I have noticed in several posts that "Californians" are not liked. Do typical Californians have particular cultural attitudes or mannerisms that offend you? Or is the term Californians being used for city slicker?

If I move to an area near you should I hide the fact that I'm from California? Or would I be judged for who I am not where I'm from?

-- Silicon Valley Man (netorcs@pacbell.com), June 08, 2000

Answers

I think it depends on where you go! When I did platform work for a hair coloring company for many years--People from Calif. would say, what does a FARM GIRL FROM KANSAS KNOW ABOUT STYLE???? Then I'd show them just what the heck this old farm girl knew! Maybe you have to show people just what ya know!!!! Sonda in Ks.

-- Sonda (sgbruce@birch.net), June 08, 2000.

I recently had a repair man out. we were talking and i knew he wasn't from WA. asked where he moved from and he quietly answered "California". I told him no big deal I moved from Ca. 2 years ago. He went on to say that on his first service call here the man told him he should finish his job, pack up, and move back. He found out later through the rest of the conversation that the man moved from CA 10 years ago. 10 years ago was when people from WA started hating Californians for jacking up the real estate prices! can we say hypocrite!! Where you come from doesn't matter as much as who you are.

-- Amber (ambrosia75@wa.freei.net), June 09, 2000.

I think the problem with Californians has been the same as the problem with urban/suburban folks everywhere -- they move into a rural area to get away from it all, then insist their new community become just like where they left. Also, a lot of people from California with, shall we say, California culture, moved into rural areas that still had good strong conservative values, and proceeded to, again, insist on having things their own way. And, the people from California who move into other states often have more money than the people who live there, and have driven real estate prices up sky high in many areas. This is fine for someone who is trying to sell but not so good if you were hoping, and perhaps had been saving for years, to buy your own place. Here in NH where we are now living, it is Massachusetts that takes the brunt of those resentments, though from what I've seen there are very nearly as many immigrants from Connecticut. Or summer people, who drive the price of waterfront land (and most other land) out of range of local people. I can remember the antagonism towards California when we were living in Oregon -- there was talk of a sign at the border, or a phrase on the license plates, and a lot of people had anti-California bumper stickers. Of course, now Oregon and Washington have been pretty thoroughly taken over by the "California mentality" and Idaho, Montana, Wyoming, and Colorado aren't far behind. So, if I was moving into an area, and I was from California, I wouldn't shout about the fact, and I would maintain a low profile until the local people got a chance to know me, and realize that I was not a threat to their community. Unless, of course, you moved into an area that mostly consisted of transplanted Californians, and it might be difficult to afford to buy in an area like that. Personally, I'm alway polite to my neighbors, but if their values differ greatly from mine, I'm not going to be very comfortable with them, either.

-- Kathleen Sanderson (stonycft@worldpath.net), June 09, 2000.

I looked around in California in early eighties. Lot of bumper stickers out there saying "Now you've seen it, go HOME!" I'm starting to feel that I should put one of those on my truck here. Its not "Californians" I resent, but the immigrant yuppies from wherever. IF people want a crowded go-go lifestyle, why move to some rural area and change it. Just stay where you are. I really hate imposed rules, but I am getting to point of supporting a rule that states that you have to live within 5 miles of your job. If you want the bizillion dollar a year job, then you have to live on 42 floor of some huge expensive apartment building with all the smog, pollution, and crowding that such may involve. If you can live with limitations of rural area jobs/lifestyle, then you get the advantages of reasonable priced land, trees, wildlife, and space. Of course such isnt practical, but it would be fair.

-- Hermit John (ozarkhermit@pleasedontspamme.com), June 09, 2000.

I have no innate dislike for Californians; 'course we don't see too many of 'em here in E. Central Illinois unless they're lost. Not real fond of Chigago folk though. Probably has to do with the fact that Chicago is our nearest big city, and I don't care too much for city folks manners. Is it urban Californians that are moving in and causing conflict?

We have a huge recreational lake nearby (feds took part of our land for it) and when I was really, really poor one summer, I worked in a combo store-bait shop-restaurant. Nine out of ten customers were from Chicago. Rude, crude, cheap, obnoxious, belligerant and ....(Come to think of it, I don't much like bass fishermen either!!). Country boys seem to know their manner better - or maybe they just know if they pinch the waitress on the butt, their Momma will know about it before they get back home! Chicago boys learned that the waitress will "accidentally" pour coffee in their lap. We've had several Chicagoins build or buy homes down here, they do tend to mellow out after ten or so years. When they would start carping about the lack of entertainment, etc.... we'd just tell them "What'd you move down here for? Go back North if you don't like it.". I'll admit that it does take a special kind of person to think that the Kiwanis Pancake Supper is a dazzeling social event...but, hey - I wore my good jeans - what more do you want!?

-- Polly (tigger@moultrie.com), June 09, 2000.

Californians moved to WA state in large numbers during the time when their real estate prices were still high. They cashed in their equities and moved up here. This was during the time that the defense industry in So. CA was still viable. Folks sold their homes in CA for $300k + and moved to OR and WA, primarily. They could buy an estate up here or hundreds of acres, or waterfront property in the San Juan Islands. People up here were torn, because there was this instant real estate market, yet concerned that their kids wouldn't be able to afford a decent house some day. Guess what?

It's funny, because so many of the new folk that have moved around here are from back east, and of course, the generations before mine were mostly from the midwest or Norway or Sweden (around here, ya sure, ya betcha!)Everybody moves from somewhere out here...not many families stay put for generations...the country is too young.

People don't just hate Californians, they hate everybody who comes in and takes advantage of them, WITH THEIR PERMISSION....projecting their guilt onto the newcomers....I am not a psychologist, nor do I play one on teevee, but that's my guess at what happens. Plus people are naturally resistant toward change, suspicious of new stuff. I think it's a survival thing...

Folks on the other side of the Cascades out here hate the ones one this side (call us "coasties" and "206-ers" for the same reason). ETC...When we move over there, we will be walking on eggshells to find a way to fit in. We will be very, very, humble, and will join a lot of service clubs and do a lot of volunteer work to show folks our good intentions. And we will do our best to be good neighbors, lay off the local politics for probably years, and try to demonstrate that we will be an asset to the community, not a disruption. Trust takes a long time to build.

Good luck to you....guess I made this a real dissertation this morning.

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), June 09, 2000.

Hey, SVM. I had no idea that people were using language that was negative about Californians. I have only been there once, and Santa Cruz was gorgeous. I, for one, have no predetermined opinion of Californians. Except that they may be leaner, tanner, and generally more lovely than us crackers in Minnesota.

-- Rachel (rldk@hotmail.com), June 09, 2000.

A guy from Texas, a guy from California and a guy from Seattle went out hunting together. In the evening, they sat around the campfire drinking their preferred beverages. The guy from Texas polished off half his bottle of tequila, tossed the bottle in the air and shot it to smithereens, saying, "Plenty of that where I come from!" The Californian downed half his bottle of Chardonnay and skeet-shot the remainder, saying, "Plenty of that where I come from!" The guy from Seattle downed his latte, pulled out his gun and shot the Californian, saying, "Plenty of that where I come from!"

-- snoozy (allen@oz.net), June 09, 2000.

ROFLMAO!!! Good one.

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), June 09, 2000.

If you go back and look you will probably find that the Anti- California sentiment comes from me, a Californian. The truth is I am a native Californian and I am discusted with my own state. I am tired of being zoned, taxed, disarmed, permitted, and daytime curfewed. I am fed up and no California cheese sign is going to stop me from crossing the border and never looking back.

Little Bit Farm

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@calinet.com), June 09, 2000.

Hey Snoozy,

Good joke! When I heard it, the Washingtonian downed half a bottle of micro-brew beer, threw the bottle in the air, and shot the Californian, saying, "Plenty of those where I come from. But I have to recycle the bottle!" A little more Washington green culture.

-- Laura Jensen (lauraj@seedlaw.com), June 09, 2000.

Born and bred Californian now transplanted in Texas. Folks forget that there are nearly as many horses in California as in Texas. I was raised on a horse farm. I use the "I am from San Diego" sentence to explain myself all of the time, for having an oppinon, for not being submissive, and pointing out BS when a man is spouting it. I have had a Texan tell my husband before "can't you control her?" We tease the folks on the road that we didn't move here, we were asked to move here to add some hybrid vigor to the gene pool! Though my kids are older, rules around of the house were, be nice, don't cuss, get good grades, work and your not allowed to date anyone on the road! Vicki

-- Vicki McGaugh (vickilonesomedoe@hotmail.com), June 09, 2000.

I moved from Los Angeles to a small city in New Mexico five and a half years ago. Haven't run into too much of the wealth-resentment problems. I guess it's pretty obvious that I'm not one of the folks who cashed out after the real estate boom! What I do encounter from time to time, though, is the assumption that I must be (a) dumber than the average box of rocks; (b) trying to escape something unsavory in my big-city past; or (c) nuts for leaving the land of milk, honey and 24-hour Thai restaurants. (I will admit to missing the Thai restaurants.)

The weirdest interaction I've had with anyone in this area happened before I moved, though. I was here on vacation and had a rental-car disaster...when the gentleman who came out to tow me to the shop found out where I was from, he treated me to a lengthy explanation of how Rodney King somehow tricked those poor cops into beating him that way so that his cohort could videotape the whole thing and make them both both rich. Fortunately, it was a short ride....

-- Christine (cytrowbridge@zianet.com), June 10, 2000.

Why would any one not like Californians? They are just Okies with a funny accent. As all history buffs can tell you, They all migrated from Okla. to Cal. in the early 30's strictly because of a desire for fresh fruit.

-- Okie-Dokie (www.tommycflinstone@aol.com), June 10, 2000.

My problem with Californians has a long ago beginning. When I was a child, we went to California to visit relatives. We are, and still are, from Texas. When we crossed the California line and stopped at a restuarant, some jerk who saw our plates came over and told us to leave the restuarant because "You killed my President". That was 1964, and of course, he was talking about Kennedy. My father told him that he hadn't killed anyone, and we were just there to eat. The man kept ordering us to leave until finally the owner of the restuarant told him to sit down.

When we got to San Diego and went to our relatives' house to stay, they were assailed by phone calls wanting to know who was there from Texas and WHY were they allowing us to stay there, after all, Texans had killed the President. There were even veiled threats made to my aunt to the effect that if we weren't gone in a week, something bad would happen.

We were treated that way to a lesser degree all over California. I have never wanted to go back, although the land itself is as beautiful as you will ever find anywhere.

I might also add that we were not treated that way before we entered California nor after we crossed back out of the state, nor were we treated badly on any other vacation before or after that.

Californians are, as a rule, rude and abrasive, and believe they are the only ones with the intelligent to empty a boot with the directions printed on the heel. There are ways to disagree and make the point known without insulting everyone you don't agree with.

I know that everyone from California isn't like that. I have known a few Californians who really were nice people and really did move to the country to be a part of the community and to be friends as well as have friends. Still, when I see those California plates, I have difficulty smiling at the driver.

I would not suggest hiding you are from California. Instead, you would probably do better to smile big and be friendly.

I feel sure that you will do fine where ever you decide to go. You are already sensitive enough to ask questions in an effort to fit in.

-- Green (ratdogs10@yahoo.com), June 10, 2000.

Part of the above author's problem with Californians is a cultural issue. California has it's own set of cultural values. For instance, in much of the country it is expected that when a person goes into a place of business they should spend some time convresing with the person whom they are doing business with. This means talking about the weather, asking about the person's family, and so on. In California it is often considered rude to talk to those you deal with, except in smaller farming communities where everyone knows one another. The reason it is considered rude is because California is full of people in a hurry to get somewhere or do something. If you take the time to chat you are often holding up the line behind you. Most Californians walk into a place of business, state their business, and complete it in a rather no nonsense way. Most Californians feel that they need to get things done and get on with things. This is very rude to most people from the south and the east. My sister moved from here to Tennessee and was very uncomfortable it was very difficult for her to adjust to a slower way of doing things. A friend of hers told her before she went that hospitality in the South was a mile wide and an inch thick. In other words, there are a lot of things that are considered polite in the South that a person must do to be accepted. They will be polite to a fault, but they might not think much of you anyway. Which brings us to the thing that most Californians can't stand about other states. In California it is extremely rude to talk about someone behind their back. In other words a Californian, in most cases, if they don't like you, will tell you off to your face. Thay expect the same in return. They won't say they like you to your face and then turn around and say to others how much they can't stand you. This is another reason, people from outside of California think that Californians are rude. People from the south think that it is very rude to get in someone's face when they don't like you. Californians think that to smile at someone while you curse thwm under your breath is hypocritical. Now all this is said to explain, not criticize. My mom is from the South. My dad from here. I grew up around both attitudes. I kinda fit in anywhere.

Little Bit Farm

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@calinet.com), June 10, 2000.

My best friend is from CA...I once gave her 2 doz. fresh eggs, she asked if I'd mind her giving them to her dog, as she doesn't like fresh eggs. I was shocked!! EVERYONE likes fresh eggs, prefers them, even! They're gold here! "They taste too strong," she said. We ended up with another bunch and were headed to her house, and Rhett, my son, said, "Why don't we take some to Barb?" I said, "Because she doesn't like fresh eggs." "Why not?" he asked. "She's from California," I said. "Oh," he said. That explained that... Offer fresh milk, they ask if it's homogenized, pasteurized, with vitamin A & D added. They're health nuts, but want guarantees that it's going to be PERFECTLY healthy. When Barb got back from her last visit to CA, she said, "They feel like they're so free, and everything is ruled, regulated and zoned into law." I said, "THey have freedom from morality, that makes them feel free." Is this ALL Californians? NO. But, Hollywood is the mouthpiece of that state, and what do you see coming out of there? What about the asinine laws they pass, and I wonder, how much longer before some lunatic here decides to go that route until they get it passed here...

A guy over by here about 10 mi. away, sold his property in CA and moved out here. He wants the zoning laws molded to fit the development he wants to build, but he wants to control the zoning laws of his neighbors. A friend that owns land adjoining his went out to start a controlled burn. She got it started, (NO WIND) and a few minutes into the burn, the wind just whipped up.(That happens here sometimes, this is KS) Well, her fire jumped the fence into his field. He sued for his fence and fenceposts being burned. They were brand new steel posts and were fine except they were black, same with the fencing. He collected his insurance, but also wanted them to pay what insurance paid (I believe it's called double-dipping) and "smoke damage to his farm equipment, because he had to WASH them! We put things like that up to "CAlifornia thinking".

-- Louise Whitley (whitley@terraworld.net), June 10, 2000.

Playing true confessions here! I did almost six years in the God- forsaken, souless hell-hole that is referred to as LA. To explain some, I moved there without ever having been there before and I was in a band and had a total of $300.00 to my name. Coming from the frozen tundra of Wisconsin it took me six months to get over the fact that I didn't have to plan my life around the weather. Otherwise, the thing that I first noticed was that being from the midwest would get me a job almost instantly and that when I was introduced to people they always remarked on my firm handshake, that is the ones who weren't looking around the club for someone that could do something for them while leaving their limp, lifeless paw in my hand for a second too long!

Also, most of the people that I met were not from California, but they sure copped the attitude quickly and acclimated very well to the indifference and lack of civility. I only knew two native Californians relly well and one of them is decent the other repugnant. One of those even splits in humanity.

The "Californian" prejudice is towards the attitude of me first, me most importantly and screw the rest of ya, cause I got mine! I don't believe you have to be from CA to have that, but it helps.

I moved 5 1/2 years ago, and it was the best thing I have ever done.I went back one time after three months to pick up some stuff from a friend's garage and the second I crossed the Nevada state line it was as if someone poured oil and stress into the air and I was amazed at how I hated it! However, being in a souless place taught me first hand how important it is to have a feeling for a place and that $$$ is truly the least important thing a person can have. I think the fact that the population there is so transient, having no real roots in the place and mostly focused on getting all they can as quickly as they can adds to the lack of substance the individuals carry with them. Just the two cents of an ex-prisoner......Thank God eternally for the "ex" !!!

-- Doreen (livinginskin@yahoo.com), June 10, 2000.

CALIFORNIAN AND PROUD OF IT!sure we have some bad folks and some problems, Dosnt every were? I think our problem is we as a whole dont judge a book by its cover. Just read California has the highest rate of people who do volunteering for charitable causes, so lets hear it for California clap clap clap!

-- kathy h (saddlebronc@msn.com), June 11, 2000.

Siicon, The folks from california who moved to Kansas, for the most part were just rude and impatient. They also thought the trusting people here were just suckers to take advantage of. this has really changed the entire attitude of a lot of really nice people here in SEKansas. I know one family here in Longton who lost their little grocery store because they gave credit to some of the California people, who ran up a huge bill then moved out. But frankly Wichita people can be just as bad. Some of those people were burglerizing area homes. They had a fake dog carrier on the back of a truck. When folks would go to town for one of the local big events like a free bean feed, these guys would go from house to house out in the country and take what they wanted. When they were caught, their excuse was we had it coming because we did not lock our doors!!! Now the doors are locked and no credit unless you're a local and we watch everyone with non- local car tags. A loss of innocence and a loss of trust and it is tjust too sad. karen

-- Karen Mauk (dairygoatmama@hotmail.com), June 11, 2000.

Oh yes, we Californians give to a lot of charitable causes. Let's see, there's the Save the Rocks Foundation (SRF). Or how about the, Support your Local Alien Society (SLSA). The only problem with the SLSA is nobody has figured out what kind they should support. I mean there are the ones from outer space, the ones from mexico, and the ones from hollywood.

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@calinet.com), June 11, 2000.

I don't think of Californians as rude or rushed. I think of them as generally spoiled, demanding & rather shallow. So focussed on communing with their Inner Child, on "working on themselves", that they are oblivious of others. Like they are the center of the universe. ("I want what I want now, and I really don't feel that I should have to work for it, I mean, like, I've got a really high credit rating, you know.") But I find that the most interesting people in the world anyway are those who are at the edges of their own culture -- not the stereo-types, and this view of Californians is just a generalizing of irritating experiences to the whole bunch, when of course there are lots of wonderful Californians, too. May they stay there!

-- snoozy (allen@oz.net), June 11, 2000.

Californians and Texans are similar in their "state pride" or if you aren't from "my" state, you are a loser, you know, "The New York City attitude."

I'll never forget in 1969 while attending Kent State University in Ohio, Jefferson Airplane did a concert and that wonderful person named Grace Slick promptly told us we were all losers because we were from the Midwest and the only way to escape mediocrity was to move to the coast...

"...even the East coast." she slurred.

Gee, thanks Gracie, that'll save us some moving expenses.

This after about 10,000 of us paid $20. a piece to see her and her "boys." I spent a lot of time on both coasts and without a doubt the left coast has the most actors; the east coast has the most "old money."

The Texans' state pride with all the flag waving and "bigger than big" and arrogant claims that the Dallas Cowboys are "America's team" make me want to puke sometimes. Been there too and even before I discovered the "Texan attitude" I hated it. Talk about dusty, muddy, windy and hot. I will never set foot in that state again, even tho I have transplanted relatives living there. Texans have certainly spent a lot of money to try and make it appear nice, but it is pretty cosmetic and superficial and under all the green, rolled sod is that awful red dust. Corpus Christi was nice if you like the tropics; and I liked the Texarkana area for its "unwatered" green, but most Texans don't like Texarkana because it is too close to Arkansas.

Being an ex-60s surfer/hippie, I traveled a lot and frequented the "cool spots" and soon discovered that they weren't cool at all, they just believed that they were. I guess that is the clinker: self indulgent to the point of believing it.

Disclaimer: NOT ALL, but many!

-- Jim Roberts (jroberts1@cas.org), June 12, 2000.

Karen, We're neighbors! Sort of! We're in Winfield, well just outside of Winfield! Moved here the roundabout way from Wichita. Know what you mean by people from Wichita. Longton is a beautiful place! Sorry to hear about the robberries. But, we lived in Burden (yech!!) for 3 yrs. and it was true there. They blamed everything wrong with that town on people moving from Wichita, and it wasn't all true, their kids got into trouble and it was because they were running with that boy from Wichita, or drugs. But we saw the people move in from Wichita and run up John's grocery bill then move right back out and leave him holding the bag, but so did some of the people in that town. They just go to Winfield and don't shop at his store any more. Wichita is getting bad with their way of thinking, and it's showing on some of the people coming out of there, which is why we left.

-- Louise Whitley (whitley@terraworld.net), June 12, 2000.

Sooooo...guys....how long does it take to become a Californian? Most of the people in this state were born somewhere else! And many only came here in their adulthood. Native Californians are really, really rare. So maybe what you are complaining about is not something that comes from being born and raised in this location, so much as being transplanted from someplace else, willingly or not, and having a sense of an unauthenticated life. You don't have to live in California to get that.

-- Mary (renyald@garlic.com), June 13, 2000.

Interesting thread. Where my stereotypical dislike of Californios comes from is my interaction with some of them. My sister lives in L.A. and is an accountant for movie studios. I've been to visit her twice and both times I've run into some of the most ignoramus-type people I've ever been around. They say, "Where are you from?" I say, "Iowa." And they say, "Oh yeah, Boise?" And then I just shake my head and wonder how they can refer to us as hicks or rubes when they don't even know basic geography about their own country. Pathetic. But most of those show-business people are from New York, though, so maybe it's just the people in the large metropolitan areas?

-- dave IA (tidman@midiowa.net), June 14, 2000.

I spent some time in California years ago. I liked it and the people then. In fact, I found my favorite ex-wife there. Being from Texas I used to hear how people from New Mexico hated Texans because Texans went there and bought everything up. Then after the oil and real estate bust in the 80s Texans quit going to New Mexico and Californians started taking over. I heard that before long the New Mexicans were wishing they had the Texans back. They said the Texans went there and bought real estate and all that and went their way but Californians went there, bought everything and started trying to make New Mexico into another California. Trying to convince New Mexicans that they were backward and that they should do everything like it was done in California.

-- Joe Cole (jcole@apha.com), June 14, 2000.

Oh boy... Lets see.... From a person that had to live in Many states because of my husbands work. No matter what, the state you live in at the time, seems to hate the neighboring states without getting to know the people first. Or they hate you because you have a different licence plate,, or you don`t have an America made car. Or your husband is serving his country in the Miltary,,so again, we are the outsiders. It can get really silly. I don`t think any place in the USA is better or worse in Manners. I think each state does things differently,, which may seem rude or forgien to a person not born to that place. There are jerks and good people everywhere. Though people seem to be more uptight and in a rush in the cities. Would be a whole lot better if everyone would remember their manners, be kind to one another, and be good neighbors. Now if I could just get my neighbors to be good nieghbors!! I mean, come on folks,, this is supposed to be the UNITED States of America for goodness sakes.

-- Bergere (Autumnhaus@aol.com), June 14, 2000.

My husband is from California (born and raised). We live in Georgia (where I was born and raised). My hubby lost the "California" mentality very quickly after he moved here. He is now just a good ole country boy(thank heavens)! His parents on the other hand think that our small town should be exactly like the LA suburb that they moved here from (supposedly to escape the crime and rat race for a more simple life with friendlier people). They HATE the people here (because we are friendly and we talk to everyone). They are constantly complaining about "southerners". Constantly complaining about how things are so different from home. It drives me INSANE!!! WHY do people move from where they are only to try to change the place they are moving to into exactly what they used to have?????????? WHY don't they just stay put?? I just don't understand it. I love my little town. I don't want things to change here. When I see things changing (like the new 4 lane highway they are putting in 3 miles from my house), it makes me so sad. I love the people here. They are super friendly. I have no intention of moving (except maybe to bigger property in my county). I don't hate Californians in general (they are just who I deal with the most). What I really hate is people being so arrogant as to think that they can move here and just turn everything upside down. My family has lived in this area for generations. I feel like this is MY land. I don't want someone from ANYWHERE coming in and trying to turn it into LA, Chicago, NY or wherever!! I want things to stay the same!! I resent my in-laws for coming here and telling me that the South is a terrible place to live and that southerners are lazy, stupid, slow talkers, etc. I resent the fact that they came here looking for something better and are to shallow and closed minded to see that what they have here is a thousand times better than what they could ever have where they come from. And I know that I would feel this way regardless of where they were from, if they kept the same annoying, complaining attitudes!!

-- Linda (botkinhomeschool@yahoo.com), June 15, 2000.

Anyone who has ever been to Alaska knows how to put a stop to the Texans when they start bragging about being the biggest this or that - - just tell them that if they don't stop, we'll cut Alaska in half, and then Texas will be the THIRD largest state, instead of the second!! I suspect that the problem people, no matter where they come from, (usually urban, though) are the ones who have never been taught to consider others before themselves.

-- Kathleen Sanderson (stonycft@worldpath.net), June 15, 2000.

I'm a Southerner by birth, raised with the influence of a proper Victorian and Southern grandmother and even in my 50's, I say use please, thank you, sir and ma'am in speaking to people, regardless of their age. I also sound southern but I hope like Jimmy and Rosalind Carter rather than brother Billy Carter. I think by and large you find what you are looking for and the rest you leave alone.

Due to World War II, my Massachusetts born father was in the South and met and married my Arkansas born mother. On a visit to my northern grandparents when I was in my later teens, my grandmother sent me to the corner mom and pop store for something before a meal. I took my selection to the owner and said "Good morning" whereupon he looked at me as if I were wearing green paint. He never said a word to me but when he handed me my change, I said "Thank you. Have a good day." He really looked at me strangely then. The next day Grandmother went with me to the store and introduced me to the man by asking if he'd met me. Immediately he responded with "Yes and she has lovely manners." When we got home, I mentioned my surprise to Grandmother. She explained that some kids my age were actually being rude when they act as I had and it was only when he associated me with my grandmother that he understood my intentions.

As for the rest, I lock my doors whether I'm home or not and keep all outbuildings locked as well. We have 5 dogs and only one is under 100 lbs. The smallest dog is a part pitbull whose world revolves around me. My husband has teased me about putting a sign at our lane with my picture on it and a caption that reads, "Forget the dog. BEWARE the OWNER!"

-- marilyn (rainbow@ktis.net), June 15, 2000.

I would hide that fact...My primary dislike is not californians in general..its because you happen to live in a state where private business is EVERYBODY's business and you BLATENTLY ( not you personally) ignore glaring issues.... take for example, smoking... who gives a crap if someone smokes on the beach...look at the rates of prostitution, crime, open; illegal immigration, instead of dealing with the root causes, californians tend to deal with something that has no bearing on quality of life on a personal basis...ill write more but then youll think im crazy LOL

-- Doc (Thisisdoc@aol.com), June 16, 2000.