This was posted this morning....never seemed to get an answer. Anyone want to make me feel better?

But with respect to IT/database systems etc. The real test for them will be TONIGHT when the first day of overnight processing happens. You see if you done any programming you know that must of the bugs occur at what are known as boundaries. Now 1/1/2000 is a boundary. It is a boundary when you rollover and it remains a boundary until you use it. WE HAVE NOT FINISHED THE FIRST DAY SO THE BOUNDARY IS STILL LIVE AS IT HAS NOT BEEN CROSSED YET. IT will use it very heavily tonight when they process today's transactions. You yesterday night the processed transactions that were checking dates for work between 30.12.99 and 31.12.99. Today they will be processing dates for work done between 31.12.99 and 01.01.00 and will use new date seriously for the first time.

Boundaries cause errors just prior to the boundary, at the boundary and just after the boundary. That is the rule of programming.

So you can expect the potential for the most errors at the following times (amongst other times) for IT systems:

Begining of first month before boundary. Begining of first payroll (etc.) before boundary. Begining of first week before boundary. Beginign of first day before boundary. After boundary has crossed. Begining of first day,month,week,payroll etc. after boundary End of First day after boundary End of First week after boundary End of First payroll after boundary End of First month after boundary End of First quarter after boundary End of First year after boundary.

The vast majority of potential errors come where the vast majority of the date calculations can occur. These occur in the After periods when we reach the End of xxx time.

So hang on folks the ride in IT BEGINS TONIGHT.

-- confused (justa number@home.com), January 01, 2000

Answers

Absolutely. This is called batch processing and most systems wont do this until Monday or Tuesday night, depending on what country your in. I see it as the last hurdle to jump. Batch processing has all sorts of date related functionality in it. Systm archiving, Backups, Date rollovers etc.

If you have a more specific question, Ill try to clarify.

nyc

-- nyc (nycnyc@hotmail.com), January 01, 2000.

Can this in any way affect power grid(s)?

-- Jim Young (jyoung@famvid.com), January 01, 2000.

Yeah, dude, everything's gonna blow up! Just like yesterday, just like the day before, just like tomorrow, just like the day after tomorrow! Run for the hills!!!!! (Hope you didn't return your Honda generator...).

-- Truk (truk@loa.moc), January 01, 2000.

IM not a power control expert, But I did work in process control for some time. Batch processing itself is more of a white collar computer task if you will. It should not adversely effct a power grid. It is possible tho that some screwy invetory control code which migh be part of batch processing, could overfill or under fill a tank. My feeling is tho that thats a situation which can be easily remedied through manual intervention.

-- nyc (nycnyc@hotmail.com), January 01, 2000.

Cool. White collar Y2K issues are less serious than good ol' blue collar Y2K issues. Where's that suit I keep around for weddins' and funerals?

-- Truk (truk@loa.moc), January 01, 2000.

Think of international and intra-national banking clearing and settlement -

This can be in realtime (debit cards) but in reality with regular transaction can take two to three days...

Remember Deutsche Bank 4 weeks ago? - nearly took down international payments...

you have been warned...

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), January 01, 2000.

I think that most companies will try to start the nightly batch processing before Monday since they have to do month-end and year-end processing and it would give them an extra day to know about any problems sooner than later. In addition, most nightly jobs are scheduled to kick off automatically if the system is up. Some are based on the existance of a file....as in, if file exists then run job. Since processing wasn't done last night if the system was down they have some catching up to do.

Problems would be with junk data being passed from one file to another. Not impossible to recover from, but time consuming pain and can't be fixed by resetting the clock back to 1972. We're not talking about power grid stuff here. This is billing, receivables, payables, mrp and the stuff that me@me.me is speculatling will honk up the banks.

-- urp (urp@urp.urp), January 01, 2000.

LOL, Hey I was lost for an analogy what can I say. But yeah white collar Y2k issues are less serious than blue collar Y2k issues, at least in my book

-- nyc (nycnyc@hotmail.com), January 01, 2000.

Dude, that's okay. I found my suit. Here's my question: Should I wear a red tie or a blue tie with my suit? Mama bought me one of each.

-- Truk (truk@loa.moc), January 01, 2000.

Is our old friend Mr. Henry Herstatt going to rear his ugly head?

The proverbial "turd" in the Y2K "punchbowl."

Bwaaaaahhhaaahaahahhhaaahaaahaa!!!

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), January 01, 2000.

MOst banks dont do batch over the weekends normally. The standard Y2k plan was to roll from 12/31 to 1/3 Friday night and then shut the system down across the rollover. Then the systems were restarted on the 1/3/2000 business date so any obvious bugs can be shaken out through testing over the weekend. 1/3/2000 batch will run Monday night.

-- nyc (nycnyc@hotmail.com), January 01, 2000.

Well the red tie is pure business, so if your doing the whitecollar computer system, its gotta be red. Dark blue ties on that light blue collar shirt is a classic as well, Hey 100,000 Law enforcement official cant be wrong :)

-- nyc (nycnyc@hotmail.com), January 01, 2000.

Dude, I got it! I'm a total genius!! I'll wear a tie with red and blue stripes!!!

Uh, oh. Crap. What color shoes do I wear?

-- Truk (truk@loa.moc), January 01, 2000.

Hey!!!!! There ya go!!!!! Shoes? Hey man this is a new millenium....... Green Hightop Canvas Converse are the only way to go

-- nyc (nycnyc@hotmail.com), January 02, 2000.

nyc, So the normal batch window for bank processing can handle 2 days worth of transactions? or will they catch up next weekend?

Mfg corporations are needing to get the missed runs in to get the plants going again.

-- urp (urp@urp.urp), January 02, 2000.

No, batch porcoessing is for one days worth of transactions. One business day can last multiple real days in certain scenarios however.

For test purposes A system day can be kept at 1/3/2000 for multiple days. Also in the area of weekend trading and the like many real days can be rolled into on system day. In this scenario, all trades are currently being entered as if it is monday. Although the actual system clock may cross many days, the Programs sense of what business day it is remains the same. Only when the batch completes does the program advance its date.

-- nyc (nycnyc@hotmail.com), January 02, 2000.

I predict BOTCHED batches.

nyc/Truk don't forget the sequined velvet open crotch thongs to set off the look...

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), January 02, 2000.

Should I get the matching open nipple bra?

-- Truk (truk@loa.moc), January 02, 2000.

All right, children, cut it out. The adults are trying to have a serious conversation. It's past your bedtime.

-- Barf (not@this.time), January 02, 2000.

Yes, Barf is right. You children go to sleep now.

-- Truk (truk@loa.moc), January 02, 2000.

To all:

That was my post and I have followups to posts in the original threads at:

Yes embeds are "non-issue" BUT IT will have its real rollover test TONIGHT here's why

and I gave my opinion with respect to the embeds in this thread:

Why nothing was ever going to happen with the embeds

nyc:

Just about every banks do overnights over the weekends (I know I was a CIO at a bank).

And you are correct the overnights will have no effect on power as these are business systems not process control systems, except to the extent if the billing system decides you're overdue and cuts you off like a regular non-paying customer. (I don't think that will happen because penalties won't get applied as we will have negative time in the calculations so penalty periods won't have "expired" yet - they will in about 100 years if you understand).

-- Interested Spectator (is@the_ring.side), January 02, 2000.

Are you all assuming that the banks all lied when they said they fixed and tested their systems?

You could be right of course. But you aren't (I'm wagering).

-- Mike (mike@noemail.net), January 02, 2000.