Does cyber warfare pose a threat to the US : LUSENET : TB2K spinoff uncensored : One Thread

60 minutes did a segment on Cyber War this evening. It would seem that everthing that was vulnerable to Y2k is also vulnerable to cyber attacks. Our military would have very little power to protect our infrastructure if groups or countries should attack us in this manner.

Y2k taught us where the problems COULD have occured. During 1999 the government mentioned potiental problems that COULD occur with cyber hacking. I see a lot of similarities between what did not happen with Y2k but might happen with cyber conflict.

I plead netural on the issue but would appreciate the comments of others who saw the CBS program or have a viewpoint on the issue.

-- tc (, April 09, 2000


Dear trashcan, I saw same. While I tried to find a respect for Dan Drather for exposing, I was faced with the dilemma, of honest fact finders, versus those who promote a possible horror. Sensationalism, I cannot help, but wonder, why he is permitted to bring up questionable issues, and live, while those, of a lesser life style, have been un-humanly killed, for same. Well, as I saw it, the U.S. spilled their stupid guts. Then again, I think, maybe not. We cannot be that stupid, can we? I lay money, that we are not so "stupid" in a guise.

-- Elite (En Force@there.where), April 09, 2000.

If the initial general premise of "Y2K et al" was that a real social, financial, political, etc. ... vulnerability exists with grossly 'interconnected systems', then it follows that except for the date specificity of Y2K, the same general premise still holds.

- i.e. 'Y2k' may have been too limited a moniker for an event, or series of events yet to happen.

-- Perry Arnett (, April 09, 2000.

ZDNet is planning to heavily cover this topic in the near future.

-- (, April 10, 2000.

The Melisa virus, bubble boy, 911, the DOS attacks on major sites, the attacks on .gov sites.... who knows?... It will really come down to who's hackers are the best... last I heard the is recruiting hackers... the cyber-wars are already on... :-)

-- Netghost (ng@no.yr), April 10, 2000.

PDD 63.


-- (Whitep@per.1998), April 10, 2000.

Before we all get too excited about cyberwar just remember that many of the same consultants who were promoting Y2K are now promoting cyberwar also.

Every new technology has had its own problems. Remember train robbers? We'll muddle through this one as well.

-- Jim Cooke (, April 10, 2000.

Thank you for two good links on the cyber-war issue.

A "good guy" super-hacker on tonight's program said we are more at risk today than in the past...more tools available for cracking into sites.

When the government played cyber games the hacker group entered 4000 protected sites.

This is a deadly serious "game" which needs a lot of attention before it escalates beyond control. The thought I was left with at the end of the segment was what some unknown persons, half way around the world, could unleash on our society.

-- tc (, April 10, 2000.

Jim, Right or wrong, the vulnerability of our 'puter sys have been idenified, and they can be exploited.. thanx or not to Y2k, awareness has been raised... the future will tell, after it has been spun :-)

-- Netghost (ng@no.yr), April 10, 2000.

Also see the USA Today article on the following thread on what the government knew about cyber attacks in late 1999.

The NIPC was convinced that New Year's Eve ''could be a day for people to start sending marching orders to these zombies. We were afraid that Dec. 31 might become the night of the living dead,'' he says.

''Thanks for giving us plenty of time to prepare,'' says a sarcastic Vinton Cerf, an MCI WorldCom executive who is widely regarded as a founder of the Internet. ''The timing of this all was singularly unfortunate.''

But the protection center gets high praise from many security firms for being the first to provide an effective tool to locate and remove the zombie infections. Vatis says far more damage would have occurred in February otherwise.

''You know, I'm sensing a little bit of doublespeak here,'' Vatis says. ''Business is saying, 'We don't want the government telling us what to do; we can fix this ourselves.' And I agree. But then I hear people saying, 'Gosh, government didn't warn us loud enough.' ''

''People have been saying for a long time that it's going to take an electronic Pearl Harbor for people to take security seriously,'' he says. ''There's a kernel of truth there because we live in an event- driven society.''

-- (must@read.article), April 10, 2000.

-- (, April 10, 2000.

*the hacker group entered 4000 protected sites.*

So what? All by lonesome I could enter about 300 or 400 a day. (Depending on how much time I wanted to spend on it.) Most hackers don't care about using their knowledge to hurt anyone. Most of us are just bored, and looking to see what we can figure out -- it's kind of like doing puzzles to us. Can we figure it out??? Yes! I got that one down! Time to move on to the next one. I've hacked quite a few sites -- just for the fun if it, written an automated program to DoS sites if the spirit moves me, but I swear to you, I'll never do anything evil with my knowledge. None of my hacker friends would!!!

The bottom line is, while I'm busy trying to figure out how to hack whatever site has my attention, there is at least a dozen people trying to figure out how to keep me from doing it. That's how this cyber-game is played!!

-- (, April 10, 2000.

BTW, don't bother asking the sysop to out me. Systems operators know who everyone is because they have access to IP's via the log file. Fortunately, our sysop knows who I am, and that I wouldn't do anything illegal. Right sysop?

-- (, April 10, 2000.

Tom Clancy has written two fiction thrillers on the subject of computer sabotage and cyber terrorists......Debt of Honor and Net Force

I've read Debt of Honor and it was exciting reading. I plan to read Net Force as it got good reviews.

-- ron (, April 10, 2000.

The two most important words you said,

*fiction thrillers*

fiction being the key word.

Catch my drift?

-- (Let's@keep that .in mind), April 10, 2000.

I get the point...but what are the chances in the near future of these type problems becoming fact?

I am not desirous of making a "mountain out of a mole hill", but just what degree of concern is prudent?

-- ron (, April 10, 2000.

Whatever makes you comfortable, and within your financial means!

-- (Keep@that .in mind), April 10, 2000.

After seeing the 60 min piece, I thought that we doomers were kind of wrong and kind of right, after all.

IF some wildass cyberterrorist shut down the water/electrical/refinery system(s) in a large part of the US how long would the problem(s) persist?

Pretty much like Y2K. Pretty much like Israelis living next door to gasman Saddam.

What I remember reading somewhere is that Israeli citizens have been given gas masks, just in case.

So it would seem that we Y2K doomers were prudent, and that the outreach efforts failed, got lost in the doom-tones.

Be prepared. It would have been good if our community efforts had succeeded to a greater degree... today, we would be prepared for disruptions caused by cyberterrorists, or sunspot disruptions, or...?

-- johno (, April 10, 2000.

"says a sarcastic Vinton Cerf, an MCI WorldCom executive who is widely regarded as a founder of the Internet." What??? I thought Gore said he invented the Internet??? I also have read, it was invented by the Government to send message traffic.

-- Will Da Real Inventor, Please (st@nd.up), April 10, 2000.

Before we all get too excited about cyberwar just remember that many of the same consultants who were promoting Y2K are now promoting cyberwar also.

And who are some of these consultants, Jim?

-- (Ple@se.elaborate), April 11, 2000.

OK, Please. Go to Type in "Cyber terrorism" as the search term.

How many of the hits are from commercial firms offering to protect you from these bad boys? a price, of course. How about Symantec and Norton, the ones who were selling protection from the dreaded Y2K viruses? Recognize any of the Big Eight accounting firms that were helping with Y2K who now want to help protect your data from the cyber bandits? See any hits from government agencies and universities who sense that this may be another hot button that allows feeding from the public trough?

Look, I'm not saying that cyber terrorism is not something to be concerned about. I'm saying make sure of your frame of reference before you decide how worried to get.

-- Jim Cooke (, April 11, 2000.

Google search on this topic

Google ranks its results according to how often other sites link to the URLs that Google gives as results.

-- (, April 11, 2000.


-- .com (, April 11, 2000.

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