**DELETED THREAD** "Prostitution and Y2K in the post Y2k economy"

DELETED THREAD "Prostitution and Y2K in the post Y2k economy"

greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) Deleted Thread : One Thread

This thread is VERY long, and won't post in one piece, so I will splice it in. All comments from me will be in RED. I thought it would be a good insite into what MANY of the Timebombers think... to the moderators credit, the did delete this thread. Now it is here for posterity.

Prostitution and Y2K in the post Y2k economy
greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread

Let me first state that I have spent most of my entire life traveling around the world. I was a military brat to a pilot father, and as an adult work for a company that has sent me to 22 different countries. In the majority of the 3rd world countries I have lived in and visited, prostitution is the way that the women survive, due to economic hardships. Here in the USA after Y2K how many women are going to prostitute themselves for a loaf of bread?

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@yahoo.com), September 20, 1999

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999

Answers

CONTINUED

And how many men would FORCE a woman to do that to themselves in exchange for a little bit of food.

-- hamster (hamster@mycage.com), September 20, 1999.
Prostitution post y2k? Yeah, it's called rape. Get armed.

-- CygnusXI (noburnt@toast.net), September 20, 1999.
I suspect that many women will trade "favors" for food, shelter, tampons, etc. if things get really bad in 2000 and beyond. They may not start walking the streets (too dangerous) but a single woman or single mother may well find a man or two who will drop by occasionally with some groceries or other needed supplies and she may deem it prudent to give him something in return. This is human nature and common sense. Is it prostitution? Depends on the perspective of the viewer I suppose.

-- cody varian (cody@y2ksurvive.com), September 20, 1999.

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999.

CONTINUED

there are many type of protistutes.. Have you ever heard the term "corporate whore"??? to me no difference than the traditional protistitute...

-- kergan (debunker415@hotmail.com), September 20, 1999.
Hey Cody, are you putting away a little "extra"?

-- (for@favor.com), September 20, 1999.
After the fall of "The Wall" in Berlin, my roomate used to cruise the refugee camp with a case of Campbell's soup, two cartons of Marlboro, and a loaf of Wonderbread. Needless to say he got a LOT of 'dates' this way, and eventually found a fine wife. (You gotta understand the man was a complete troll...like the creature, not the lurker...nasty lookin' hairy an' gruesome!) Welcome to the oldest profession!

-- Billy-Boy (Rakkasn@Yahoo.com), September 20, 1999.
Prostitution equals all kinds of disease--you know, the gamut. Only the stupid engage in it. Better to die of starvation than AIDS or live with the emotional torment. This is not a good thing. It's called degradation for a reason.

-- Mara Wayne (MaraWayne@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
Oldest profession is gardening.

-- enough is (enough@enough.com), September 20, 1999.
Hey, if she's hungry and willing I might consider a beans and rice dinner in exchange for a little Wango-Tango. Yeah, Bartertown 2000!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 20, 1999.
Mr. Friendly,
In spite of the complete failure of this thread to tickle the funnybone, I would desperately hope your post was, at least, intended as humor. In either case, you must surely represent a complete waste of human flesh for you possess neither heart nor soul and were obviously placed on this planet to merely fertilize the soil of bad taste. Are you really that deficient that you need to barter for it from someone desperate?
HEY SYSOP!!!!!! WHY HASNT THIS THREAD BEEN DELETED????? DONT YOU PEOPLE PAY ATTENTION????

-- Jake (Jake@reality.com), September 20, 1999.
MOST women are going to be ticked off by this.
cody: "This is human nature and common sense"
Well, if by common sense, you mean the decision to starve to death or live...walnut or world domination Pinky! Duh.
If you are talking about human nature, wherein, a man who can't think beyond his pathetic winkie boytoy, and doesn't have enough REAL man in his pants to help someone without some kind of survival blackmail tactic, and the fact that he could find any satisfaction out of deluding himself that there is anything more intimate about this than his taking a dump, then yah, I agree... human nature.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
Mumsie you hit the nail on the proverbial head. 'Lest we drop down to their level of thought. Although I am a man, I have made an observation:
Most men are pigs...IMHO.
Say we do experience TEOTWAWKI and it gets really bad. If a woman were to approach me with such a 'deal', I would graciously decline, feed her, and send her on her way. The aforementioned "dividends" by themselves should be a deterrent all by itself, without going into the emotional side of it. (Not to mention Mrs. Dog might have a problem with it...)
jerky treats...mmmmmmm...
The Dog

-- Dog (Desert Dog@-sand.com), September 20, 1999.
"Hey, if she's hungry and willing I might consider a beans and rice dinner in exchange for a little Wango-Tango"
Why doesn't this surprise me? In your case, I would suggest stocking up on more than beans and rice to achieve your pathetic goal. Better try lobster, caviar, and some gold and silver. Then maybe you'll get "lucky".
Those who "can", have rip roaring intimacy with their wives,... those who "can't", brag and resort to blackmail/prostitution.
By the way, don't forget to have some penicillin on hand. Too bad about the other incurable STD's (and AIDS). You sound like just the type of idiot who would play Sex/Russian roulette and creepy enough not care what you spread to others.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
Hooray for Dogs!
Another reason I'm glad I'm a dog lover (have six of them)!
Yeah, congratulate me on our two baby Newfies!

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999.

CONTINUED

Ooooooooooh Mumsie!
Do I detect a bit of frustration in your tone? Not gettin much lately huh? You must be one of those butt-ugly feminists who are always bitchin about men because the high school quarterback never asked you out on a date. Hey I'm talkin about a nice agreeable commodities exchange here, and I know plenty of women who would love to indulge me. You don't understand men, and with your attitude you'll never get the chance. Go back to your dogs, maybe they could manage to get it up for ya!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 20, 1999.
Oh well now, look at all the self-righteousness coming out of the woodwork.
Mr. Friendly, define "prostitution".
I think a raw nerve has been struck because of the words "prostitution" and "women" in the same sentence. Cody was on to something but he should have expanded more.
How about if we also ask how many MEN will resort to prostitution (losely defined) also? Men as well as women resort to prostitution of the mind and body when desperate. There are many shades of color in prostitution, Corporate Prostitute was an example. If you think only of the hooker on the street trying to earn a living you're missing the point.
Now if we don't use the word prostitution, but instead "sexual favors", "emotional attachment/bonds", we can see where many women would use whatever is in their advantage to survive and provide for their offsprings if single. When you think of it, the husband/wife arrangement is sexual in nature, the man will protect his female partner as long as sex is coming relatively regularly. Take away the sex completely and divorce won't be long to ensue for most American men (there are the execptionally committed no matter what I realize that.)
A single women using wisely her sexual power for survival is healthy and intended by nature, simple as that.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
ROTFLMAO!
Pathetic bragging from aaa. I suppose you think my SEVEN children came from immaculate conception.
"commodities exchange"
You made my point. You can't achieve intimacy, so you have to use pitiful means to fulfill your 'wham bam thank you maam'. Guess that isn't enough to hold a real relationship for you. How sad.
You're right about one thing, I didn't go out with the quarterback, my highschool boyfriend was the center. Tell your sad tale to your little winkie in one of your one man love fests. Loser.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
Chris is right as rain as usual but this thread still needs to be deleted.

-- lisa (lisa@work.now), September 20, 1999.
Still laughing!
aaa "I know plenty of women who would love to indulge me"
Do they still have their own teeth? Ha ha, I know of women who wanted to marry Richard Ramirez, Jeffrey Dahmer and Charles Manson. Whatever you can scrape up buddy!

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
Hamster and mumsie,
I think I know what has got your panties in a wad. If either of you HAD to survive on your "womanly charms", you would starve. Oh by the way, I'm female......just sick of your remarks. Every time a man posts something you don't like, you start name calling and belittling. So who's the sexist anyway?
On second thought, who cares? Next year you are both most likely toast.

-- girl with a 'tude (getoffyour@highhorse.com), September 20, 1999.
BTW Chris, when you stated
"where many women would use whatever is in their advantage to survive and provide for their offsprings if single"
I agree, and please notice that I am not passing judgement on those who do what they must. The original post was not about adults forging a mutually beneficial 'relationship'. That is a different story. Only a Clintonian definition of 'relationship' could apply to prostitution. I am scorning those men/women who think they are doing someone a favor by exchanging food for sex, rather than having the decency to help someone in dire need. I am saying that most women would prefer not to risk STD's and AIDS to feed themselves and/or their children, and should not be reduced to that. Men who would take advantage of this are, as Dog said, pigs.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
girl with a tude, ....what do you think will become of you in time if all you rely on is your youth and your "womanly charms"? Classic examples... how many times have women considered to be among the world's most beautiful been married and divorced (and cheated on)? Who holds Elizabeth Taylor's hand at night? It takes more than temporal beauty/charms to engage a heart. I have been told I was 'beautiful' by many men. I waited for the man who saw me as beautiful when I'm tired, sick, pregnant or at my best. Don't sell yourself short.
My good friend died of AIDS. I have seen what irresponsible sex can do. Sex was meant to be intimate, heart and soul, not just a body pleasure twitch.
Sleeping well in Idaho...

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
ROTFLMAO Mumsie!!
You're obviously steamed, and obviously have an inferiority complex. Just because you're stuck in your go-nowhere marriage with 7 brats doesn't mean you should condemn everyone who has the freedom to enjoy themselves. I can tell where you definitely got it wrong - Men, no matter how hard they try, cannot make the connection between sex and intimacy. I am perfectly capable of intimacy, but it has NOTHING to do with sex! Why some women always require the two to be together ...I'll never know.
Chris and Girl with a Tude understand and accept it - why don't you.
Girl with a Tude,
Right on Girl!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 20, 1999.
why is it a problem anyway? In almost every civilized (sic) country with the exception of the U.S. and some other uptight 'waspie' countries, Prostitution is not only legal, but encouraged! Get off the puritanical High Horse and face the facts gang. "It" is a commodity, and some women are willing to "sell" it. Whether for fun (or profit!) its gonna happen come Bartertown, or a whole lotta nothing...

-- Billy-Boy (Rakkasn@Yahoo.com), September 20, 1999.
aaa: "I am perfectly capable of intimacy, but it has NOTHING to do with sex!"
aaa = Clinton

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
Trading favors for food is not prostitution , Its basic survival! But I fear the greatest practioners are the political hacks and corporate greedheads who have poisoned,sold out,and lied to us for so long! the only difference between them and hookers is that the hookers exchange pleasure for money while the hacks only take and give no pleasure.

-- old kahuna (somethingsup@paradise.com) , September 20, 1999.
Mumsie,
You made my point. You can't achieve intimacy, so you have to use pitiful means to fulfill your 'wham bam thank you maam'. Guess that isn't enough to hold a real relationship for you. How sad.
You don't understand that for guys, sex does NOT always equal intimacy. In my younger years I had lots of one night stands with women who I didn't care about and who didn't care about me. I didn't feel exploited and neither did they. We both got something out it and had no regerets.
I've never cheated on my wife of 15 years (when I take an oath before God and family I stick to it) but I have a very good friend (since childhood) who has had numerous affairs. His wife knows about it and condones it (she has told me this herself). I never could understand this till I saw an episode of the Sopranos on HBO where Tony Sopranos wife said "I don't care about the bimbos. It's just another form of masterbation."
For alot of women (our First Lady included) it appears that extramarital sex is OK as long as there is no emotion attached. For most guys, that's not a problem...
-TECH32-

-- TECH32 (TECH32@NOMAIL.COM), September 20, 1999.
Tech32... I understand what you are saying. I agree that sex does not always equal intimacy. I am saying that sex on that level (prostitution) is not intimacy, that it is similar to using a pay toilet. If men think that prostitutes enjoy sex with johns, they are the biggest kind of a fool. Prostitutes are paid to pretend. I don't condemn them. I despise the men who SNEAK off to USE them, and then irresponsibly go back to their protected cushy little lives, spreading disease to their loyal spouses, and deluding themselves that they gave 'pleasure' in exchange for money. They paid for the illusion. Most men are totally blind when it comes to what's in their shorts (and every woman knows it), but a man who would withhold something like food until he gets his jollies is the lowest. There are many unhealthy marriages out there, the Clintons are a prime example. Would it matter to YOUR wife if you cheated, and if so, WHY? There is a difference between what most women might tolerate and what they would prefer. It is grossly unloving to subject a spouse to the dangers of incurable and life threatening STD's. My bottom line of contention is with a person who would use life sustaining things to get sex. What if that man found himself starving, or saw his child/loved one starving, but Mr. Smith won't help him unless he bends over first? No big deal? Just a little pleasure for food?

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999.

CONTINUED

Their eyes are painted billboards. Posters adverising The sincerity of flesh.
They cheat you, These girls who dance in the night.
They say, Love for sale, But when you look inside, You find they have left you With only their loneliness.
How do they have such commodity?
They must surely take it in trade From men like me.
-----------Canyon Walls 1986

-- Lon Frank (lgal@exp.net), September 20, 1999.
@@@@@ and TECH, before you get me wrong I have to clarify something.
Young women especially, EXPECT emotional attachment from the men they have sex with. If you didn't understand that and apparently @@@@@@ still doesn't, you have hurt a lot of young women's hearts, no matter if they made you think they were happy with one night stands.
Women expect emotional attachment to some level with sex purposedly because it is this attachment, and not the act of sex itself, that will be beneficial to her protection and survival. That is why women cannot enjoy sex without intimacy at some level. The more intimate and secure a woman is with her partner, the more she can enjoy sex. Hookers are but actresses, they don't enjoy sex with johns and will use elaborate mental coping mechanisms just to survive that moment (try reading real life memoirs of porn stars and hookers, they're not found in porn mags). The money is the security/benefit from the act.
So anyone who thought they "pleased" one night stand women sexually are self-deluded in the most profound way.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
Mumsie,"prostitutes are paid to pretend!" Some of us might just enjoy the work once in a while!

-- vegas dollie (easyliving@onmyback.com), September 20, 1999.
Correction, I should have said "apparently TECH still doesn't..."

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
Mr. Friendly, Cody, and @: This is a truly pathetic discussion. Are any of you saleable?
DELETE, PLEASE.

-- wouldn't have you on the end of a stick (small@penis.syndrome), September 20, 1999.
"Men, no matter how hard they try, cannot make the connection between sex and intimacy. I am perfectly capable of intimacy, but it has NOTHING to do with sex!"
@@@@@, I can only assume that you are relatively young and have a strong libido clouding your mind. It is true that sex for men is an urge that must be satisfied, but be careful not to mix having sex with lovemaking. Talk to other men and ask them the difference in satisfaction/intensity they get when they make love vs just f***ing. " Why some women always require the two to be together ...I'll never know." As I explained above, now you know.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
Mumsie, LOVE? Bawaaaaaahaaaaaaaa! did anyone consider we just might need an oil change to keep the pipes clean

-- pipefitter (oldinandoutie@yahooooo.com), September 20, 1999.
Note to those crying for this thread to be deleted: Marital disfunctions and lack of intimacy happens because of people's reluctance (even wanting to completely blocking it out such as in your case) to discuss this very issue openly.
American society in general is very disfunctional when it comes to sex exactly because the word itself is taboo, and so is anything related to the word, such as prostitution. And anything taboo is abused and misused in dark alleys.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
Chris,
You shouldn't make assumptions, they are usually wrong. I never said that it couldn't be more rewarding when there IS an emotional attachment, just that people like Mumsie are missing out on a lot of fun because of theri hangups about "intimacy". And although I tend to agree with your ideas in general I don't think you can realistically make such general statements about ALL women as though their are no exceptions. I have on several occasions had encounters with women who wanted nothing more than sex and had no interest in emotional ties.

-- @ (@@@.@), September 20, 1999.
Just ignore those "Kenneth Starr" deleter fans who have hangups talking about sex. The moderators do not delete things unless they contain the seven deadlies and in that case they can delete the individual responses. We can talk about SEX all we want!! SEX SEX SEX!!!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 20, 1999.
Chris,
I want the thread deleted because a**hole posts do not belong on this forum, the attraction value of that particular orifice notwithstanding. BTW, if you're going to play therapist, the spelling you want is "dysfunctional".

-- not reluctant, just fed up (small@penis.syndrome), September 20, 1999.
I want it deleted because while mildly interesting, it is inflammatory and way F off-topic.
Note that I agree with you entirely, Chris.

-- lisa (lisa@work.now), September 20, 1999.
@@@@@, my "assumptions" about women and sex are more "educated guesses", and unlike yours, come from being a woman who know women and feel like a woman. Educate yourself in sociology/psychology and pay perticular attention to sex and relationships.
Not Reluctant, thanks for correcting my spelling, I tend to get sloppy with it when in an interesting discussion and couldn't bother to use a spell checker. I'm not trying to play therapist, I'm simply comfortable with sex and will discuss it at any opportunity I get. Must be my french blood ;-) A-hole posts abound in this forum unfortunately, I don't let that bother me when the subject is interesting.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
Did anyone happen to catch the Giants-Redskins game yesterday?

-- Dave (aaa@aaa.com), September 20, 1999.
Lisa, the thread subject itself is very on-topic: "Prostitution and Y2K in the post Y2k economy". We're simply getting deeper into the subject with each post.
To get back more on-topic, I'll offer my opinion that I expect indeed that prostitution, the hooker on the street kind, as well as every other kind, will increase as the economy declines. It's a no-brainer. As the economy declines and the fragil social fabric holding morals and safety of person/property begins to rip, the scums of this earth will be more visible, in both sexes.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
Maybe the original question should have been, do you think extreme hunger in the USA due to Y2K will lead some women to this kind of behavior?

-- Sir Laughsalot (laughin@outloud.com), September 20, 1999.
Pre-meditated opportunistic predatory sex?
What the fuck does that have to do with Y2K??????

-- lisa (lisa@work.now), September 20, 1999.
Congratulations Lisa, you just made the delete list. Not us - YOU!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 20, 1999.
Lisa, I'll just assume that you're having a bad hair day at work and leave it at that.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
On second thought Lisa, why not asking for every other kinds of OT and other threads you find offensive to be deleted? How come you weren't there demanding for the canibalistic threads to be deleted? Remember those threads, the ones asking if canibalism would increase post y2k? How does canibalism rate next to prostitution/sex in your censorship index?
Gees Lisa, you're not a newbie here, you know the routine. Leave the thread if you're so disgusted with it.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
After the German surrender in 1945 I (along with many others) remained there for several months. We had too many points to be sent to the Pacific, and not enough points to be discharged. Germany was a shambles, of course. No industry, no jobs, not much in the way of food, and almost all the men still alive were still in prison camps.
You wouldn't believe what an eighth of a bar of soap would buy in those times. Or a dozen cigarette butts. (Yes, butts, not cigarettes.)

-- Tom Carey (tomcarey@mindspring.com), September 20, 1999.
Chris: Why would you attempt to discuss human sexuality on a forum that has already been declared to be predominantly right-wing and conservative? I didn't say that, BTW. I think it was Bigdog who did. I think it was Spidey who recently (in another thread) expressed abhorrence at articles in women's magazines discussing explosive orgasms where 5 year-olds could "read" them (in a doctor's office.) I'll admit that my kids could read at age 3, but explosive would have been tough for them at that age, and they would have had NO clue as to what orgasm meant.
Lisa: It seems a bit hypocritical to denounce THIS thread after announcing that you'd become a "table-dancer" after Y2k.

-- Anita (spoonera@msn.com), September 20, 1999.
aaa: "You shouldn't make assumptions, they are usually wrong....people like Mumsie are missing out on a lot of fun..."
Who is ass-uming?
So how about it aaa, if you find yourself extremely hungry, are you going to have 'fun' with Mr. Smith to get your rice and beans? Or do you have too many 'hang-ups'?
I have no doubt that what Mr. Carey portrayed was true, but I'd rather live with the memory of having helped a desperately hungry person, than of using them. Have someone chop your wood, weed your garden, clean your house...fine. but use the lowest form of bribery that debases them yet allows them to survive?.... You can sprinkle the outhouse with rose petals but you still know what the stink is from.
vegas dollie... You may enjoy paid sex with strangers, but most hookers/women do not. They prefer the 'illusion' or truth that they are cared about. When I was young, I was friends with someone who got into stripping and hooking. She told me about the drugs (most of the girls took to function) and violence (boyfriend/pimp beat her) that went with that. Later she gladly accepted a helping hand to get out and away from it. She lived with us when we were in a one bedroom apt. with a baby. I loved her no matter what she did, but I'm glad she got out of that. She ended up marrying a nice guy and having three kids.
aaa: "I am perfectly capable of intimacy, but it has NOTHING to do with sex!.... I never said that it couldn't be more rewarding when there IS an emotional attachment"
Make up your mind.
Furthermore, you seemingly have no idea of the uninhibited sexual pleasure that comes only from deep trust and emotional intimacy. That's the real McCoy when it comes to sex. Sounds like you've only had the cheap imitation.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
Further clarification and a question:
I understand that prostitution is a fact of life. I understand why many women live this way.
To those who seem to defend it,...if something happens to you, would you like to see your wife, sister, daughter, or mother have to trade sex for food? No trouble? No worries about STD's?

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
I agree with Chris about the thread being as on topic as any other.
Anita, I qualify for your label, but have no problem discussing sex - as a topic. I also think that the same topic without limits, and with any and all specifics, is not appropriate for young children. They should know what they need to know. My daughter understood basic reproduction thoroughly while young enough to still believe in Santa Claus (She didn't need to know about 'fisting'). It is a matter of how it is presentd. Sex is a basic and natural fact of life. Whether or not I also believe it should have boundaries is beside the point.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 20, 1999.
Man, I leave a thread for a couple of hours and look!!! The words for this thread are:
Diametrically Opposed...
This could be one of those 100 response threads... Damn, Mr Friendly... you sure know how to post 'em...
There are men out there (like me : ) ) that insist, INSIST, on intimacy. Men, you do not know WHAT you are missing... the wham-bam- thankya-mam may be good for your jollies, but when you start tweeking here... touching there... caress over here... and really get your lover going, LOOK OUT!!! Man, it is better than 1000 quickies, and I am sure your mate will agree.
@@@@@@ and TECH, truthfully, how many times have your bedmates had multiple orgasms??? (OOH!, OOH! it's that word!!!... EEEK!) Zero? Probably...
I gotta side with the women on this one fellas... I know better...
stretched out on the floor waggin' my tail...
The Dog

-- Dog (Desert Dog@-sand.com), September 20, 1999.

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999.

CONTINUED

O.K. everybody just settle down here for a moment. Name calling and slamming one another will not resolve the real issue here.
IMHO any young lady, or more mature one for that matter, that did not prepare for Y2K, and feels comfortable with the idea of exchanging what you want for what she needs...what is the BIG DEAL? It is only between consenting adults, last time I checked.
Prostitution is not rape, as was mentioned at the first of this post by some hot head. It is a voluntary business deal.
As for all the women on this forum that are putting men down and asking them how they would like it, I can only tell you that in hard economic times that men stoop to theft, strongarmed robberies, muggings, etc.
I spent 10 years in the Philippines during the Marcos reign. Although "officially" prostitution was illegal there, I can tell you it was also rampant, and extremly affordable. Those young ladies provided me and thousands like myself an opportunity to fulfill every fantasy we ever had, and I for one will be forever grateful. I was stabbed twice while serving my country over there, both times by filipino men, in the process of robbing me. I have no hard feelings towards them for the stabbings, you try living on less than two dollars a day.
I have been preparing my food storage for a long time now. I have enough to take care of myself and plenty of others. If some lady friend wants to exchange their "services" for some of my provisions, I'll be happy to oblige them. It could be a tune-up of my car, some repair work on my roof, or blowing out my pipes, its all the same to me. Bartering will be the name of the game.
Lastly, ladies please don't be sooooo judgemental of others. You have most likely never had to live for months or years at a time on half rations, and since you have not walked a mile in their shoes, (or sandals) don't judge so harshly until you have.
Most American women have always had the luxury of not having to make these kind of hard choices, so it is easy for them to condemn others for doing so.

-- John (Wheatgrinder@fullstoreho use.com), September 20, 1999.
LOL Mumsie!
She's baaaaaack! Now you're just ranting and raving again, attacking each of my post with 4 or 5 angry responses. I'm going to let you cool off for a spell and collect yourself.
"Who is ass-uming?" Can't you read?
I was responding to Chris when she said: "@@@@@, I can only assume that you are relatively young and have a strong libido clouding your mind."
Why don't you listen to your own words, and quit pre-judging everyone.
"Sex is a basic and natural fact of life. Whether or not I also believe it should have boundaries is beside the point."
I am not some kind of sleazebag pimp like you're trying to stereotype me as.
Oh, and some advice for future reference - one of the things that turns men off from becoming intimate is the type of incessant rambling that keeps flowing out of your trap - do you ever SHUT UP?!!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 20, 1999.
John, On behalf of every man that was ever single and stationed somewhere in the far east...AMEN, brother John.

-- Sir Laughsalot (laughing@outloud.com), September 20, 1999.
Stats show older women are the biggest prepers for Y2K and the Gen-X crowd as the fewest in number. So, why again are women going to be beholden to men? I think everyone should consider the reverse of the scenario above for a moment.
JUST A THOUGHT.

-- DOC (doc@doc.doc), September 20, 1999.
Mumsie:
I wasn't trying to cast any stones in my reference to the right-wing conservatism, but there IS a movement associated with same that discourages sex education in ANY form and then complains about teenage pregnancies on the rise. Like you, I taught my children at home, and at an early age. I have NO CLUE regarding "fisting." I don't even think I want to pursue that topic. [grin]
I've noticed, however, (as Chris perhaps has also) that folks in the U.S. are particularly hung up on nudity and sexuality. This country WAS founded by Puritans, ya know. I was born here, but my roots are in Norway. There's a whole different culture involved with those of us with roots in other countries. For instance, my E-mail was FLOODED with queries during the Clinton/Lewinsky ordeal asking why Americans were so upset. It's commonplace for leaders in other countries to have mistresses and they openly escort them to public functions. When my three children were under 5, they oftentimes played in the sandbox in our yard naked. We had a 6 foot fence between them and the rest of the world, but one neighbor decided to step up and look over and ask my children why they weren't clothed. I think my oldest was perhaps 8 years old before she said, "I don't WANT to take a bath with them anymore. I want privacy." Modesty finds its own time if allowed.
The thread began with a question regarding whether Y2k would unfold to a point wherein women would be willing to barter bodily pleasures for more tangible goods. Personally, I don't see things getting this bad, but I'm a minority (in this view) on this forum. The thread then began to discuss sexuality in general. SOME men like to believe that they are the only beings that crave sexual satisfaction. This is FAR from true. Some women like to believe that RAPE (or sexual contact without consent) is about achieving sexual satisfaction. This is also FAR from true. RAPE is about POWER. It has NOTHING to do with sex.

-- Anita (spoonera@msn.com), September 20, 1999.
Doc, you have put a perspective on it that some of these guys would NOT want to even think about.
"A good servicing for a cup of rice..." AT GUNPOINT.
There ya go @@@@@ and TECH... go for it...
Can you imagine that??? and she looks like Rosanne Barr...
rollin' in the sand...
The Dog

-- Dog (Desert Dog@-sand.com), September 20, 1999.
Mr. Friendly,
You wrote:
Here in the USA after Y2K how many women are going to prostitute themselves for a loaf of bread?
The ones that PROSTITUTE themselves NOW for their DAILY FIX.
HAPPY SCUM SUCKING @

What makes you think that women in the USA would have to revert to such tactics?

-- (you@deserve.it), September 20, 1999.
My grandfather served in the U.S. Navy during WWII. I remember when he told us about all the hookers working the hotels near the docks in San Francisco.
These fine ladies would depart of their wares to all young sailors, marines, soldiers that were departing overseas for less than five bucks apiece.
Seems that many of these ladies thought this was their patriotic duty as many of these young lads never came back home alive.
Also turns out that these ladies were checked twice a week by U.S. Government doctors for any social diseases.
And we think we live in interesting times.

-- Youngblood (Grandpa@tellmebouttheg oodole.days), September 20, 1999.
Anita: Bravo.

-- Mumsie, they're beneath you. (worried@dicks.too small), September 20, 1999.
My apologies to those of you that have contributed thus far. I posted this morning, and then took off fishing for the day. Caught a few, some were real fighters, others just took the hook in the mouth and got pulled right up.
Chris: pros-ti-tute (pras'tee toot')noun [[Latin, pro-, before + statuere, cause to stand]]1. one who engages in promiscuous sexual activity for pay 2. to sell (oneself, one's talents, etc.) for base purposes.
You: At you@deserve.it I have no idea how limited your resources are, but understand this my friend, (and it will amaze and confound you), not all prostitutes are needle users. Oh shock upon shock. Not all prostitutes are bad people. (Now plug your ears and close your eyes) because I wouldn't want you to listen to things that offend your sensibilities or want you to see the truth for one instant...not every all men that visits with prostitutes are SCUM SUCKERS!!! Can you say Mary Magdeline?
My, My, but aren't you the judgemental one. As to how do I know that things here in America might get that bad, that American women might have to prostitute themselves for a loaf of bread? Have you read any of the discussion forums posted in the past year? Or is this your first one? Deal with the reality that anything and everything is possible.
In closing, I want you to know that yes, I have been there and done that, saw the movie, bought the t-shirt, wore the neck chain, etc., etc.
To everyone that is so aghast at this possibility and judging so harshly, let's remember what the greatest teacher of all had to say about it..."Let him who is without sin cast the first stone."
I have read a lot of self righteous posts, but many of you here today win 1st place in the Ned Flanders category.

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@ya hoo.com), September 20, 1999.
The real problem with this thread, is not what's being overtly stated. It's the putrescent slime that's oozing out between the lines of some of the posts. This ugly bit of business has slithered up, before. There are guys out there with the attitude of, "Wahoooo! TEOTWATKI Time! Gonna get my deck polished tonight, for sure. Find a polly b---h and make her do it all, fer a can O beans!"
I have no problem at all, with someone choosing the life of prostitutuon. There are worse ways to make a living. But we're not talking about a choice made, with clear head and no coercion. We're talking about acts of desperation; one of many that women AND men will be driven to, if we see the end of life as we know it.
Anyone can call me any kind of sanctimonious SOB that you want, I don't give a flying you-know-what. But I hope, I PRAY, there is a special level of hell reserved for anyone who looks forward to a time when they can be predatory on that kind of misery.
No....better yet, I hope that, when and if Teotwatki comes, you guys who are itchin' for a little "desperation dinner" find that you forgot something REALLY essential to your survival. Say matches, for instance. And when you go wandering off to find a source and you stumble across a house, with a light on, you knock on the door. A big, beefy, gorilla-looking guy answers, puts the barrel of a gun between your eyes and says, "Sure, Boyyyyyyy. I got some matches. But first, drop your drawers and bend over and let me see if you can squeal like a little piggy, for me."

-- Bokonon (bok0non@my-Deja.com), September 20, 1999.
Mary Magdalene...see Luke 8:2, Matt 27:56; Mark 15:40; John 19:25; Matt 27:61; Mark 15:47; Matt. 28:1; Mark 16:1; Luke 24:10; John 20:1, 11. Also Mark 16:9; John 20:14-18.
I am not a bible thumper. I just know how to read, I which many of the rest of you did.

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@ya hoo.com), September 20, 1999.
wish, wish...more of you could read. I wish I could type also without tripping over my thumbs.

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@ya hoo.com), September 20, 1999.

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999.

CONTINUED

ROTFLMAO, Yo Bokonon! Seen the video "Deliverance" just one too many times have you?

-- Sir Laughsalot (laughing@outloud.com), September 20, 1999.
I may be taking a pleasure stroll in a marked minefield by posting here, but a couple of posts just HAD to have responses.
1) hamster, Cygnus, my take on the relative frequency of voluntary prostitution vs. forcible rape post-1999 is of >50:1. So many DGIs now mean many unprepared females in 2000. Food will be too scarce in a >8 scenario, and food is lower on Maslow's hierarchy than sex (means sex is less of a priority if both are unmet needs). The market "price" of sex will drop enormously relative to food. Why go to the effort that force would take when the same thing would be widely available for almost nothing? In "Man and Society in Calamity" (Sorokin), during a famine in medieval England (think it was there), the skin of a cat was of greater market value than the favors of a pretty woman in her prime years.
2) Mara, true enough, but sadly irrelevant to the motivations of people acting as if they probably won't be alive in a month.
3) 'enough is', humans were hunter-gatherers before agriculture commenced. Hunting/killing (warmaking, if you prefer) predates gardening by a long shot.
4) Chris, on the subject of men serving as prostitutes, remember that they will average more able with respect to force (greater familiarity with firearms/physically stronger) than women. This means as looters, guards, and manual laborers, men will on average be more successful at "bringing home the bacon" in TEOWAKI. Also, the DEMAND for men as prostitutes will be lower than for women. Well under 7% of men are primarily homosexual and PREFER other men sexually. Prepared women will not generally desire to be "johns", so unprepared men serving as whores to prepared women - not much of that in 2000 IMO. (Guards, laborers, possibly eventual mutually consensual physical relationships - another story.) In conclusion, expect women to constitute the vast majority of prostitutes in time of famine (or Y2K), as they have throughout history.
5) Sorokin's book "Man and Society in Calamity" covers the phenomena of sex during times such as Y2K can be expected to bring (remember, I'm a 9.5) at some length. It's less frequent, on average more deviant, and much more of what does occur is purely for monetary gain. If the posters to this forum would all read this book, they would on average IMHO triple their knowledge of what to expect next year, prostitution-wise.
my site: www.y2ksafeminnesota.com

-- MinnesotaSmith (y2ksafeminnesota@hotmail.co m), September 20, 1999.
Nah, only saw it on the TV. Just heard about the scene in question from friends who saw it on the big screen.
The point is, for every scum-bag, there's an even bigger scum-bag who views the lesser variety as dinner.

-- Bokonon (bok0non@my-Deja.com), September 20, 1999.
Mr. Friendly,
You wrote:
You: At you@deserve.it I have no idea how limited your resources are, but understand this my friend, (and it will amaze and confound you), not all prostitutes are needle users. Oh shock upon shock. Not all prostitutes are bad people. (Now plug your ears and close your eyes) because I wouldn't want you to listen to things that offend your sensibilities or want you to see the truth for one instant...not every all men that visits with prostitutes are SCUM SUCKERS!!! Can you say Mary Magdeline?
Did I say that all prostitutes were needle users? Where did I write that?
SCUM SUCKERS? I directed that to @. Did you read ALL the postings?
You stired the pot my Friend.

-- (you're@picken_on_the_w rong.person), September 20, 1999.
You; In the words of Steve Martin...Well EXXXCCUUUSSSSEEEE MMMMMEEEEEEE!!!!! I thought it was a typo, my mistake.

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@ya hoo.com), September 20, 1999.
DAILY FIX/needle users = Freudian slip

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@ya hoo.com), September 20, 1999.
--- Anita
Just a side note concerning our Puritan heritage. There is plenty of evidence that suggests that these so-called uptight folks were, on the contrary, very sexually active. There are a number of accounts of wives complaining to the elders of the church about their husbands failing to fulfill their "obligations as husbands" in the marriage bed. The elders reprimanded those husbands for ignoring the needs of their women. It is also well documented that the act of "bundling" was popular in Puritan circles. The Puritans very much enjoyed sexual pleasure...but WITHIN the boundaries of marriage.

-- TM (mercier7@pdnt.com), September 20, 1999.
The Leatherman is a nifty tool. You can break balls (one by one) or just cut it all off. You see, that's what a guy like me would do if I happened upon a human being trading food and water for sexual favors. As Saint Thomas Aquinas once said, a woman's dignity must be defended -- whether or not she understands the meaning of that dignity. Beyond food and water and where coercion is not apparent... I would keep the Leatherman sheathed and mind my own business. Is that fair enough?
Sincerely, Stan Faryna

-- Stan Faryna (info@giglobal.com), September 20, 1999.
MUMSIE,
...If men think that prostitutes enjoy sex with johns, they are the biggest kind of a fool. Prostitutes are paid to pretend. I don't condemn them. I despise the men who SNEAK off to USE them, and then irresponsibly go back to their protected cushy little lives, spreading disease to their loyal spouses, and deluding themselves that they gave 'pleasure' in exchange for money. They paid for the illusion.
Well of course they are pretending, that goes for the men as well as the women. Don't you know the most erotic organ in the body is the brain? Btw, my friend who has affairs always uses a condom. He loves his wife deeply and would never put her or his kid at risk. In fact, he told be the reason he broke up with his last 'girlfriend' was that she wanted him to not use a condom so they could be 'closer'. He declined.
Would it matter to YOUR wife if you cheated, and if so, WHY? There is a difference between what most women might tolerate and what they would prefer.
Yes my wife would mind, so would I. Although I certainly am physically capable of putting my dick in another woman I won't because I took a vow not to. I know alot of people can't understand this, but my word is my bond. If I break my word, then I'm worth nothing as a man. That goes for all aspects of my life. As to what my friends wife would prefer vs. tolerate, she has told me that she wants him to be happy. That is her preference. She said that she'd rather have him cheat than be miserable in marriage. At first that was difficult for me to understand, but not anymore. PS, I've known her since junior high school as well.
What if that man found himself starving, or saw his child/loved one starving, but Mr. Smith won't help him unless he bends over first? No big deal? Just a little pleasure for food?
There are many things in life that people do because they HAVE TO, not because they want to. Do you really think the lady who cleans toilets in an office building likes her job? You don't think that's degrading work? I'm not saying that people willing to trade food for sex are great, but I can understand it, and I can understand that for some, it serves a purpose.

CHRIS,
Young women especially, EXPECT emotional attachment from the men they have sex with. If you didn't understand that and apparently @@@@@@ still doesn't, you have hurt a lot of young women's hearts, no matter if they made you think they were happy with one night stands.
I'm usually not this rude, but you are full of shit. Projecting your own heart-breaks onto the women I had sex with is just plain wrong. Only ONE TIME did a woman come back and expect a relationship. Apparently she had a crush on me all year and thought having sex would be the start of a beautiful relationship. I explained that wasn't going to happen, and we remained friends thereafter (we were both comp-sci majors). Every other woman I one-nighted with was in it for the same thing I was, sex.
So anyone who thought they "pleased" one night stand women sexually are self-deluded in the most profound way.
Oh gimme a break!

DOG
"A good servicing for a cup of rice..." AT GUNPOINT.

There ya go @@@@@ and TECH... go for it...

At gunpoint??? That's rape, and I don't condone it. Period.

-TECH32-

-- TECH32 (TECH32@NOMAIL.COM), September 20, 1999.
Stan: Please understand this, if I am in my private domain getting serviced by a lovely lady who wants to depart with some dry goods, and Mr. Leatherman attempts to storm the castle to defend her honor, Mr. Mossberg will see you at the door.
Mental Note- Never break a leatherman tool kit to a gun fight...you'll lose!

-- John (Wheatgrinder@fullstoreho use.com), September 20, 1999.
"As to how do I know that things here in America might get that bad, that American women might have to prostitute themselves for a loaf of bread? Have you read any of the discussion forums posted in the past year? Or is this your first one? Deal with the reality that anything and everything is possible."
So Mr. Friendly, what was your point in starting this thread? You seem smug and having all the answers yourself.
American Heritage Dictionary gives this definition: Prostitute (n) 1. One who solicits and accepts payment for sexual intercourse. 2. One who sells his [no typo] abilities or name to an unworthy cause. Prostitution: (n) The act of selling offering or or devoting one's talents to an unworthy use or cause.
In your original question you said "Here in the USA after Y2K how many women are going to prostitute themselves for a loaf of bread?"
Are you looking for a head count of women on this forum that will say "I will"?
Alright, I'll bite. Assuming that I lose the protection and help of my husband; According to your and my definitions, I can't say that I will. If I barter my sexual favors for a loaf of bread, it won't be for an unworthy cause. I don't know yet what I'll do, I haven't crossed that bridge.
Mumsie, you've been too quick to assume that "vegas dollie" was a woman, and not a man-troll. Also, don't take @@@@@'s flames too personally, we're learning that some men on this thread would go for anything and anyone as long as it had an orifice of servisable size. You have as much chance as I do to survive with what you've got.
MSmith, re: 4) Agreed, on average. I wasn't debating the average.
MSmith, John and Desert Dog, you've put a perspective on this that was a pleasure to read. We all learn more when flames are kept to a minimum.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.
I'm a guy and I would not trade my food for sexual favors just as I do not buy sexual favors now.
Right now in the USA, prostitution is probably by choice as there are economic safety nets etc. to keep anyone out of poverty. After y2k, if it becomes an 8 or higher, it may be like how it is in the 3rd world country where women have no choice.

-- Sandwich (anon@anon.com), September 20, 1999.
"I'm usually not this rude, but you are full of shit. Projecting your own heart-breaks onto the women I had sex with is just plain wrong."
TECH, I'm sorry if I bruised your ego, and being rude to me when you're not usually this type tells me that I have. I don't mean to flame you TECH, merely trying to point something to you, keep this in mind.
Fact #1: You don't know for sure what those women felt or thought.
Fact #2: Basic female instinct is to mate/have sex; 1) for reproducing with the most genetically fit male specimen (according to this perticular female's standards). 2) For ensuring a secure bond from that male so that he will protect and provide for herself and offsprings. 3)Female promiscuity outside marriage/bonding is related to instinctive wishes to ensure the fittest genetic "pool" for her offsprings as well as a "backup" bonding in times needs.
Fact #3: Men produce sperm daily that causes instinctive urges to "plant their seeds" in as many female specimen as they can, ensuring that their genes will be reproduced in as many offsprings as possible. They stand therefore to derive pleasure from the act of sex much more than women, without intimacy or emotional bonds. It is even not practical for men in a purely instinctive and reproducing view to want or need emotional attachment with sex, there'd be way too many females and offsprings to care for. (All this can be verified in sexual sociology/psychology, sorry have no references for you at the moment.)
Taking the above into account, female sexual pleasures is therefore directly tied to "intimacy" and "emotional attachment". Any woman who lets you think that she derived "pleasure" from a one night stand was either 1)Outright lying so as not to scare you off 2)Derived some pleasure due to the fact that her own ego was stroked at her sexual power's effectiveness, or any such motivations. But real deep pleasure, the kind that causes a women to reach the ceiling with 2 or 3 orgasm in one night cannot be felt in one night stand. (I'm opening myself for trolls to prove me wrong, but I made my point anyway.)
When you study the real nature and function of sex, it is nothing but romantic or ego inflating for both men and women.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 20, 1999.

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999.

CONTINUED

Chris: You seem to be an articulate and intelligent female that is passionate about what she believes in. For that you have my respect.
If I appear to be smug and speak as if I have all the answers, then I have fooled myself as well as everyone else. No, I don't have all the answers.
I have seen many women in 3rd world countries work very hard at physically demanding jobs 12 to 16 hours per day, for the equivalent of less than a dollar per day. And even in their 3rd world country that doesn't buy much. Many of these undereducated women do this by choice rather than become prostitutes.
But the crueling, hard work is the reason why so many turn to prostitution to earn a living. As prostitutes they don't have split, cracked, and bleeding hands from hard work. They do not age prematurely from strenuous hard and dirty outside labor. And they can earn 10 times the amount of income as the laborers. This allows them more money in order to eat better and live materially better. For many in these cultures, beauty can be a curse.
Many prostitutes that I became acquainted with lived in countries where a form of Christianity was the predominant religion. These women prayed daily, and in their own unique way tried to atone for their "sins".
Should we condemn them? No. Why? Because they no more choose to be born in their circumstances than any of the born wealthy in this country chose to be born rich.
Should we cast the finger of blame at the men who visit prostitutes and get their physical pleasure fulfilled? No. Why? Because we are all weak.
If anyone is to be held accountable, let's blame the leaders of the world for all the B.S. politics that have raped the 3rd world countries of their resources, while the industrial nations of the world profit.
There is enough wealth and natural resources in the world to feed and cloth every citizen of the world, so that no one goes hungry. Not a single citizen of the world should have to be homeless, or be cold, etc., etc. ad-infinity.
The politics of the world have created prostitution as a means of survival. Do I personally think that Y2K could possibly make this a reality for western woman in the U.S. of A.? You better believe it.
Hunger is a great aphrodisiac.

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@ya hoo.com), September 20, 1999.
CHRIS,
TECH, I'm sorry if I bruised your ego, and being rude to me when you're not usually this type tells me that I have. I don't mean to flame you TECH, merely trying to point something to you, keep this in mind.
No brused ego, just stating a fact. I find your attitude concerning a womans motivation to have sex quite condescending, to both men and women. You would have me believe that no woman really just wants to get laid. That deep-down she wants a mate and that she doesn't see herself as 'complete' unless she has a man in some type of commited 'relationship', the ultimate goal of which is reproduction. You would also have me believe that, as a guy, I should expect that every woman I ever slept was heart-broken when I didn't call the next day and that I'm a jerk for even thinking it could be otherwise. Sorry, but that argument and the 'logic' used to support it are full of shit.
Are you a Republican?
-TECH32-

-- TECH32 (TECH32@NOMAIL.COM), September 20, 1999.
Prostitution is fine in my book,as long as it's a business deal between adults and no one is forced into it physically or because of desperation.
However, I feel anyone caught taking advantage of the young or desperate should have the same fate as looters, shot on sight.
I will gladly do my civic duty, and volunteer to shoot any son of a bitch caught in the act. I can't think of anything that I would enjoy more.

-- Mabel Dodge (cynical@me.net), September 20, 1999.
Tech, Those men among us that must go from flower to flower like busy bees are just plain ole having a really "fukintastic" good time. I know, because I am one of the KINGS of pollinators, quickies, and one night stands. I have literally lost count of the endless scores of beauties that I have been blessed to be undressed with. Tell Chris that despite what she reads in her text books, that there are plenty of women out there that are the female equal of myself, and they don't charge a penny. They just flat out enjoy S-E- X. Chris can try to analyse them in her text book, but for whatever reason, I am glad they are there.

-- Doctor Love (luv-em-n-leavem@yahoo.com) , September 20, 1999.
Mabel, Yeah, that's a really good idea! Murder one of two consenting adults, even when the younger woman is a willing participant. Then if we still have prisons, you can go take long hot showers with butch dikes nicknamed Bubba, and your new nickname can be, "Yo Bitch!" So many of you "talk the talk", but only "walk the walk" in your online fantasies. Get a reality grip, before you go postal or something. LOL at YOU.

-- Sir Laughsalot (laughingoutloud@yahoo.com) , September 20, 1999.
You caught me Sir Laughsalot, yeah it is my fantasy to rid the planet of scum. Girls just wanna have fun!

-- Mabel Dodge (cynical@me.net), September 20, 1999.
"Prostitution: (n) The act of selling offering or or devoting one's talents to an unworthy use or cause."
Y2K Pro?
Lighten up folks. It's a fact of life. Me, if a cute girl comes to my door looking for "a loaf of bread," I'ld be sure to feed her well, and offer her a Heineken. I expect nothing in return, maybe a thank you. We're all human. If her thank you includes a sexual favor, I'm not going to argue.
Just a single guy. <:)=

-- Sysman (y2kboard@yahoo.com), September 20, 1999.
When it comes to sex, everybody has something to say. Now let's change the subject to shit and let's see how long we can talk about that!

-- bbb (bbb@bbb.com), September 20, 1999.
Mabel, Honey, what is it tonight? Blue jeans or blue dress? Cmon sugar, don't be shy. You know, I know.

-- Doctor Love (luv-em-n-leavem@yahoo.com) , September 20, 1999.
bbb: Wow, now that really is disgusting! There is a forum for you, I just don't go there.

-- Doctor Love (luv-em-n-leavem@yahool.com), September 20, 1999.
Doctor,
ROTFLMAO!! Man, you got me fallin off my chair! Finally, someone who has a real-life perspective on the situation. These frustrated hags were tearin us apart with their vicious posts! I think they are really jealous. Chris and Mumsie haven't been out in a while. They don't know that I can walk down to the bar down the road and there will be gorgeous bunnies ready to jump my bones in a heartbeat. Some of them may want a few beers or a blow for the nose, but they will be more than happy to rock your socks off! And by the way Chris, I don't poke "anything with an orifice" - only the FINEST babes for me!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 21, 1999.
Hey Mabel,
Maybe you should get together with Stan "old-Fartya". You two can go out as the Ma and Pa Kettle of law enforcement during Y2K and shoot all the whores who love to give blow jobs for food! Hey, I bet Kenneth Starr would even join ya!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 21, 1999.
ROTFLMFAO!!!! You guys are great, stupid b**ches they'll be happy to do it for a can of beans. You showed them @ and Doc I bet you can have any peice any time you want; you don't even need a can of beans.

-- studly lurker (lurker@lurkers.net), September 21, 1999.
@@: Ya know, some of the finest mmm-mmm-good kind of feminity that I like to tango with are those gorgeous delicious ripe on the tree and ready for picking exotic dancers at "anytown U.S.A." You know what I'm talking about. The Strippers..YYYEESSS! They got the moves and they got the grooves. You don't have to talk their clothes off, they come off to the beat of the music. But I have whispered sweet nothings in many of their ears, only to be rewarded for my efforts later on in the evening. Much to the embarrassment, annoyance, failure and disappointment of the other patrons of the establishment, as I take this fine lady out of the bar on my arm, and on to my love nest. You know what I'm saying. And some of them left behind were BIG tippers..hey, thanks-a-lot fellas, I needed the gas money. Yuk, Yuk.

-- Doctor Love (luv-em-n-leavem@yahoo.com) , September 21, 1999.
Yeah, hell with feedin them! - I've had girls cook MY dinner just so that I would go home with them and F**K their brains out! I dated a bartender that used the tips the other guys gave her to take me out on the town! And these hags try to make it look like we're rapin them or something! Bwwwwahhhh hahhhaahhhhaaaaa hhaaaaaaa!

-- @ (@@@.@), September 21, 1999.
If I may, one of my favorite quotes:
"Copulation is spiritual in essence---or it is merely friendly exercise. On second thought, stike out "merely." Copulation is not "merely"---even when it is just a happy pastime for two strangers. But copulation at its spiritual best is so much more than physical coupling that it is different in kind as well as in degree..."
--- Robert H. Heinlein, Time Enough For Love.
As a counterpoint, (of which I do not agree, for the most part), he also writes:
"A whore should be judged by the same criteria as other professionals offering services for pay---such as dentists, lawyers, hairdressers, physicians, plumbers, etc. Is she professionally competent? Does she give good measure? Is she honest with her clients?"
(this is the part I agree with)
"It is possible that the percentage of honest and competent whores is higher than that of plumbers and much higher than that of lawyers. And enormously higher than that of professors."
---Robert H. Heinlein, Time Enough For Love.
Fuel for the fire,

-- Spindoc' (spindoc_99_2000@yahoo.com) , September 21, 1999.
Thats a good one doc, you bang them and they pay you. B**ches are really stupid, you can make them do anything. @, you and doc are cool dudes, yeah only the finest babes and then make them pay. Freakin hags have it comeing to them.

-- studly lurker (lurker@lurkers.net), September 21, 1999.
Cmon now, Don't be picking on my "Mabel Sugar". She is just like a bottle of honey that has been left on the shelf too long. She has gotten hard and crystalized, and somewhat lumpy. However, she can be salvageable. She just needs a slow warm heat to start melting her from the bottom up. Keep the heat nice and slow and pretty soon all the crystals are gone and you have a simmering hot and sticky meltdown.

-- Doctor Love (luv-em-n-leavem@yahoo.com) , September 21, 1999.
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-- Sir Laughsalot (laughinoutloud@yahoo.com), September 21, 1999.
Most prostitutes (*generally*) are where there are, doing what they are doing, to simply survive where no other option is realistically possible. Guys who would take advantage of such a weak position are predators, not to be respected by honorable men.
Period.
Business transaction? Sorry, not with such an intimate event. Wouldn't it be more masculine to *assist* someone in such need? Perhaps give them something that they could pay back without such loss of self? Most people can usually find something to give back, if given enough alternatives.

-- Spindoc' (spindoc_99_2000@yahoo.com) , September 21, 1999.
Studly Lurker,
You completely missed the point and humor of RAH. Read it again.

-- Spindoc' (spindoc_99_2000@yahoo.com) , September 21, 1999.

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999.

CONTINUED

Spin Doc, What are you talking about? I know honeys that make $500 and upwards a night when Joe Smoe can't bring that down in a week. I will try to retell something I read in a previous thread, please scroll upwards...there are some really nice ladies that are prostitutes. Try to get to know some of them, believe it or not they are humans, and like Mabel said..."Girls just wanna have fun"

-- Doctor Love (luv-em-n-leavem@yahoo.com) , September 21, 1999.
Hi everyone, I've really enjoyed reading this discussion forum. To all you He- men that want to save us from ourselves, what do you have to give us in return? Food, water, shelter? Does your wife know you want to share your horde with us? I doubt it, and I doubt she would either. Girls like me will survive because we know how to survive. You come to us because you are missing that magic at home. As far as Y2K and hunger, forget it. I'll trade my tuna for a can of spam faster than you can say, Wham, Bam, thank you Ma'am.

-- Diana, Goddess of the Hunt (Chickie-of-the-sea@tuna.com< /a>), September 21, 1999.
I believe this thread was started on the premise of hungry people who would be desperate enough to trade sex for food. The original argument was NOT about whether they were wrong to do this. The point was never about whether prostitution is wrong. The issue is whether or not it is right to withhold your help/food unless you can coerce a sexual act from the needy person. The end has denigrated into a junior high locker room brag mentality from intimacy stunted males who think that they understand women, but in fact, are full of inflated and delusional penis worship. I recommend that the aforesaid clueless ones watch "When Harry Met Sally". Yes, there are (gasp) women who enjoy sex (wow, your dim bulb flickered on that discovery!) but the greatest sex does not come from your quickie impersonal encounters. You can blow your hot sexual braggadocia all you want boys, but women tell each other the real story, and you come off on the short end of the dick... I mean stick. :0)

-- Happywife (Monogamy@rules.com), September 21, 1999.
1. In the company of females, intercourse should be referred to as: a) lovemaking b) screwing c) the pigskin bus pulling into tuna town 2. You should make love to a woman for the first time only after you've both shared: a) your views about what you expect from a sexual relationship b) your blood-test results c) five tequila slammers 3. You time your orgasm so that: a) your partner climaxes first b) you both climax simultaneously c) you don't miss SportsCenter 4. Passionate, spontaneous sex on the kitchen floor is: a) healthy, creative love-play b) not the sort of thing your wife/girlfriend would ever agree to c) not the sort of thing your wife/girlfriend need ever find out about
5. Spending the whole night cuddling a woman you've just had sex with is: a) the best part of the experience b) the second best part of the experience c) $100 extra 6. Your girlfriend says she's gained five pounds in weight in the last month. You tell her that it is: a) No concern of yours b) not a problem, she can join your gym c) a conservative estimate 7. You think today's sensitive, caring man is: a) a myth b) an oxymoron c) a moron 8. Foreplay is to sex as: a) appetizer is to entree b) primer is to paint c) a line is to an amusement park ride 9. Which of the following are you most likely to find yourself saying at the end of a relationship? a) "I hope we can still be friends." b) "I'm not in right now, please leave a message at the beep." c) "Welcome to Dumpsville, population, YOU." 10.A woman who is uncomfortable watching you masturbate: a) probably needs more time before she can cope with that sort of intimacy b) is uptight and a waste of time c) shouldn't have sat next to you on the bus in the first place

-- pussywhipped (iliketun@fish.lickin), September 21, 1999.
A troll baited a hook with sex and caught too many fish.
That was the real 'hooker'.

-- Forrest Covington (theforrest@mindspring.com) , September 21, 1999.
Hey "Happywife",
What are you doin up at this hour? What's the matter, your pussywhipped husband leave ya a little unsatisfied? That's cuz you've got him so disgusted with your intimacy crap his dick has shriveled up just lookin at ya! Go back to bed you flabby-ass scallywag!

-- woof! (Iam@nugly.dog), September 21, 1999.
woofie! Get back to bed right now and stop playing on the computer! You'll be too tired for school and flunk seventh grade again!

-- woofie'smommy (whatacruddykid@rippedoff.co m), September 21, 1999.
LOL Forrest. Bingo.
The women who posted here, right or wrong, did not need to be subjected to that type of treatment. That was so much more offensive than any discussion of the original question could ever be.
In answer to the original question of will they or wont't they? Of course they will, male & female. Duh. Next topic.

-- Deborah (infowars@yahoo.com), September 21, 1999.
Deborah! I thought you were an intelligent girl! You shouldn't automatically jump to the conclusion that those ladies were correct just because they ganged up on us! Do me a favor and look aaaallll the way back to the post where I said I would be willing to make an exchange IF THE GIRL WERE WILLING. From that point on, the sexually frustrated Mumsie and Chris jumped all over us, calling me a dope-dealing sleazy pimp rapist inadequate pig and on and on! They had no right to take out their frustrations on us. If you can't be objective about this then you aren't playing fair either. I'd be dissapointed to see you do that after I enjoyed talking to you the other night.

-- @ (@@@.@), September 21, 1999.
@,
Hmmmm. O.K. The gauntlet was thrown by Mumsie way back at the beginning. I missed it. Maybe it was subconciously sexist of me to do so. hmmmm.
I'm not getting drawn into this argument though.
Have fun, I'm getting out of here while I still can. ;-)

-- Deborah (infowars@yahoo.com), September 21, 1999.
Thank you Deborah - you're still an awesome Babe. I'm glad to see you don't just automatically jump in on these gang-mentality attacks. Those ladies are obviously very angry at some men in their lives but we didn't do anything to deserve this kind of abuse. Thanks for being fair.
Have a good evening you totally cool chick! See ya later. Bye.

-- @ (@@@.@), September 21, 1999.
aaa: "I said I would be willing to make an exchange IF THE GIRL WERE WILLING"
aaa: "Hey, if she's hungry (~HUNGRY? STARVING? ~) and willing I might consider a beans and rice dinner in exchange for a little Wango- Tango. Yeah, Bartertown 2000!" (~SOME CHOICE ~)
"calling me a dope-dealing sleazy pimp rapist inadequate pig and on and on!"
Only called certain kinds of men pigs, not you personally....tsk tsk... be accurate now (but if the shoe fits....).
aaa: "butt-ugly feminists who are always bitchin..... go-nowhere marriage with 7 brats....inferiority complex.... ranting and raving... frustrated hags ...these hags... "
aaa: "Mumsie and Chris jumped all over us, calling me a dope-dealing sleazy pimp rapist inadequate pig and on and on! They had no right to take out their frustrations on us. If you can't be objective about this then you aren't playing fair either. "
Translation: aaa: boo hoo....whine....blah blah....not fair.... I'm really a hot stud.......oh oh, ran out of logic and solid ground.... quick, make personal attacks.....use a double standard and shock talk....feel better now... really am a hot tough guy.....suck suck (thumb in mouth)
aaa: "incessant rambling that keeps flowing out of your trap - do you ever SHUT UP?!! "
aaa dear, I tried to use as many of your flowing and eloquent expressions as possible so as not to not bore you with my rantings. I await your next puff of wisdom that far surpasses my ravings. Speak, oh bombastic flatulence king!

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 21, 1999.
This thread is a marvellous document about the abnormality of human sexuality in our times. Clearly mankind has been sexually sick for thousands of years. The fact that we have not even gotten enough thinking capacity to discover that there is a difference between "Equality" and "EQUIVALENCE" demonstrates we are really still primitives.
Equivalence is the foundation of justice and of freedom. Example: you want to feed all in EQUIVALENT and not in equal portions simply because a 200 lbs man and a baby do not need the same amount. You give punishment in equivalent amounts a $100 fine to a man working at $5 an hour is not equal punishment if the same fine for the same crime is imposed on a Bill Gates.
When it comes to sex...well I have met a few very lovely ladies in the profession who actually enjoy their work, and will state so. The women on this board that make so much fuss and claim to know so much know little it seems. A woman can have multiple orgasms and a good lover will find his greatest delight in bringing a woman to orgasm many times. The fact that this is only possible for a man if he has no inhibitions and has self control and really enjoys the art is another matter.
Intimacy involves three centers of consciousness, intellectual, emotional and physical. Lust or sexual pleasure is the very door to certain higher experiences that can fuse two beings into a moment of absolute merger.
This is not for the pedestrian. For if family and children are derived precisely from physical copulation then sex is intrinsically sacred and even the sexual favours of the professiona can be elevated to a very high human experience. Japan and India were quite aware of this so were the Tibetans. Sacred prostitution could not evolve in the christian context because christianity very early used sexual prohibition as a means of people control. Christ protected the prostitute from being stoned. Poligamy was extensive and the parable of the bridegroom and brides speaks of poligamy.
The modern wife who gives sex to keep her bread winner and has no real consummation of sexual union is inferior to the geisha or the temple prostitute who does her service with a universal love rather than the personal. Modern sexuality is confused, often ridiculous like putting ketchup on the finest cuisine. There is a world in sexuality that will forever retain an element of mystery. Viva la difference and viva L'equivalence in the light of the Holy Absolute.
Romano

-- Romano (Amore@Italia.Bella), September 21, 1999.
Well what did I expect, foolish me. I've threatened to burst the scumbags' fragile overinflated sexual ego with a needle. Without pointing fingers at anyone, we all know who's who, this thread is a prime example of the dysfuntionality of sex in america. Some who call themselves men here are patheticly dysfuntional. Trying to hold an intelligent conversation with men who's small head IQ is 4 times as high as their big ones is a masochist exercise.
@@@@@, if all men were like you, you bet I'd be a sexually frustrated bitch. Fortunately they're not.
Romano, you're clouding the issue by introducing a different definition of "prostitution" and cultural philosophy regarding sex. Up to here we were discussing americans and prostitution as defined by Mr. Friendly and me in earlier posts. Spiritual sex, such as Kama Sutra, is a totally different animal.
I'm out of here, I feel soiled and need a shower.

-- Chris (#$%^&@pond.com), September 21, 1999.
pras'teetoot'...SantaClaus...WangoTango ...oldfartya ...hamster... orifice...Ned Flanders... ketchup... mr.leatherman... fisting....

BINGO!!!`

-- number six (leatherman@sheathed.com), September 21, 1999.
fixed it???

-- number six (mischief_from_afar@ht ml_novice.com), September 21, 1999.
Toldya, Chris.

-- bad hair day (lisa@work.now), September 21, 1999.
Well check it out... over 100 posts, and no one even noticed, at least no one posted that they noticed.
This thread is just too funny, but then I said the diametrical opposites would polarize their positions here early in the thread, and look what happened. Human nature is a curious thing isn't it?
Well, this Dog needs some coffee... Mrs. Dog was particularly amorous last night...
Ya'll have fun...
sniffin' and walkin' in the kitchen...
The Dog

-- Dog (Desert Dog@-sand.com), September 21, 1999.
I will say this much concerning all that I have read here..."And the beat goes on, and the beat goes on".
For those hysterical few..."American woman, stay away from me-ee, American woman momma let me be-ee, don't wancha hanging round my door, I don't wanna see your face no more, I got more important things to do, then spend my time growing old with you, now woman, said go away-ah, American woman, listen what I say-ah-ah-ah...
And then there was that Ricky Nelson number about having a honey in every port.
Seriously folks, now that I have gotten a REALLY BIG laugh, and I thank you one and all, (that ought to be a online acronym, RBL what do you think?), I think far too many of you are hypothesizing and postulating and excited about this subject to the point of becoming panic stricken, while others among you have gotten so carried away that you are seething, rampant, mad, uncontrollable, raging, frenzied, etc.
Forrest Covington, I really like your online name, is that your real name? Sounds like an expensive coffee you buy in one of the snob shops. Yep, I went fishing allright. I threw my net over the left side and got nary a nibble. So, on the advice of someone on shore, I threw it over the right side and almost sunk the boat with the weight of the nets.
As a man with a loving and supportive wife, who has given me sons and daughters, I find those men among you who refer to women in very generalized degrading and derogatory terms, offensive. Why do you hate women so? If you were in my physical presense, you wouldn't refer to any women I associate with as Bitches, whores, etc., even if they were, at least standing up. You would be lying on the ground in need of emergency dental work. Would you like your grandmother, mother, aunt, sisters or daughters referred to in this fashion? I wouldn't begin to try to get inside your heads, it is filled with fecal material.
A real man can walk tall and proud and boldly because he was made in the image of God. Stop slithering on your bellies. Walk like a man, talk like a man.
To the women who spew hatred of men, and sexual put downs in the name of reasoning, everytime you open your mouths...you are the daughters of a living and loving Father in Heaven. Raise your standards accordingly. The same goes for those of you that are as slimey as the slimey men. Climb out of the human cess pool together and improve yourselves, mentally, socially, physically, and spiritually.
As to my original question at the top of this forum...hopefully non, but that is not human nature, now is it? Thanks for the hits, we topped 100 on the charts last time I checked. Now hit the streets troops and finish your preps.

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@ya hoo.com), September 21, 1999.
As the old saying goes~ Those who brag loudest (in public) are the ones who are the most insecure (in private). Describes @@@@ and Doctor Love perfectly.

-- (none@none.none), September 21, 1999.
Mr. Friendly you're just pussy whipped, not like me and my buddies like @. I guess we're just more intelligent than you, we're not gonna worry what they're thinking as long as they put out.

-- studly lurker (lurker@lurkers.net), September 21, 1999.
Studly, You caught me completely off guard guy. First off, you used a four syllable word, in-tel'li-gent this time, instead of a four letter word. I have to reevaluate my entire opinion of you now.
Secondly, pussywhipped would not describe me at all, if you really knew me. Before I settled down, and grew up, I know for a fact that I have lived a life much more wild and on the edge, than anyone of your wildest imaginable payday weekends with a bevy of beauties. But that when I was much like people like yourself. Self Absorbed and into self gratification.
My wife treats me like a King, as likewise, I treat her like my Queen. Our home, is our castle and our sanctuary. It is here that we leave the filth, vermin, and locusts outside to whither and waste away, much like you are spending your non-productive life. Whithering and wasting precious moments for productive growth. Now go have another beer.

-- Mr. Friendly (savingmynickelsndimes@ya hoo.com), September 21, 1999.
This ends the thread copy that I have. Judge for yourself the type of people that the TimeBomb extremist forum draws in.

-- Archivist (for@rainy.day), December 20, 1999.

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