each other well by taking things slow and steady. This often eliminates the passion that couples who just *click* have (like Doug and Carol), but ultimately it fosters a better understanding of each other. They're so many people who have great phsyical chemistry, which wears off in time after marriage, and then there's nothing. To me Mark and Elizabeth seem like a very "cautious" couple, but they're definately very good friends, and they do love each other, as friends, and possibly something more. As others have said, I think it's great that there's a stable, mature couple on ER, and really, if any two characters had to be in one, I really couldn't picture people other than Mark and Elizabeth.

-- samira (, June 20, 2000.

Samira, I think you make an excellent point. Theirs seems to be a reflection of a truly mature, slowly emerging relationship. I'm not a huge fan of it, but I can't say that at this point I'm against it. However, I'm expecting some sort of bump in the road for them. After all, this is ER. I'm wondering if Elizabeth turns out to have some commitment problems? Was I the only one who got the sense that she might? Of course, not to the extreme that Carol did :)

-- Phyl (, June 20, 2000.

Phyl, I thinnk you could be right. The impressions I got of her parent's relationship was that it was not a good one and maybe her mom has trouble with commitments...she didn't seem to be a committed mother either. So as much as Elizabeth does not want to be like her mom, maybe she is. JMHO.

-- amanda (, June 20, 2000.

You guys talk about these two still being in the getting to know you phase of their relationship - this may be off the mark a little bit but it sure seems to me that folks should get WELL PAST the "getting to know you" phase and DEEP INTO the "I LOVE YOU" phase before they get into the "oh you are soooo good in bed" phase. How can a strong healthy relationship develop when folks are going about everything all bass-awkwards??? JMHO.

Now - back to the original question - are they in love. Despite my earlier visit to the soap-box. I don't think so - YET - I would like to think that these two characters compliment each other well enough for TPTB to allow the relationship to progress into a future together.

-- Linda (, June 20, 2000.

And the example of a couple who waited would beeeeeee, Carol and Doug? Nope, um how about Benton and Carla?, um well, ok how about Carter and lets see, Harper? Abby Keaton?, The insurance chick who's name escapes me at the moment.........It doesn't seem that anyone waits for that part of the relationship anymore. That was one thing that I admired about While his friend Doug would just as soon skip the conversation,Mark wanted to get to know the girl a little before they jumped in to bed. He and Elizabeth may be boring, but their relationship is a better role model than some of the others this show has portrayed. Maybe that is why people don't feel comfortable with it, because they are not used to seeing it.

-- Casey (, June 20, 2000.

Mark and Heather? Mark and the lady who made videos? He waited until he really got to know them? I don't think so, no. He slept with them pretty quickly, if I recall. Not that I think those "relationships" are equal to the obviously commited one he has with Elizabeth, but Mark wasn't a saint.

-- Phyl (, June 20, 2000.

Never said he was, also never said he knew them well. That was the point. Sex is just something to get out of the way these days, with all of the above. Ever heard of instant gratification? Everybody wants to feel good now and worry about the consequences later. Like, what do I know about this person, really know about them. What do we have in common. Do I even like them? Mark and Elizabeth are working on trust. Sex is cheap, trust is something that you earn,and love is trust. IMO

-- Casey (, June 20, 2000.

Sorry, I obviously misunderstood this statement by you: "That was one thing that I admired about While his friend Doug would just as soon skip the conversation, Mark wanted to get to know the girl a little before they jumped in to bed." I felt the examples I gave were ones where it didn't seem like Mark spent too much time getting to know them. Indeed, his actions seemed quite overboard, much like Doug had been before he made his lifestyle change.

-- Phyl (, June 20, 2000.

Sorry, I don't remember Heather, was she the water polo one? Mark *wanted* to get to know them. The post I was respondng to was Linda's about relationships being backasswards, not that Mark was better or worse than anyone else's character. My point is that no one waits anymore, the only exception that comes to mind is Jeanie and Reggie, but I don't think I saw that much about their sex life.The order of relationships isn't the same as it used to be. By the time you sleep with someone you should know them pretty well, but IMO it is not portrayed that way on TV. We take a lot for granted, assume a lot. Despite putting the cart before the horse, Mark and Elizabeth seem to be adding depth to their relationship, something that we don't see very often.

-- Casey (, June 20, 2000.

Casey wrote: What, exactly, would it take to make you think they were in love?

Well, like I said in my original post: those three little words would tell me, for example. No, they don't need to do in in the ER-- we see them outside of there often enough to see a little private interaction. They don't need to be having wild sex all the time-- that isn't what I was talking about.

I am in love with my husband. And while we are not screwing like bunnies every minute of every day, it's obvious to everyone how much we love each other, partly because we look at each other and say "I love you," very frequently. During a crisis like Mark's father's death, while Elizabeth was very conforting and helpful, those three little words would have been very appropriate--if they ARE in love.

Some of you seem very concerned about the sex issue for some reason. I don't think it matters at all what Doug was like, or what Mark did in the past. He IS in a mature, stable relationship, and we can all see that they care about each other and are happy, as I said. They have fun. I just don't see them looking at each other with that "I love you so much" expression, even in private. And for those of you who have hopes for next season--well, I'm asking my question based on what you've already seen, not what you're hoping to see.

I'm sorry that some of you seem to have gotten a little heated up over my question. I'm not at all suggesting that they should break up, even if they're not in love. I like them together. I love Mark (in a real-person-loves-TV-character sort of way). :) I'm just curious, if they are in love, why doesn't it show a little more?

-- Cecelia (, June 20, 2000.

Cecelia: Not to draw attention to the fact that this is tv :), I would say they aren't lovey-dovey all the time because they weren't the main plot for the end of this season. If they had been rseriosly relationshipy, then people would be comparing them to Carol and Doug and that wouldn't work. And of course Carter was the big issue. I think they'll be a major focus next season. I think they are definately in love. As someone said above, there will be bumps- Mark is cautious and unsure, Elizabeth will be torn between her two lives, IMO. The entire situation has been built beautifully and all I hope is that it isn't ruined now with silly attempts at spice, or overly dramatic "Mark\Elizabeth is great, but someone else is better", scenarios. TPTB, just give the people what they want for once!

-- May (, June 20, 2000.

Hmmm. So, the general consensus seems to be: They are in love, but are not yet ready to say it? Or be too demonstrative? Even in private? Hmmm.

-- Cecelia (, June 20, 2000.

I've seen no indications that tell me for certain that Greene/Corday are in love or they ever will be. I really am not interested in the relationship. I wouldn't mind at all if they broke up. I find Corday much more interesting when she interacts with Romano/Benton at work. I think Corday is much duller around Greene. Just because I'm not a fan of the Corday/Greene relationship does not mean it is because I did not see them have sex in the ER or not. The amount of sex the couple does or does not have is not the criteria for why I like or don't like a couple. There are many factors involved. Corday/Greene just don't interest me. I find I enjoy Corday better when she interacts with other characters much better. I even thought Corday's inrteraction with Mark's dad was much better to watch than her interaction with Mark himself. Because they don't act like love bunnies in the ER is not a reason why for me. I have nothing against having serious ,mature relationships on ER that are based on something other than just sexual gratification. However, a serious, mature relationship does not have to be boring to watch. IMHO Corday/Greenee relationship is just that.

-- Brenda (, June 20, 2000.

i think they just need a little time..thats all! anoyone agree??

-- rachel (, June 21, 2000.

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