Where is all the Christmas music

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All the Christmas music that used to be on the big networks is missing. I just noticed it. What the heck is clhristian christmas music banned on those NBC ABC Fox CBS . Very weird world we live in now.

-- gay boling (wilber@montanasky.net), December 24, 1999

Answers

What the heck is clhristian christmas music banned on those NBC ABC Fox CBS .

Rip? Van Whinkle?

Where have you been?!

-- Anonymous99 (Anonymous99@Anonymous99.xxx), December 24, 1999.


I asked a question,

-- Gay Boling (wilber@montanasky.net), December 24, 1999.

I'd like to hear some Native American or how bout some Pagan music also, whatcha think ??

-- Duh (duh@duh.duh), December 24, 1999.

Tried to find Christmas music all week on the car radio--felt like I was on another planet were Christmas didn't exist.

-- Curly~Q (Curly@Q.com), December 24, 1999.

I asked a question,

Short answer? Yes.

Longer answer, since so many Jews, Moslems, Athiests, Hindus and Budists don't want to hear Christian "propaganda", businesses don't play it. What has changed? Immigration laws.

-- Anonymous99 (Anonymous99@Anonymous99.xxx), December 24, 1999.



I haven't heard nearly enough of the Cheech & Chong Santa Clause skit or "Walkin' Round in Women's Underwear" this year.

-- Gary S. (garys_2k@yahoo.com), December 24, 1999.

And in Seattle, I haven't heard Stan Boreson and the "Lutefisk" song once this year and my Viking heart is pining away....

-- Valkyrie (anon@please.xnet), December 24, 1999.

Christmas (1950) = Anniversary of the birth of the Christ Child. Music = What Child is This?, Silent Night, etc. Sponsored by: God.

Christmas (1999) = IT'S SHOPPING ORGY TIME!!!!! Music = More More More, Another One Bites the Dust, etc. Sponsored by: The Wall Street Journal.

-- Scrooge McDuck (Greed@Money.Manor), December 24, 1999.


i agree with your observations, just the other day few of our friends have gotten together and commented on the same case. Plenty of xmas music in shopping centers but you cannot really enjoy because of the craziness of the shoppers and the unprepardness of the stores. The only xmas music and concerts we see on maryland public Tv the major media broadcasting networks forgeot about xmas. Unfortunatelly we Americans are getting used to and satisfy with less and less quality in our lives and we do not even care. Marry xmas everyone.

-- jane smyth (wsch117360@aol.com), December 24, 1999.

Well I don't know exactly what kind of christian christmas music you mean. I just thought it was all Christmas music--like--. Here Comes Santa Clause-- Silent Night--The First Noel--I'll Be Home For Christmas--Frosty the Snowman-Ring Christmas Bells--Do You Hear What I Hear?--The Twelve Days of Christmas--Adeste Fidelis (sp)--I Saw Mommy Kissing Santa Claus. Or nowadays is it only spiritually correct to make a distinction between the two? And by the way, I've heard all of the above on the radio and TV, and many more.

-- gilda (jess@listbot.com), December 24, 1999.


I hate to tell you but this season was never originally about Jesus' birth, so 'christian carols' is a late addition. It was the time of the Winter Solstice; Sol Invictus & Mithra.

For the first 3 centuries, the Christian church did not know the birthday of their savior. They then tried to decide on a birthday. Some favored Epiphany and others the Mithraic winter-solstice festival called Dies Natalis Solis Invictus. There was also a Greek sun festival at this time and they also honored Attis, Dionysus, Osiris, Syrian Baal and other versions of the solar god/son. Pagan mysteries celebrated the birth of the Divine Child at the winter solstice. The Norse celbrated the birthday of their Lord, Frey and this became Yule. The night before this birth was called the Night of the Mother - originally a greater festival.

This date was adopted for Jesus birth because this was the day most people were used to calling this day a god's birthday.

All the other things that go with the holiday - gifts, lights, mistletoe, holly, carols, feasts and processions were TOTALLY pagan. Derived from worship of the Goddess as mother of the Divine Child. Christmas trees came from the pine groves attached to temples of the Great Mother.

So you see, if you'd really look at the history.....

-- Sheri (wncy2k@nccn.net), December 24, 1999.


maybe people have enough problems without having to listen to that sappy crap for 30 days in a row.

-- Inever (inevercheckmy@onebox.com), December 24, 1999.

In our currently pagan culture, Christians are sorta like white heterosexual males in that it's OK to be bigoted about them. As someone mentioned above, part of the problem is the 1965 Immigration Act that opened the floodgates to non-European immigrants, which has dramatically changed the ethnic makeup of the country and will make European-Americans, who have dominated and essentially created the fundamental culture of the U.S., merely one of several competing minorities here in about 30 years. Welcome to the United States of Bosnia.

-- cody (cody@y2ksurvive.com), December 25, 1999.

I'm finding myself - much to my own surprise - getting extremely fond of Bilderberger Conrad Black's latest Canadian 'launch', the National Post newspaper, for its unashamed willingness to be politically incorrect in matters of faith as they touch on public policy or events.

After all, could you imagine an editorial like this in the New York Times or the Washington Post? It's like a delicious throwback to an earlier, more certain era, when truths were shared and celebrated by an entire culture with thankfulness and confidence.

Kudos to the Editors of the National Post for this, and to their similarly-minded editorial colleagues at the Ottawa Citizen, another Conrad Black paper...

Friday, December 24, 1999

Christmas

National Post, Toronto

Christmas is not the most important feast in the Christian calendar. That distinction belongs to Easter which commemorates the central mystery of Christianity, the Resurrection of Christ, on the truth of which every other Christian claim depends. But Christmas has for many centuries been the most popular Christian festival.

It is a festival that is genuinely celebrated -- with hymns in church and with carols in malls. It is the happy excuse for scattered families to come together again, for friends to gather over a drink, for neighbours to light up their houses, and above all for children to lie awake for Santa until, eventually, their eyelids sink and mysteriously their presents arrive.

No one can match children in their enjoyment of Christmas, of course, but common observation suggests that very few people are unaffected by the spirit of goodwill as Christmas approaches. Never are shop assistants more harried, yet never are they so obliging; never are bars and restaurants more stressful, never more cheerful; never are strangers more welcoming; never are adults so full of childhood memories.

To be sure, earlier civilizations have invented festivals to mark the winter solstice and to cheer themselves up before the curtain of winter definitively descends. Much of our present Christmas in Canada was invented by Charles Dickens over a century ago in London. Many of the snow flaked images that spring into our mind at the word "Christmas" were first conceived under the Hollywood sun in films like Frank Capra's It's a Wonderful Life.

But the peculiar magic of Christmas -- and the special joy it evokes from children -- surely derives in part from the fact that it is a child's birthday. Few secular festivals mark an event so humble as the birth of a baby in a barn; none mark an event so extraordinary as the birth of God as Man. The children who glance at a Nativity scene before running home to open their presents, and then to break them, know that Jesus Christ was once, like them, a child in a family. And if God could assume the helplessness of a child, surely we can all strive to recover the innocence of one -- at least for Christmas Day.

We wish our readers a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

[ENDS]

-- John Whitley (jwhitley@inforamp.net), December 25, 1999.


[This newspaper has a better grasp on theology than many modern 'preachers' I've suffered under:)!]

Friday, December 24, 1999

The Christ of the Gospels - or of the Seminar?
Some researchers claim that everything you learned about Jesus in Sunday school is wrong

Corbin Andrews
National Post, Toronto

As Christmas rolls around, television producers are dusting off the reels of made-for-TV specials promising to reveal "the real Jesus." Not one to stand apart from the crowd, the A&E network aired a special edition of their popular Biography program last Sunday night, focusing on the life of Jesus.

The intent of the show, as the endless trailers promoting the program noted, was to re-examine the life of Jesus in the light of "new evidence." This was going to be a historically accurate, unbiased reconstruction of his life using only the most up-to-date historical research. The trailers made it apparent that viewers would be in for some surprises. Even so, upon watching the program, many viewers would have been shocked to learn that just about everything they learned about Jesus in Sunday school is wrong.

For example, the show's producers strongly suggest that many scholars now believe Jesus was married -- a nugget of information that has been gleaned from the New Testament itself. During St. John's account of the marriage at Cana -- at which Jesus performs the miracle of turning water into wine -- both Jesus and his mother feel comfortable instructing the servants to fetch the water. This, some say, is proof that this wedding was in fact Jesus' own and that the servants were also his own. If this isn't the case, why would his mother command the servants? You don't just show up at other people's functions and treat their staff as your own. Of course, it also begs the question: How many carpenters in first-century Palestine had a bevy of servants at their disposal?

The "authorities" presented on the program to back up this peculiar hypothesis are authors, Michael Baigent, Henry Lincoln, Richard Leigh -- the researchers responsible for penning Holy Blood, Holy Grail. This book has been generally dismissed as pure quackery, on par with musings about healing crystals and numerology. Yet, the program did not mention the fact that the vast majority of scholars actually reject the Jesus marriage hypothesis, as well as the countless other unsupported claims about Jesus made by Mr. Baigent and his cohorts.

Moving to the only slightly more reputable Robert W. Funk, founder of the Jesus Seminar, and other experts, the program investigates the reliability of the Gospels as historical sources. From this highly edited montage of selected expert statements, the producers give the impression that the Gospels are unreliable bits of mythology with little or no historical validity. But the program paints only a part of the picture. And that picture is being painted by a comparatively small group of scholars, such as Robert Funk and his colleagues within the Jesus Seminar.

The Jesus Seminar is a group of scholars who convene a few times a year to decide what Jesus did and did not say. Their hallmark contribution to the current debate about the "historical Jesus" was the publication of a book called The Five Gospels: The Search for the Authentic Words of Jesus. In this book, seminar scholars dissect the words attributed to Jesus in the four traditional Gospels, as well as those in the apocryphal Gospel of Thomas (which most scholars dismiss as unreliable). Using colour coding, the scholars determine what Jesus really said and what he didn't. The colour coding breaks down as follows: Words in red are accurate, pink words are close to what Jesus really said, grey words capture the spirit of his words, and black words mean he didn't say it.

And how does this distinguished body of scholars decide what Jesus actually said? Individual passages are voted on, by seminar members, based on their subjective interpretations.

It is the musings of these scholars, and others like them that attracts the media's attention. Having added nothing substantial to the debate about the real Jesus, the seminar fellows are media darlings, always ready with an easy-to-digest quote or pithy refutation of accepted facts. As it is, virtually every mainstream TV show or magazine that approaches the topic of Jesus' life is contaminated by their assumptions, the chief assumption being that the Jesus presented in the Gospels bears little resemblance to the real man who lived among us 2,000 years ago. Moreover, the fellows claim, there is little to back up the accounts of the Gospel writers.

Yet the seminar fellows' opinions generally fly in the face of current historical research. Despite the seminar's contrary position, the vast majority of mainline, university-employed scholars agree that there is more ancient historical evidence for Jesus than any other figure in the ancient world. Jesus is mentioned no less than 5,000 times in at least 45 unique texts -- far more than Marc Anthony, Alexander the Great or the Emperor Nero -- dating to before the middle of the first century and many dating to within 30 years of his death. Thus, the Gospel accounts are verified by more independent sources than any other documents in ancient history.

The textual evidence for the resurrection of Christ, alone, is staggering. This event is mentioned in 28 ancient sources, 12 of which are non-Christian. These references contribute to the basis of facts about Jesus that nearly every Biblical scholar -- Christian or skeptic -- accepts without reserve. According to E. P. Sanders, these "almost indisputable facts" range from Jesus' baptism by John the Baptist to his crucifixion at the hands of the Roman authorities.

The current state of historical research into the life of Jesus, perhaps to the surprise of television viewers everywhere, is pretty much what it has always been. Most scholars agree with the authority of the New Testament as an accurate historical record.

Christians often get queasy whenever scholars begin to dissect the Gospels. But Christianity is a faith based on history. We claim that a single historical event has forever changed our relationship with God, and that is a claim we should expect to be scrutinized. The producers at A&E, and others of their ilk, hope to present a picture of Jesus that is exciting and new. But their tinkering with history -- quoting from texts that are rejected by almost all true academics and presenting the fanciful stories of those with questionable credentials -- renders a portrait of a man who seems bland and fairly innocuous. The Jesus Seminar and the members of the media who fawn over it have attempted to create a Jesus who is about as exciting as a university professor.

In the words of Darrell L. Bock, a professor of New Testament studies at Dallas Theological Seminary: "Too little of the real live Jesus shows through in [the Jesus Seminar's] work. So little emerges that one wonders how their Jesus ever generated the level of hostility he received from the [religious authorities] or the total loyalty procured from his disciples."

The real Jesus turned the world on its head, upsetting and confounding the religious leaders of his day and inspiring his followers to surrender their lives to become martyrs. In fact, he was held in such high regard that it was considered better to kill him than allow him to continue exerting influence. And even that, according to the historical evidence, was not enough to stop him. How's that for escaping the ordinary?

[ENDS]

-- John Whitley (jwhitley@inforamp.net), December 25, 1999.



[And, finally, from the same issue, this excellent column...]

Friday, December 24, 1999

The ghost of Christmas present
God is under attack by the state, the courts, the intellectuals and pop culture

Mark Steyn
National Post, Toronto

Today is Christmas Eve, when Christians prepare to celebrate, according to Hillary Rodham Clinton, "the birth of a homeless child." Even those with a hazy grip on Scripture are usually aware that Jesus was the son of a working carpenter, and, generally speaking, carpenters are among the least likely professions to find themselves with no fixed abode. Senator-elect Rodham had political reasons for conscripting the Christ child's parents to the ranks of the homeless, since they're currently being swept off New York's streets by her opponent, Mayor Giuliani. But, despite having to make do with humbler accommodations, Joseph and Mary were not homeless, merely travelling from their place of residence in Nazareth to register and pay their taxes in Bethlehem. On balance, being forced to journey to the town of your birth to pay taxes sounds more like a Democratic Party idea to me.

Mrs. Clinton was speaking at the New York Theological Seminary, where you'd think some of the audience would have objected to her woeful trivialization. But even the religious professionals are reluctant to speak up for their trade these days. In the commercials for his weekly show, Montreal radio host Father John Walsh boasts, "They say a priest who doesn't talk about God is an oxymoron. Well, I've been called worse." I'm sure. Father John reminds me of the Right Reverend Reverend Wright, a spoof radio vicar on the BBC a few years ago, who used to begin his program by cooing, "On today's show, we'll be talking to some pop stars about their charity work, doing a feature on women's shelters, attacking the government for its heartless cuts. Oh and just a little bit of religion, but not too much, so please don't switch off."

But you can't really parody the public face of the Christian ministry these days. A year or two back, the Church of England's Easter poster showed the resurrected Jesus jumping out at His disciples and shouting, "Surprise, Surprise!" To be fair, at least it kept faith, however crassly, with Christianity's big idea. This year, the Church is using celebrities to sell religion to Godless Britain with the slogan: "Religion is dead: God isn't religious -- why should you be?" The clergy seem to have evolved from the Right Reverend Reverend Wright's sheepish "just a little bit of religion" to arguing that religion isn't really religion at all, so don't worry about that unpleasant, pejorative term: It's just a way of being all nice and fluffy to homeless people, and where's the harm in that? Instead of proclaiming its transcendent message -- that "man will live forevermore because of Christmas Day," as Harry Belafonte put it in those more confident times a mere 40 years ago -- the Church has taken the position that, to paraphrase Bill Clinton, the era of big religion is over, but if we're sufficiently coy and euphemistic about it we might get away with a few bits of little religion that are enough to keep us in business.

If it's just a matter of generalized compassion rather than faith, it's no wonder that the preferred mode of public expression is to pick'n'mix religious morsels: And may all your Hanukkahs be white. For example, if Mrs. Clinton's grasp of the Gospels seems a little shaky, it may be because, not content with passing herself off as a New Yorker, the hitherto Methodist first lady has also decided that she's a born-again Jew. As she told Democratic Jews in New York, she recently discovered she has Jewish blood. Coincidentally or not, the nation's First Yiddisher Momma skipped this year's lighting of the National Christmas Tree in Washington, which she usually attends, but made sure she attended the lighting of the White House menorah, which she usually skips. She's the first Jewish girl in the Oval Office since... well, Monica, come to think of it. Happy Hanukkah, Hill. Happy Monica, Bill.

Likewise, presidential candidate and Utah Senator Orrin Hatch told the Republican Jewish Council that he's worn a mezuzah every day for the last 15 years. The Salt Lake City boy was going down a storm until his concentration wandered. "Throughout my entire career," he continued, "I have stood unwaveringly and unhesitatingly on this principle: that a united and indivisible Jerusalem is the capital of the state of Utah." He hastily explained that he meant the state of Israel, much to the relief of the stunned crowd: It's bad enough sharing the town with the Muslims, but who let the Mormons in?

In his spare time, Senator Hatch writes lyrics for best-selling Christian country groups, and his song, Jesus' Love Is Like A River, was recently recorded by Gladys Knight, though without her Pips. When The New York Times pointed out the dearth of good Hanukkah songs, Mr. Hatch offered to write one, which he hopes to have ready before the New York primary. Apparently, it never occurred to the Mormon senator that it might be better if the meaning of Hanukkah were to be articulated by a believer.

But that's increasingly the message of a "multi-faith" society: If you have to believe in something, believe in everything. Thus, Britain's Labour government, in planning for its "Millennium Dome," originally intended that its official centrepiece for the third millennium of the birth of Christ (give or take a year) would have no Christian element at all. After some protests, it was agreed there would be (in New Labour-speak) a "spirit level" that would acknowledge "2,000 years of Christianity in a multi-faith New Britain." The architect, Eva Jiricna, resisted calls to include Christian symbols in the "Spirit Zone," saying God was "irrelevant," but was forced to modify her plans because the company building the dome, the New Millennium Experience, was unable to find sponsors. As chief executive Jennie Page explained, "We won't get the Spirit Zone sponsored unless we come to terms with organized religions."

So now visitors to Greenwich will pass through a "mist curtain" into a large tent divided into 12 "elements," of which one will be Christian. A "mist curtain" is a fine image for the moist blur of contemporary religiosity. The conventional wisdom is that the suppression of Christian references, even from the official anniversary of the "Christian era," is necessary to avoid insensitivity to Jews, Muslims and Hindus. In my experience, Jews, Muslims and Hindus tend to be relaxed about expressions of Christianity: As believers themselves, they'd feel more comfortable in a pro-Christian environment than an anti-religious one. But so- called multiculturalists care no more for Hindus than they do for Christians: It's just that poor old demoralized Christianity makes an easier target. For a telling glimpse of how our more "tolerant" society really feels, consider the latest judgment of the Quebec Human Rights Commission: For years, the town of Outremont and the Montreal Urban Community have begun their respective meetings with a prayer. The commission has just ruled that both municipal bodies have to cease this practice by Jan. 7. But, more than that, both jurisdictions are required to make formal acknowledgment that their tradition of asking for divine guidance was "offensive." Happy Holidays to you, too.

Nonetheless, even in the secular West, many people feel a need for that "spirit level." Sir Cliff Richard, Tony Blair's "spiritual advisor," has just released a pop single called the Millennium Prayer -- the words of the Lord's Prayer set to the tune of Auld Lang Syne. Sir Cliff, for those who are mercifully unacquainted with his oeuvre, is Britain's longest-lasting and most uncool pop star, and also the country's most famous celibate. He hasn't had sex since 1958, and, even in that landmark year, he only did it twice. The bonk- crazy Brits revere him in some strange totemic way, as if his chasteness somehow licenses their own non-stop trouser-dropping. He's the only pop star to have had Number One hits in every decade since the 1950s, and had his heart set on notching up one more in "the new Millennium." But, when Sir Cliff approached EMI, whose coffers he has enriched for 41 years, with the idea for his "Auld Lord's Lang Prayer Syne," they told him that, while they'd have been willing to go along with, say, the words of I've Got A Lovely Bunch Of Coconuts set to the tune of Beethoven's Choral Symphony, in modern Britain a religious single hadn't a prayer. George Michael popped his head round the men's room door long enough to attack Sir Cliff and advise record buyers to purchase instead the re-release of John Lennon's Imagine. "Imagine there's no Heaven," sang John, "and no religion, too." No need to imagine anymore: In modern Britain, it's here.

Sir Cliff left EMI, released his Millennium Prayer on another label and, despite being banned from every radio playlist up and down the land, got to Number One just before Christmas. John Lennon once said the Beatles were bigger than Jesus Christ. Not on the pop charts. Sir Cliff may be irredeemably "naff" (as the British say), but, if his sentimental religiosity is the only antidote to what Professor John Casey calls "the philistine knees-up" of the faux Millennium, so be it.

Still, I think Jesus would be pleasantly surprised to find that, in Anno Domini 1999, seven of the eight Republican and Democrat presidential candidates talk about him at the drop of a hat. True, Bill Clinton also talks incessantly about God -- or rather, more proprietorially, "my God," a slightly dodgier concept. At the end of the 1996 Easter service, the president came down the steps brandishing, as always, his Bible and waving it to the crowds. Then he went back to the Oval Office, where Monica was waiting. I don't know what his plans for Christmas are, but his days as a presidential Jim Bakker, the mawkish televangelist with the career-detonating hooker scandal, are numbered. This election season, Americans are returning from Bill Clinton's God to the more conventional deities favoured by Dubya, Orrin, John McCain, Gary Bauer, Steve Forbes, Alan Keyes and even Al Gore. And their professed faith is itself remarkable given the onslaughts God has come under from the state, the courts, the intellectuals and popular culture. It's early days but He may even survive the Quebec Human Rights Commission. Happy Holidays!

[ENDS]

-- John Whitley (jwhitley@inforamp.net), December 25, 1999.


This is my opinion. Take it or leave it.....When the pagans swear... using Christs name, it is because they sense the power in that name. Try saying it. It is powerful. That is why Jesus Christ is such a threat to the pagans. Thier whole aim is to destroy the rememberance of him, because they are afraid of him. Why are they not afraid of an islamic, or hindu or so on. There is no power there. The energy that God has created can not be destroyed by men...even the scientists will tell you that. I beleive what I beleive and you beleive what you beleive, let us stop fighting one another and let each other live with his own beliefs. Put on the pagan music for those who cherish it, and leave some space for the Christians. Lets not be so intolerant.

-- Gay Boling (wilber@montanasky.net), December 25, 1999.

Cody, Amen! Thank you John!,

Christus Victor! Solo Christus!,

BR,

FSI!

-- brother rat (rldabney@usa.net), December 25, 1999.


1965 Immigration Act...that's a laugh....what about the 1865 Immigration Act, you know...round up & kill all the Indians & Spanish west of the Missisippi & take their land. You Manifest Destiny Americans are laughable. Yes, welcome to Sarajevo, but the tolerant people of all races who lived there were the ones who had to die at the hands of the intolerant. Just like Jesus...

Yours in Christ the Savior of ALL RACES, INEVER

-- INever (fail to be amused) (Inevercheckmy@onebox.com), December 26, 1999.


I am always amazed that Christians claim to be persecuted when they are in fact the majority religion and get their message out as much as they wish. They seem to think that if they cannot use the instrument of government to cram their beliefs down everyone's throat, that they are being treated unfairly.

Mr. Whitley: I have read a certain amount about the historical Jesus. What I have read is that the only early reference to Jesus in a non-Christian source is the works of Josephus, and the reference there is very indirect. There are no Roman tax records, trial transcripts, etc. I would appreciate any source or reference that shows otherwise. This is a real email address - you may send it to me.

-- kermit (colourmegreen@hotmail.com), December 26, 1999.


Hey Kermit! You hit the nail on the head. Christians have shoved religion down the world's throats for ages, whether the world wanted it or not. Now that people are speaking up, the Christians are squalling like mashed banshees about their supposed persecution. Baloney.

INever, ahh yes. Manifest Destiny: a license to kill anyone or anything that stands in the way. Christians know more ways to kill other people, and snuff out theirr cultures and their religions than 007 could ever dream up.

Sheri, thanks for posting about Christians usurping all the pagan ceremonies. Persecution of Christians. Bah Humbug!

-- gilda (jess@listbot.com), December 26, 1999.


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