1. Personal experience contradicts a lot of Doomer reports about companies doing nothing. I implemented Y2k code changes back in 1996 in our products for some major financial institutions who were demanding Y2k compliance back then. And the code changes were to simply output the date as a 4 digit year. Y2k would have had zero effect on our products if left unchanged.

2. I am not cynical or dis-believing of positive industry or government reports. No one was arguing that there wasn't work to be done. The argument centered on whether it would or could get done in time. People in IT and engineering are not stupid, and capitalism breeds adaptive survival.

3. Figures quoted in media are exaggerated and unrealistic. As Jim Lord has found out you cannot believe all the huge numbers that get passed around in the pessimist community. All you hear about is the 50 billion embedded "chips", or the millions of PC's out there. But no one tries to further qualify metrics with realistic assessment of date-dependent applications. How many of those "millions" of PC's out there even have their date and time set correctly or use applications that care what the date is? How many of these embedded applications even know or care what the date is? It will not break if no code does any type of forward-looking or backward-looking calculations across the century boundary.

If you think being a realist requires a leap of faith, then I argue being a Doomer requires a much bigger leap. I have faith in competence and economic Darwinism. Doomers have faith in disaster. Doomers harbor pathological anti-goverment zealots, biggots, and religious fanatics who are hoping for disaster, or at the very least they are hoping for a panic.

The Year 2000 will be a wonderful year full of continued success and further technological advancement. As an engineer I am happy to be a part of it. The nineties have been great for software engineers and developers and I fully expect the next decade to be the same.

-- You Knowwho (debunk@doomeridiots.com), November 12, 1999

Answers

80% of 3rd world pc's are running windows 3.1........this is a global economy......and that's just to start. Wake up.

-- can't you (giveitarest@least.com), November 12, 1999.

Q.E.D

-- You Knowwho (debunk@doomeridiots.com), November 12, 1999.

Who gives a rip what you think, Poole.

Why don't you go back where you're wanted?

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), November 12, 1999.

http://www.accessatlanta.com/partners/ajc/reports/y2k/dos.html

[snip]

[The Atlanta Journal-Constitution: 9.19.99]

Be prepared: A list of do's

By Marilyn Geewax

Atlanta Journal-Constitution Staff Writer

Washington -- Don't panic, but get prepared. While the nation's basic infrastructure will function after Jan. 1, authorities say the Y2K computer bug is sure to cause some problems. The power could go out in one community, while the water system falters in another and traffic lights malfunction in still another. Because no one can say with certainty which systems might fail, "the basic message we are giving people is ... be prepared for an emergency," said Red Cross spokeswoman Leslie Credit. Start your preparations by figuring out who is going to be in your household between Dec. 31 and mid-January, and what each person's special needs will be. Then lay out a strategy for making sure everyone can stay hydrated, healthy and warm for up to two weeks. These are among the recommendations being made by mainstream agencies:

---------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------

WATER

THE POTENTIAL PROBLEM:

Local providers typically keep water flowing by using pumps and valves controlled by microprocessors and chips. Computers also regulate various aspects of water treatment, such as the addition of chlorine. In addition, Y2K-related power outages could cause a loss of heat that would allow pipes to freeze and burst.

THE SOLUTION:

[snip]

-- Linkmeister (link@librarian.edu), November 12, 1999.

... use applications that care what the date is?

Now you tell me. I feel so stupid for fixing all of my systems that are loaded with dates. My business applications are all loaded, and I mean loaded with dates. But then again, maybe if I didn't panic, somehow the computer would have known that 00 is greater than 99. I'm talking past tense because we're already in fiscal year 2000, with no problems. But what a waste of time it was. That's it!!! See, that wasn't so hard. I get it now. It's a "people panic problem" not a technical problem.

-- Larry (cobol.programmer@usa.net), November 12, 1999.

Fayetteville Utility Warns Residents to be Ready for Y2K FAYETTEVILLE (WRAL) --

Most of us take electricity for granted, but one local power company is warning its customers to be prepared for the worst when the clock strikes midnight this New Year's Eve.

Fayetteville's Public Works Commission is asking residents to prepare for the new year as if a hurricane were approaching, and the request is creating a storm of reaction.

Ron Taylor needs electricity for almost everything he does both at work and home, and he never thought Y2K might leave him powerless. "That really surprises me. It's been my impression that all these Y2K bugs have been worked out of the system years and years ago," Taylor says.

Sharon Johnson-Harris and her children say a power outage will not leave them in the dark. "I keep candles and flashlights because of the storms and all," Johnson-Harris says. "If the lights go off and it gets dark, I'm going to deal with it."

The PWC says residents should be ready with: 7 gallons of water per person a battery-operated TV or radio flashlights batteries non-perishable food Public works leaders are taking the threat so seriously that they are calling in more than 100 workers on the holiday. The extra workers will be waiting in the emergency dispatch room, ready for anything.

"You may lose power depending on where you are. I think if you take that approach you'll be safe. It's just like insurance. You never know when you're going to need it," says PWC Risk Manager Ike Copeland. The PWC says it does not believe anyone will lose power; they just want customers to be prepared for whatever happens. They say there may be people who cut off others' power to create chaos.

Other area power companies say they are ready for Y2K as well. CP&L, Duke Power and North Carolina Power all say they do not expect any major outages as a result of the possible computer bug. But all three companies do plan to have extra workers on hand on New Year's Eve, just in case.

-- Mr. K (Mr.K@work.today), November 11, 1999

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), November 12, 1999.

"...I have faith in competence and economic Darwinism..."

So do I. That's why I'm preparing.

-- I'm Here, I'm There (I'm Everywhere@so.beware), November 12, 1999.

Geez Ron, how many times do you have to be told that I am not Poole. In this case, You DON'T Knowwho.

But keep accusing me of being Poole, it just validates any other opinions that I may have of your truth and accuracy.

-- You Knowwho (debunk@doomeridiots.com), November 12, 1999.

You Know Who--

I thought you left this forum yesterday. Like we really give a rat's ass!

-- (so@goaway.already), November 12, 1999.

One only uses "Q.E.D." when one has answered a question.....

-- bob (bob@bob.com), November 12, 1999.

You Knowwho's other thread about this from yesterday--and replies about why some preparations are a good idea--can be found here:

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001kUu

"I have not made preparations for Y2k at all"

-- Linkmeister (link@librarian.edu), November 12, 1999.

Youknowwho,

Since most of us decided our course of action quite some time ago, and are very well prepared, what is the point of your post? It sounds like you are trying to convince someone that walking blindfolded over a cliff is a good approach to living.

So WHO are you trying to convince?? Ya'know what I think?

YOU'RE TRYING TO CONVINCE YOURSELF!

-- Hawk (flyin@high.again), November 12, 1999.

You Know Who:

If I just sit and concentrate on your post and force myself to blank out practically everything else I've learned about this subject across the years, as well as my understanding of economics, psychology and business, I actually do get a little hopeful.

Thank you,

-- eve (123@4567.com), November 12, 1999.

But... you don't say here WHY you are not preparing for this non-event! You say that you've remediated code that wasn't a big deal, you say that you are not cynical about positive reports (but you don't mention negative reports), you say that IT people are not stupid, you say that figures are exaggerated, and then you dump on "Doomers."

I still don't understand why you are not at least taking some reasonable steps (if in fact you aren't) to protect the life of the small child that you say you have.

But, I suppose when it comes right down to it, I don't really even care...

-- (dot@dot.dot), November 12, 1999.

Oh My YouKnowNotWhat,

Limbo is the place. In Limbo one has natural happiness without the beatific vision; no harps; no communal order; but wine and conversation and imperfect, various humanity. Limbo for the unbaptized, for the pious heathen, the sincere sceptic. --Evelyn Waugh

...(hitting the)...

-- snooze button (alarmclock_2000@yahoo.com), November 12, 1999.

YouKnowWho:

Why don't you give it a rest. Nobody here cares about what you think. Personally, I hope you're right. But nobody here gives a crap about your reasons for not preparing. Who are you trying to convince? Sounds like you're trying to convince yourself. That's good because your opinion means nothing to anyone but you.

-- X (X@X.com), November 12, 1999.

Actually, we should be thankful that You Know Who creates these threads, which probably get a lot of attention from people who may just now be alerted to Y2K and are making decisions as to what to do. YKW asks the kind of questions that get one's attention, which then gives everyone a chance to post the mountains of evidence showing what a fool (P[h]oole) YKW is.

I've always suspected that pollies, especially the really bizarre ones, probably do as much as anyone to get people to prepare. They would probably have been more successful in dissuading people from withdrawing cash from the bank, stockpiling food, etc., if they had done absolutely nothing to show how silly a polly's beliefs are.

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.cum), November 12, 1999.

Am I the only "heathen" here that Gets It?

Yes, I am a full fledged heathen. Proud of it. So watch your mouth Christians.

-- GoldReal (GoldReal@aol.com), November 12, 1999.

Please.

-- GoldReal (GoldReal@aol.com), November 12, 1999.

So you know more than IBM, the Red Cross, Koskinem, most of the 875 man-years of programming experience on this forum, etc. etc. Yea, right. Anyone that ignores these warnings is an idiot.

Have a nice life, and leave us doomers alone, please.

Tick... Tock... <:00=

-- Sysman (y2kboard@yahoo.com), November 12, 1999.

Excellent point KOS.

How's things down in the bog, anyway?

...(hitting the)...

-- snooze button (alarmclock_2000@yahoo.com), November 12, 1999.

You Know Who

Sorry, guy, that you're taking this the way you are. You say you're a programmer? Sounds like your base of experience must be pretty narrow, or I think you'd look at this differently.

I don't think there are many people on this forum who are trying to be "Doomers" and "Gloomers". There's just no sense, though, in kidding ourselves into thinking that this problem is just going to go away. Most of the systems I've ever worked on are teetering one-line away from disaster, and program code that doesn't perform calculations involving dates does exist, but not in the business world. We have 30+ years of sloppy programming out there, most of which doesn't even have source-code anymore and this is going to weigh heavily into the situation.

No, maybe the country won't explode, but there are going to be one heck of a lot of fires to put out during the next year [or longer]. Think about it for a minute ... what would it have hurt to lay in some supplies and be prepared? You would have lost nothing in doing so and if something does go wrong you would be prepared. However, taking the cavalier attitude that you have means that if things DO get squirrely out there then you're going to be in a world of hurt. To have prepared and have nothing go wrong would have done you no damage. I hope for your sake you're right; but the facts indicate otherwise.

-bruce

-- Bruce W. Roeser (broeser@ccgnv.net), November 12, 1999.

If I was Poole, I'd deny being Poole too.

-- Ron Schwarz (rs@clubvb.com.delete.this), November 12, 1999.

I know who you are...

(snicker)

growlin' at the parrot...

The Dog

-- Dog (Desert Dog@-sand.com), November 12, 1999.

King of Spain:

Yes, great point. But to take it one step further: Maybe some of these hard-core "pollies" are actually doomers who discovered that this would be a wonderful, indirect way to get the message to people!

-- eve (123@4567.com), November 12, 1999.

eve: Funny, at first I suspected that Cherri was doing just that -- posing as a ditsy flake, spouting off nonsense, just to make it appear that there was no substance to the polly point of view. I came to realize, however, that Cherri was genuine. (In all fairness, however, let's at least acknowledge that Hoffmeister, sometimes Flint and occasionally Anita S. can put together a reasonable polly argument of substance.)

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.cum), November 12, 1999.

Old Git...

From the article you posted:

Sharon Johnson-Harris and her children ....

Doesn't that name (Sharon Harris) make you go Hmmmmmmmm......

-- BH (bh_silentvoice@hotmail.com), November 12, 1999.

Wrong. Doomers have faith in social Darwinism. I consider you and idiot and hope/expect that Darwin removes you from the gene pool.

-- anonymous (anonymous@anonymous.com), November 12, 1999.

GoldReal - nope, your not the only one. Seems we just don't need to beat our chests and shout so much, no ?

peace, Dan

-- Dan G (earth_changes@hotmail.com), November 12, 1999.

Sorry...99th percentile on all standardized tests. I think it is you in Darwin's sights.

-- You Knowwho (debunk@doomeridiots.com), November 12, 1999.

ONE MORE TIME! WHO GIVES A SHIT! THE GENE POOLE WILL BE CLEANSED!

-- FLAME AWAY (BLehman202@aol.com), November 12, 1999.

I've always thought YouKnowwho was CPR. Same attitude problem.

-- (dot@dot.dot), November 12, 1999.

^5 Dan.

8-)

-- GoldReal (GoldReal@aol.com), November 12, 1999.

species die-back is natural.the world is left no poorer.

-- zoobie (zoobiezoob@yahoo.com), November 13, 1999.