I know that you men feel "prepared" . Well, we do too, but we have the additional burden of cleaning, organizing, etc. yes, yes, you guys do help alot, but we gals have to look at it day in and day out while you file out the door to work. We keep the kids from climbing on it and digging it all out again. We smile benignly at the neighbors who wonder what all the stuff is....some of us have less storage (hidden)areas than others. So Ladies, anybody else feeling frustrated?

I fully expect some men to write in that we should be damn glad to have all of that stuff and stop complaining. Don't bother. If you feel it necessary to write that then you have missed the point entirely. We ARE glad to have it. We just want it to be all nice and tidy.

Now if I didn't have the laundry piled on top of the water and tossed behind the FD brocolli, then I'd be sooooo much happier.

Thoughts?

-- Ynott (Ynott@incorruptible.com), October 22, 1999

Answers

Ever see the film "Pleasantville"?

-- mil (millenium@yahoo.com), October 22, 1999.

You should be damn glad to have all of that stuff and stop complaining.

-- @ (@@@.@), October 22, 1999.

This is going to be a great thread for KOS. <:)=

-- Sysman (y2kboard@yahoo.com), October 22, 1999.

clean house makes a dull woman! I AM NO DULL BY NO MEANS!,plus I have very happy kids

-- (briquetter@yahoo.com), October 22, 1999.

Oh yes!, mil. It is "Pleasantville!" Yes, that is is exactly! Or "Blast from the Past." I always wonder if there is something wrong with me that I cannot relate to the supposed "woman's point of view." Is this some kind of stepford wives club thang? Oh my! Was that Maimie Eisenhower who just walked by?

"Dear Karen" hits me the same way. I just don't fit in the stereotype these women are presuming applies to all women. I don't think most women, nowadays, do. It had something to do with a movement that happened in the 60s. Something to do with bras and glass ceilings......

-- anon (anon@anon.calm), October 22, 1999.

I am glad you started this thread. I am up at 4:30am not able to sleep thinking of all the different things I have to do. I am living in 2 worlds. I have to go on with the usual, get the kids here and there, cook, grocery shop for the present, care about friends and family, do laundry, clean, make sure the kids are doing their homework, monitor all their activities, go to their various performances, pay bills, make money, take the dog to the vet, excercise, on and on and on AND make preparations for the other even crazier possibilities. It is really too much. I wish there would have been another year. 2 years wasn't enough.

-- a mom (Im@overwhelmed.com), October 22, 1999.

Yes Mom, you understand. I am sorry that so many of the above folks did not. If it doesn't bother you then why did you write? Is it your contention that if it is not your problem then it doesn't exist? I said that some would not get it and yet you responded to prove my very words, "stop complaining and be damn glad"...read what I wrote before you respond next time. I am glad that this is not some of your problems. Guess what? Many of you write about things that do not concern me either. I do not respond then realizing that my response would not help you with your dilemma and that I could only cause you ill feeling. How very egocentric of you to write to belittle mine. Of course, having read here for quite some time, I realized this was the case as so many of you proved.

Yes, Mom, I too am home all of the time picking up the slack. I homeschool and fix the cars, clean the house, etc. I like a neat house but to no avail. Happy kids and hubby are more important. Nevertheless, it bothers me that I am unable to keep up with all of the additional stuff....for which I am grateful...but I bought it all as I am also the only GI in the house. For that I am also ridiculed.

I try really hard to do it all and be there for everyone. It is tough sometimes. I want to do more, but don't have a clue as to where to put it at this point. I have locked it upstairs in a bedroom...at least the overflow. That keeps it out of the way of my kids and hubby doesn't have to see it and question me about it either. I am damn glad that it is there and continue to sort, organize, make lists and amend old ones. Then I rush over to the Saxon Math...get the music lesson and science lesson ready. Time to do the wash...Where did I put the purifier? Lists abound. The place is small. I am overwhelmed.

I am glad that so many of you are not overwhelmed. And it really shows in all of your posts too. God bless you all for caring. Hope none of you are expecting relatives or friends. Heaven help them with your CARING attitudes. They will have concerns of their own. Please try to be more understanding in the future.

-- Ynott (Ynott@incorruptible.com), October 22, 1999.

YES. YES. A THOUSAND TIME'S YES!!!! @, are you a boy or girl? since you don't understand this clutter thing, SHUT UP!!!!! :-)

i was sitting amidst this pile (and trust me i mean pile) of big plastic boxes, buckets, shiny bags, and STUFF thinking (some yet without oxygen absorbers and potentially little critters growing), "how the heck am i ever going to get this put away?" i doubt the government would ever want it because it is so chaotic.

then this little voice (i know who HE is) says, "think of what it was like for Noah". so i remembered that Noah was told about the flood 120 years before it happened. think of this people. he had 120 years to build this massive boat (amidst the laughter and jeering of neighbors) and then SOMETHING I HAD NEVER THOUGHT ABOUT--he had to STOCK THE DARN THING FOR A GAZILLION ANIMALS and six people!!!! imagine what a mess he had. much more than me and my little basement. that helped me get it in perspective.

-- tt (cuddluppy@sickofit.com), October 22, 1999.

Thanks tt. That did put it into perspective. I will try harder to remember that HE helps us when we need it and all I need to do is to listen more. Nevertheless, sure wish I had 120 years too.....sure feels like Noah's ark here sometimes! You don't think he'll be sending us all any pairs of animals do you? I want the little ones that don't eat much. Let's send the elephants and lions to @ .

-- Ynott (Ynott@incorruptible.com), October 22, 1999.

I know exactly how you feel. I agree completely. I feel like I've been in that 'first week of moving' stage for 18 months now......and I'm sick of it. I also get up at 4:30 to have some quiet time before the day begins at 6am. Just as soon as I handle a 'pile' in one room, it only makes room for another box to be brought in from the hayloft or garage. I walk around muttering, "If I can get the shelves built in THERE, then I can put THIS away and move THAT over HERE". It's like musical chairs........and *I* NEVER get a seat! I'm working outside so much in preparation for winter, it's gonna take me all winter to get the house livible again. If I have to look at one more paint brush, the next 'thing' that wants to be fed around here will be blowin' it out their schnozzz. My son tells me he's lost his paint set. I told him, "so what. I lost my mind 6 months ago, and you don't hear me complaining. Color it instead."

This morning, I'm having my coffee and wondering about post Y2K. We're covered for an 8-10. I don't know about a 4. I'm so tired of the various scenerios dancing through my head and all the 'what ifs'. This has been the most challenging task I've ever taken on....short of motherhood. The countdown is clicking and ticking away.

Now, where exactly are the Christmas boxes????????????

-- Will continue (farming@home.com), October 22, 1999.

Gawd! You women sound terribly frustrated and unfulfilled, if with two months before the world goes blahooey you whine about not having the ammo stacked neatly, or the fuel smelling up the house, or the little buggers getting into all the gold coins and trying to spend them at the store. (Well, maybe that would be something to worry about.)

In a word, mudwrestle your way to happiness and fulfillment! It is wonderful exercise and will put the spark back into your life. In fact, Mudbello -- which combines the exotic worlds of mudwrestling and belly dancing -- offers you limitless possibilities!!

C'mon, ladies, let's be positive about TEOTWAWKI, using it as the opportunity to be all that we can be. And if you think that YOU have it rough, think of Paul Milne's wife getting her all of her teeth pulled (Kiplinger magazine article, honest, see the thread!) to please her man. Paraphrasing the farmers: if you are going to complain, don't do it with your mouth full of teeth!

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.cum), October 22, 1999.

I had figured if Y2k didn't show its ugly face by 12:15, the food bank was going to get a heck of a donation. Sigh....now we are told it will not explode, but instead slowly crumble. I am soooooooo sick of having a path through to the bed. There are 120 buckets, in addition to cases and cases and shelves and shelves full, in the guest bedroom. Not too bad, except that we have had guests on a steady rotation for the past month. They were not GI when they arrived but that changed after a few days with us and being forced to read the senate report, etc, or they didn't eat. They have all gone home with lists, books, URLs and will be scurrying to get prepared. And yes, part of their "training" was climbing over the buckets to get to the bed. Won't be too long now. Enjoy while you can.

Taz

-- Taz (Taz@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

So glad to know I'm not the only one in a catastrophic mess. Seems to be only enough time to drag in from van and pile up where ever there is some empty floor space. I am the twin of Will Continue. God Bless all.

-- Lori (ABaby72@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

Nothing described here is unique to the female condition.Men raise children,men change diapers,men clean kitchens and baths.You limit yourself when you only think of yourself as a maid,nanny,or a subordinate possession in need of masculine verification.Sexism cuts both ways.

-- zoobie (zoobiezoob@yahoo.com), October 22, 1999.

KOS~KMA!

You prove the point yet again. You post here because you are a supossed GI. Yet again, you have proven that you are a DGI. This post was not about preparedness being unnecessary. It was not about not stockpiling. It was about orderliness and overwhelmed feelings.

You again missed the point. If you have nothing useful to say, then don't post. Rant on your own thread...GAWD in your own words. What a useless male you are.. go mudwrestle yourself.

Zoobie. You too miss the point. Of course men and women share similarities. Some even share the same partners...ooh baby....but the majority of women feel this issure more than the majority of women. Sorry if I offended you and you are one of the men who is a neatnik or who cleans.

Also, since when is cleaning a subordinate position? That is a women's lib philosophy that I do not share. My role is just as necessary as that of the exterminator,the garbage man , or the dishwasher at you favorite restaurant. I guess in your book we are all subservient...how classist and elitist of you. With your opinions, I guess nobody would do the dirty work. Will your staff of cleaning robots come to my house and clean it up?

Also, done that been there...worked as engineer and teacher. I don't find my job now as a housewife any less fulfilling and a whole lot more rewarding....until I meet snobs like you who try to undervalue my contributions. Who is raising YOUR kids, honey?

-- Ynott (Ynott@incorruptible.com), October 22, 1999.

Used to be I tried to keep everything in order, couldn't stand my fathers business style...write the message on the wall, piece of srap paper and never worry... I thought I had to worry about all the clutter, keep my work truck neat and tidy, then I discovered that it gets messed up again and again. Now I just try to keep things sanitary and live with an imperfect desk, truck etc.

I also find myself appreciating my fathers point of view with regard to the world, money and all the other traps. He just wanted to live free and easy. Stop worrying about the little things and just try to keep it clean.

In this world perfection is an illusion.

-- Mark Hillyard (foster@inreach.com), October 22, 1999.

Got carried away for a moment.

should have said-- Women and men share similarities, but the Majority of women feel this way as opposed to a minority of the men.

les whoops....

-- Ynott (Ynott@incorruptible.com), October 22, 1999.

Oh really, Zoob? What are you doing this weekend? Ever seen Kansas in the Fall? Can you lay ceramic tile? My hubby will be grading roads for the Township all weekend (2nd job) and I could use an extra hand.......his second job pays about 1/2 of our monthly insurance RIP- OFF.

BUT, you'll need to conduct a quick reality check about this 'role' theory you have. ROTFLOL

-- Will continue (farming@home.com), October 22, 1999.

Yes, but then I'm normally up to that portion of my anatomy in it, since life is way to short to spend fixating on a clean house. My goal is to avoid health department intervention I hate housework. "make the beds, do the dishes then 6 months later have to do it all over again..." Anyway, I bought those nifty plastic storage boxes, and just hide everything in them. stacked about 5 of them in my closet. That helped a lot. If unemployemnt rises, housecleaning services may again become affordable....one possible silver lining, if in fact I stay employed,which is fairly likely unless its total chaos. I'd rather milk goats, feed critters and tend the garden then vacumn. I see barter possibilities here....one way to help others without freeloading being a problem. Depression economics I guess. It worked before, and variants may again work out cause I just dont see how the economy is going to avoid taking a big hit even if all else stays up.

BTW< @'s post was probably a joke based on you primary statement not to say that-he does like to tease, I think that was a gotcha.

-- LauraA (Laadedah@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

Ynott.. Your second post sounds like you have passed "the point". Stop and listen to yourself breathing. Then understand the next two months will be the last semblence of normality in our lives for awhile... Enjoy this TIME.. time is our most valuable asset...

How do you do this? Again ... Stop.. listen... and then prioritize. quit trying to be everything to everyone... it's impossible.. don't even try... prioritize...the stuff at the bottom of the list may not get done, but you will be happier in YOUR life.

I hate mess too. But I've learned to live with some mess so instead of spending my time yelling at the kids to pick up this and yadda yadda yadda, I can spend the time talking to them or my husband, or taking time for myself. If the book bag is laying on the couch who cares.

Also, delegate. Responsibility is taught by having responsibility. Delegate the stuff at the bottom of the list... maybe, just maybe it will get done.. maybe not...who cares.. if it's that important, move it up on the list.

Time, life, love, don't kill yourself to organize. If the beans are still stashed on the kitchen floor, if they're there tomorrow, will it be the end of the world? Maybe tomorrow you will be more organized with the beans and the task will be a breeze.

Procrastinate... no CHOOSE...

Geez, this must be horrible.. me thinks me rambles... by the way, altho appropriate on this forum, this has been a long standing problem for all caretakers...

Take care of yourself.. the rest will follow.. BYW say a bumper sticker this morning "If mamma ain't happy, no one's happy" or something to that affect...

KEEP THE FAITH AND HOLD ON....

-- booann (cantsay@lovemyjob.edu), October 22, 1999.

Hang in there. In two months you will be able to get rid of all that crap. Charity organizations are going to have a hayday next January.

-- (Iguess@youWill.com), October 22, 1999.

Sounds like PMS (Pre Millennial Syndrome) to me

-- BH (silentvoice@pobox.com), October 22, 1999.

The plastic boxes are a good idea for grains or anything else that fits in them, and the food storage buckets, which stack well (though they get unstable when high, are also good. I suppose you could then drape a colorful sheet over everything, or put up some other kind of decoration to cover it up, once its piled against the wall like a second wall...

When we lived in a tiny apartment a long time ago, we took one room and lined the walls with boxes of all of our stuff, including wedding presents we could not unpack--no room. As long as they're stacked so they lean more on the wall, not away from it, and as long as the boxes are fairly standard sizes, it works really nicely, and provides extra insulation (apartments aren't great in that department) so you'll save money heating and cooling. You can get boxes by asking at grocery stores, etc. for the boxes they might have thrown away. You have a lot of choice on sizes too.

Shelves are really good for things you have to rotate usage of (canned goods? formula? normal foods?). The price of shelf organization is using more space than if things were just in a big pile. But if you're using and rotating those items, and just keeping a larger inventory, then it is worth it.

You are probably going to need some help (hired, or volunteer, like from your spouse or kids?), or else you'll have to cut out some of your other work for a while until that is done. Children over 6, I know from experience, can fold and put away their own laundry, as well as make themselves PB&J sandwiches and other simple foods. They can clean the counter and dishes, too. You might have to do some extra training, but it would greatly benefit the whole family in the long run. Anyone who complained would have a choice to be a volunteer in helping organize the supplies if able.

So do you cook for anyone else? Do anyone else's laundry? Pay the bills? Go through the mail? All of these can be done by someone else temporarily, if you insist. So insist. Tell them, if they don't do it while you're otherwise occupied, then it won't get done. And stick to that (What would they do if you were so sick you were hospitalized? Have them do some of that now.).

I think you're right in wanting to organize everything. Because if nothing happens with Y2K, you're going to want to use it up in a rotated manner so it doesn't rot and your money isn't wasted, and if its hard to hire help on your budget (like another poster said) as it is, you probably should just eat up your supplies yourself, rather than donate them to a food bank.

Just think of your job in this regard as an upper level management position (which it is) equivalent to what you'd get to do in the workforce after spending a lot of time earning promotions, and probably after getting a lot of education. And if you got lucky or came to the attention of the right people too, I suppose. Top management (CEO's etc.) are paid a lot because they have to bring structure to chaos. That isn't easy.

-- S. Kohl (kohl@hcpd.com), October 22, 1999.

Hey, I understand the overwhelmed feeling. Just last night the hubby and I were arguing as to where the 200 gallon water bag and 105 gallon water bags were to go. I kinda thought the one that was designed to go under a full sized bed (the 200 gal) would go under the full sized bed in the guest room (silly me) but he pointed out that it is upstairs and smarty pants that he is knows how to calculate the weight of 200 gallons of water and said NO WAY. So now where to put the things downstairs? Looks like we might sell his parents old formal dining suite!

Seriously, I am also working full time as an 8th grade Reading teacher until December 17 (when we get out for Christmas break). So I *wish* I was at least at home more so I could get more done! Meanwhile the clutter piles up at home. The only consolation I have is that if anyone *does* manage to get past our Chihuahua protection system (WATCH OUT! HE'S DANGEROUS!!! HE WEIGHS *SIX* POUNDS!!!!!) AND we don't put them in the sights of our weapons for some odd reason, they'll never be able to find us anyway.

-- Preparing (preparing@home.com), October 22, 1999.

I think Ynott homeschools. So imagine teaching all of your own kids, who are at different levels, yet being home to do it. It probably wouldn't be easier to get things done at all. At least at school you have a janitor to clean your work area when you're done... :-)

-- S. Kohl (kohl@hcpd.com), October 22, 1999.

I only have one child at home. Here at school I have 97 students. So I am not so sure it would be harder at home. In fact, no, I don't think it would be. Speaking of, off to grade 97 essays.

-- preparing (preparing@home.com), October 22, 1999.

Hi!

I can relate!!

Will Continue wrote: "I feel like I've been in that 'first week of moving' stage for 18 months now......and I'm sick of it."

LOL I can relate! I feel like I'm moving, one room at a time.

I spent most of my adult life heroically resisting my genetically inherited tendencies to be a pack rat. Y2K burst the dam. ;-) I don't think I have ever laughed at myself so much, as in this past year.

The struggle to keep a certain amount of order to all of this has been ongoing & in my life is reaching a fever pitch. I think part of it, is that y2k changed things in my life, if my home looks normal, then I guess I think things will feel more normal. If things in our larger society are unstable, making our home a refuge would seem to be especially important. Unfortunately this is a challenge!! It sounds so simple, but it never ends!

Also, I recently read "Confessions of an Organized Housewife" by:Deniece Schofield, and I found a few gems of ideas for home organizing. I highly reccommend it to anyone (male or female :) who is running out of ideas, it really helped me.

Hang in there everyone!

Deb

BTW King of Spain,

Ummm, exactly who cleans up all of that mud anyway? Hmmm? ;-D

-- Deborah (infowars@yahoo.com), October 22, 1999.

Cuddluppy, "i doubt the government would ever want it because it is so chaotic." --LOL--

Ynott et al, Surprise myself by defending @, but I think Ynott, um, set that one up herself. @'s post *was* funny.

re. Noah's Ark: my household includes 2 dogs (one of them huge), 2 cats and 2 gerbils (the horse, mercifully, is boarded elsewhere). I ordered 25 LBS OF GERBIL FOOD FOR THE WINTER (my child's request). If that doesn't say it all, I don't know what does.

Thanks for the great thread. Soldier on.

-- silver ion (ag3@interlog.com), October 22, 1999.

I'll exchange all you women's cluttered stockpiled house for my neat big and almost empty of stockpile-clutter house.

When SHTF, then you'll know what messy really means.

-- (flakygirl@home.now), October 22, 1999.

The preps forum had a thread on storage but I don't know where it's archived--maybe the intitiator will respond. (Funny--don't know where the thread is "stored," lost it in all the stuff!) "Think vertical" was my contribution. I put Closet Maid shelving all over the spare bedroom--not cheap but easier for me to handle, since I'm not as agile as I was. Others will be able to mess about with sawing boards. Cases of cat food are stored under the sofa, those dressers not flat to the floor, and in my closet (just enough clearance under the hanging clothes. Litter boxes have been elevated via plywood constructions, extra litter and non-food items stored below. I even have some light stuff hanging from hooks in closet ceilings and in the corners of the spare bedroom.

Shelving has helped tremendously but there's stil not enough room for everything. Floorboards are beginning to creak in places they never have before. It's not that I have two years of food--nowhere near. But even a couple of month's worth of extra stuff weighs a ton and takes up an amazing amount of space. As for the water, I'm putting the bulk of it in containers only about 80% full to allow for freezing and it can go under the house. Sweetie can crawl under there and deal with it; I've damn well got enough to do.

I agree--generally speaking, the major burden of preparing and organizing falls on the female of the species. I know there are exceptions but GENERALLY it's true. Nobody is going to be happier than me when all this stuff has been consumed and I can have the space back. One positive aspect--this experience has forced me to become far more organized than I was and I've donated/given away/chucked out stuff that should have been disposed of years ago. Once this is over I shall have a much simpler, uncluttered life. But honestly and realistically, I suspect I shall just fill the space with more clutter! I think I might now be addicted to yard sales. . .

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), October 22, 1999.

I taught highschool at one point--three sections of Chemistry, two of biology. I could usually do all my work in the prep period, before class, and after class, when we had to stay anyway. Of course, since I have a BS in Chemistry, I could cold-turkey all of the Chemistry material, because it was just the basics, so I saved time there probably.

I used spreadsheet programs and some other techniques to cut grading-time/number crunching, just like when you get thousands of data points to analyze in an experiment. I taught at what I consider to be college-freshman level, except I went half as fast, and only two kids in all those classes got below C's. My mother is an English teacher, on the other hand, and she does seem to spend more time, so maybe it is just the subject matter.

Nevertheless, when I got home after teaching, the house was as clean as I left it. That is very psychologically motivating, because things stay clean for hours, not minutes.

Of course, maybe homeschooling one child would give you more time than you have now--how much work was s/he during summer vacation? Probably you got a lot done this summer?

-- S. Kohl (kohl@hcpd.com), October 22, 1999.

Will continue, "the next 'thing' that wants to be fed around here will be blowin' it out their schnozzz. My son tells me he's lost his paint set. I told him, "so what. I lost my mind 6 months ago, and you don't hear me complaining. Color it instead." "

*rotflmao* You're not just Lori's twin, there must be a cyberclan. Count me in.

Taz, "There are 120 buckets, in addition to cases and cases and shelves and shelves full, in the guest bedroom. Not too bad, except that we have had guests on a steady rotation for the past month. They were not GI when they arrived but that changed after a few days with us..."

LOL. Brilliant conversion campaign. Mainline deep subliminal messages straight to their hindbrains while they're still half asleep and staring vacantly.

Unschooling my kids last year helped familiarize me w/ the concept of house as doghair-addled disaster zone. But you're all so right, this is a total Buckaroo Banzai adventure. I needed this thread so bad.

-- silver ion (ag3@interlog.com), October 22, 1999.

shelves help alot- so do those Rubbermaid 20 gallon type plastic bins. It is good for your sanity to get organized- and you should be using and rotating your stuff anyway-

I understand where you are coming from- I buy the stuff and organize it as well- but it got so bad my sweetie finally built shelves this week- yeah!! our house is still being built by us- one closet has a door, etc- so you can just imagine. Plus- all the produce for market is kept inside since no outside storage yet.....so- you can just imagine......

but- so much nicer now that I can see what we've got and use it-

-- farmer (hillsidefarm@drbs.com), October 22, 1999.

Your Majesty,

I have one itty bitty bone to pick with you. Your christening of this fabulous new sport/creative outlet "Mudbello" makes you sound a bit like a sexist swine. I would think a visionary viceroy such as yourself might have the sensitivity to reconsider "Mudbella" a more appropriate name, - perhaps even "Mudbelli"?

zoobs,

Man, the way I see it - it's our internal chaos transformed into the physical realm. The longer we anxiously wait, the further out into the the 'real' world the chaos spreads like a ripple in a pond. Soon it will be spreading from one woman's house to the next, and then - BOOM! - 1/1/00.

Ynott,

Whenever it gets to be too much, do what the mommy did in "Pleasantville" - go take a bath, you'll feel MUCH better {clue here for C. Gereges - the earth moved!}.

-- flora (***@__._), October 22, 1999.

Ynott, I am coming to your defense! I am now single, work full-time and just turned 64, so when I GId upon buying Ed's book on 5/1/99, it took all the time, money and effort I could muster just to grasp what had to be done, then implement it. This means that in my condo, without any other lovely means of storage such as shed, garage, attic, basement, etc., and with ample old furniture and belongings, anything extra became very difficult to accommodate. With little time, virtually none, in which to organize things when I arrive home evenings (after working and errands), things are now out of hand. I, too, have difficulty with clutter, particularly when it impedes normal activities and makes life that much harder. Neither you nor I are saying that we do not appreciate God's gifts of provision to us, but we are simply stating that life is NOT normal now, by any means, and that this particular business of clutter is disconcerting to us. This is not a crime. Everybody is different. I know people who live in clutter continually, as a way of life, and I could never comprehend how they could STAND to fumble around searching for things, tripping over things, clearing off a table or chair in order to use it. So when this began to describe my present state, it was NOT a happy adjustment. I will have to take vacation time in order to get myself in order, because it will have to be well-organized before rollover for all of us or we will be in sorry shape then!

-- Elaine Seavey (Gods1sheep@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

A year ago, a co-worker of mine gave us a Soloflex. He just wanted it out of his basement. My husband and son were thrilled to get it. They set it up on our basement. Where it sat, and sat, and sat. And slowly, it got covered by canned goods, and surrounded by water, until I wasn't even sure it was still under there. Today I dug it out, and took it apart..and will offer it free to the next sucker who wants to have it sit in their basement.

I just recently quit my job and have had a week of non-stop housecleaning pleasure. Here's a hint...it doesn't help much, even when thats all you have to do. Making space just gives everyone in the household more incentive to find things to put there. ;-)

PS..if you'd like a Soloflex free of charge,..give me a shout.

-- kritter (kritter@adelphia.net), October 22, 1999.

KoS, I have a "Babylonian Princess" outfit left over from one of far too many Mardi Gras parties. (I refused to call it a "slave girl" costume.) It would be ideal for belly-dancing, not the least because I made it with seven veils. It's very fetching--lavender and saffron colors (very authentic), with an abundance of ropes of pearls, coins, and jewels. What size are you? I was 5'9", 135 lbs at the time--it just might fit you. I'd love to pass it on--I can use the space. (The silver shoes are women's 11--men's equivalent 9-1/2. Can you walk in 3-1/2" heels?) I'd rather you didn't mudwrestle in it, but, oh, what the hell! It's hardly likely I'll be wearing it any time soon. But our anniversary IS New Year's Eve--what a hoot! Sweetie would bust a gut--and so would I, if I tried to belly dance.

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), October 22, 1999.

Well, if you think you have "clutter trouble" just wait 'til your septic tank backs up on your new carpet and elsewhere. I bought this farm 5 years ago and found out the tank had not been pumped for 20 years. As if I did not have enough trouble with those crazy blue stickers.Let this be a kindly warning to the country folk: get the septic pumped now!

-- Betty Alice (Barn266@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

Oh no, Betty Alice! This must be what people mean when they say, "it tanked."

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), October 22, 1999.

Good post Ynott. My wife feels just as you've described.

-- Count Vronsky (vronsky@anna.lit), October 22, 1999.

Just some observations:

--We have 200+ rolls of toilet paper, but still never a "spare" one within arms reach when you need it!

--We have (X) months of food, but it is 6:00 p.m., and "nothing" to make for supper!

--Likewise, your family knows you have (X) months of food, but they wonder why there is never anything for supper!

--You run out of (vanilla, baking powder, ketchup, brown sugar, fill-in misc. food item here), during the middle of a recipt, and it is ALWAYS in the bottom of the last rubber maid storage container you look in?!

--Bucket size is NOT consistant. You may have gotten 31 lbs of macaroni in that size bucket last month, but this month, only 28 lbs fits in the SAME size bucket! So you end up with "extra", in small lots, stored in every available tupperware, coffee can, or gallon baggies.

--At 6:00 a.m., you know your well kept (HA) inventory list says you have 600 coffee filters SOMEWHERE in this house...but you can't find one anywhere.

--You used the air conditioner a bit more this summer than you normally would have...for the "food"?!

--Your husband has playfully(?) mentioned posting "Weight Limit Signs" on the doors of various rooms in your house?

--It doesn't seem strange to you to have 2 boxes of tampax, 3 gallons of bleach, six jars of mayonaise and a couple of boxes of 22 shells sitting on the kitchen counter for a couple of weeks...until you get company!?

--You find yourself actually encouraging your children to drink the rest of that soda pop, now, because you are putting up kidney beans this evening and need that 3 liter container?

--Bringing a large "stash" home from (Wal-mart, Sam's, Cost Co) isn't as fun as it used to be?

-- Lilly (homesteader145@yahoo.com), October 22, 1999.

Thank you, Old Git, I am glad that SOMEBODY on his thread as a sense of humor!!!! (Ynott, you could use one.)

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.cum), October 22, 1999.

Lily: Gaw you are CRACKING me up with your list of things!!!!! I personally found it a bit scary that I could relate to EVERY single item you listed! I counted last night 296 tampons in my bathroom closet and ACTUALLY wondered if I should buy some more. I did a TP inventory and was shocked to find we had dropped below the 200 roll level. Time to go to Sam's.

I feel like my house is developing a life of its own and is going to swallow us whole.

Ynott: Yes, teaching a subject in which you have to teach and grade writing does take more time. I do a lot during my conference time and actually teach quite a few things cold-turkey. I am a speed reader so that makes it a lot easier. But grading essays is NEVER a fast process. I didn't understand your statement about leaving a clean house in the morning and coming home to a clean house in the afternoon. I guess I would have to leave a clean house in the am to experience it in the afternoon! ;-) It is not clean when I leave it! I have to clean on the weekends, when I am also running errands, doing Y2K stuff, spending time with my daughter (I don't believe in cleaning all the time at the expense of spending time w/her--if I just really HAVE to clean or I am REALLY in the mood to clean, I enlist her help and make it into kind of a game). My husband is working tons of overtime (he can get unlimited overtime at his job) to make big paychecks now to finish out our preps and have some more cash stashed. So he is working about 15 hours a day, even on Saturdays. I have a one hour commute, each way to work. We are planning on moving to the city I teach in next year, IF we can (depends on how Y2K goes). Because of all of our preps in this house and how we have planned here, we didn't want to move before Dec. 31, so I have to put up with the 2 hours a day in traffic for now. That eats up a lot of my time.

What I wouldn't do for a great big closet downstairs instead of all my good storage space being upstairs! Upstairs is full!!!!! Garage is full!!! Pantry is full to overflow!!!

-- Preparing (preparing@home.com), October 22, 1999.

Will Continue and Lori, we are triplets. Lori I especially cracked up at your description of pulling the van in the garage then collapsing in the nearest empty spot in the house. Sure you haven't been spying in my windows? You described my life exactly.

-- Preparing (preparing@home.com), October 22, 1999.

Yes, it's the 'sisterhood'. Count me in as a long-lost sibling!

My mother asked me today if there was something wrong with my car; it was dragging the driveway as we came in. Nope, I replied, just haven't been able to find more room for the canned goods and the 'extra' two 50 lb. bags of rice....

Hubby has gotten quite accustomed to going downstairs to his 'closet' where his clothes are hung up on a chain....need that closet space for storage area, don'tcha know?!?

I'm eyeballing the 'wasted space' of my family room; it has a HUGE vaulted ceiling...just *what* could we put up there???

-- Wilferd (WilferdW@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

Imagine trying to move all your Y2K stuff as well as all your household stuff. Four months ago we moved back into our house on the east coast after 2 years in OR. At this point I had been prepping for Y2K for 16 months!!!!! Tons of food, 500 lbs wood cook stove, kerosene, coleman fuel, bottled H20, rolls and rolls of TP ad nausea!!! First thing I put away was the Y2K stuff (still can't find most of my clothes). Spare bedroom was thus furnished. I have a toilet paper bed covered with a down comforter, stacked can good night stand covered with old tablecloth topped with a hurricane lamp, a chair made of stacked canned goods with a pillow seat/back covered with flowered comforter, dresser drawers are full of rice and beans, closet filled with Y2K. Be creative - design a real Y2K Room!!! Chaos yes, but it looks good!!!!

Morrighan

-- Morrighan (Matotipi@worldpath.net), October 22, 1999.

Thanks again (most of you) for making me think that I'm not really a kook after all. Been pretty organized with my preps, shelves and rubbermaid and inventory lists. Pretty good for a terminal clutter-bug. Was very proud when I went to Hannaford Bros the other day and came home with only stuff I needed then!!! OK, so I did get just a few extra cans, but just in one bag!

But it turns out I'm not all that organized. Decided I needed a little Y2K break and bought a couple of books on simple living. Nice little easy reading inspirational things. Guess what? Can't find 'em!!!!

Glad there are so many of us in this together.

-- lilsparky (star@dmcom.net), October 22, 1999.

You've got the Feng Shui Master on Board...Diane Squire can give you the scoop on the Bagwa of your Y2K declutterization. Know your entrance...face it, now the left hand corner is where you place the loot, put that fancy underware in the love and marriage right hand corner with the coleman blow up mattress. hmmmmm and ask Diane about the rest. You know...sacred space... She helped me so much I nearly had a heart attack from the Chi opening up after I moved all the crap from the front doo

-- Marilyn (Me@MarilynEllis.com), October 22, 1999.

Wow--did I ever need this post today. We also have six kids, goats, gazillions of drywall buckets in the basement, the garage, and now blown all over the yard because of last night's big wind. (The lids made great frisbees.) Today we bought 8 bushels of apples to make applesauce next week. Stacked the bags in the back of the Suburban. At the doctor's office, the eleven-year-old decided to open the back door. Apples everywhere! The puppy (5 months, 50 pounds) still isn't housetrained yet, and the other dog still hasn't learned to urp outside when he's eaten too much from the compost pile. We homeschool, too, and I waver between wondering if they're going to be rocket scientists or just ditch-diggers who can differentiate between Monet and Renoir.

It's all so overwhelming, but the most important stuff will get done. We have to keep encouraging each other, though, or our families are going to find us out on the sidewalk babbling to ourselves.

Keep in touch. I need more of this.

-- Ann M. (hismckids@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

tt and Ynott,

Bwwaaaaaaahhhaaaa haaaaaaaa haaa haa!

Gotcha!!

Laura A was the only one smart enough to figure it out.

-- @ (@@@.@), October 22, 1999.

You are right about the clutter - The dangerous part is the mental and emotional drain it is Keep in mind - do what you need to do to keep sane and clear thinking - sense of humor, and all else.

-- Living in (the@real.world), October 22, 1999.

Hmmmph, @, I posted this above:

"Ynott et al, Surprise myself by defending @, but I think Ynott, um, set that one up herself. @'s post *was* funny."

Last time I'm backing you in a fistfight, bucky.

-- silver ion (ag3@interlog.com), October 22, 1999.

Thanks, ladies, what a wonderful thread! I didn't get to see it until tonight but am ROTFLMAO - especially at Lilly's gem. I like cuddlepuppy's way of putting it in perspective, don't you? Perspective is a good thing. :-)

But I'd much rather look at it all day than file out the door to work as I do - it's kind of a daily shock to come home to it and it's getting harder to find my cats. But I don't care - thank God I've got it.

You could do what I did - put old pillows on top of a row of storage tubs, cover with a print blanket and call it a couch. I highly recommend the toilet paper bed, too. Working on that. Need a spare. Under the regular beds is the best place for canned goods I found. You can get hundreds of them under there, single file. Just don't decide you need one. It's easier to go buy another.

I moved here a year ago, pre-GI. Got the house settled. Had lots of room. Now it looks like the day after the move again. Don't care. These are the good old days. Enjoy them.

-- Scat (sgcatique@webtv.net), October 22, 1999.

silver ion,

I missed you amongst all this chatter! Thanks sweetie, glad someone got a chuckle... Ynott said she was fully expecting it, but apparently she wasn't! (I couldn't resist) lol!

-- @ (@@@.@), October 22, 1999.

Good laughs in this thread. wish my printer was working. I especially relate to 6:00 p.m. a house full of food and what's for supper? Lilly , you rival Dave Barry!

-- Betty Alice (Barn266@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

P>S> I wonder how our dear Martha Stewart is doing......

-- Betty Alice. (Barn266@aol.com), October 22, 1999.

Y'know, we have this banged-up old station wagon that we don't want to invest any more repair money in and I was thinking of donating it for the tax deduction (optimist,huh?), but it would make a GREAT place to store some nonperishable, not-sensitive-to-freezing stuff! It might be worth buying one from a junkyard for a couple hundred and having it towed to your property for extra storage!

I forgot to mention I found some great storage and shelving behind our local Kroger when they were remodeling. Okay, it's true, I had to climb up and get into the big dumper thingie they had back there (size of a tractor-trailer's trailer!) but the Hungarian was with me and kept a look-out--dignity (what little I have left) was not compromised.

So, KoS, is the costume going to fit or not? I need that drawer to stash dehydrated mud.

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), October 22, 1999.

My wife was barking about a 100# bag of wheat in the house that I was cleaning a little bit at a time, we live rustic, she made me bring in a new one because she thought it was "decorative." Who can figure women?

-- Patrick (pmchenry@gradall.com), October 23, 1999.

Forgot to tell KOS: I've got a few gals here in eastern Ohio that love to mudwrestle... they'd probably take you though, they each go about 400#. Don't smell real good either, but you're welcome to come and give them a whirl. Souuu-eeee!

-- Patrick (pmchenry@gradall.com), October 23, 1999.

KOS -- I was bending over an enormous stack of bean sacks when my husband found an innovative way to use them for recreation. ;)

As for the rest of you, I'm so relieved to have found my peer group at last. Today I threw sheets over the water barrels before company came over. Taking Martha's advice to make everything pretty, I topped them with a lovely bouquet of fall leaves in an antique vase.

-- helen (sstaten@fullnet.net), October 23, 1999.

I'm going to have to print this out just to pass it around to my GI friends and family... this is the most fun I've had in weeks! It's 1am...hubby is in bed...he took a week of vacation and guess what we've been doing? oh yes, rearranging the garage to make more room. He, poor dear, thinks he's making room for the car...but alas, there are those water bags that have to go somewhere soon.

I can't tell you how much i've enjoyed this ...

One thought for the guys: since most of you are concerned about keeping low profiles, what do you think happens when a neighbor, or a friend of your son/daughter comes into this house full of buckets, blue or green tubs, boxes, closets bursting with cans, etc,etc. A garage you can't get the car into...

I've had several incidents where I was standing in my dining room or garage with a neighbor and suddenly noticed what their eyes were fixated on...and it wasn't the bowl of fruit on the table or the new lawn mower in the garage. I didn't even bother to explain... It is now a neighborhood joke: we are the people who have lived here for two years but never seem to be through moving...stuff just keeps getting piled up on the curb for garbage day...and stuff keeps getting unloaded ... we seem to shop excessively. I just say I'm eternally spring cleaning and reorganizing....that this house is just too small. That seems to do the trick.

Thanks for a wonderful evening,

-- Shelia (Shelia@active-stream.com), October 23, 1999.

Ladies; Thank you for a wounderful read. -m-

-- Michael Erskine (osiris@urbanna.net), October 23, 1999.

Hello again! I am in a different time zone. Imagine my surprise when I found how many of my sisters and brothers wrote this morning! I am sitting here drinking my bailey's soaked coffee in my Y2K mug and smiling, smiling , smiling! Lily you ARE Dave Berry, aren't you? I ADORED your response...had me in stitches...all too true. Helen, you too. You were the last response I read. I think our hubbies are related.

There seems to be some confusion about who posted what. I am the homeschooler. I don't have a neat house. I used to be a private/public school teacher...did it for five years. Of course your house is neat when you leave and come home. There is nobody there to mess it up. Homeschooling is different. I won't say it is more work or harder...but believe it or not, it is just as much and your students never go home and school never lets out.... Year round, round the clock....different. Since they belong to you, they talk back more too. It is a REAL challenge.

My house has no attic, no basement, no garage, and YIKES, no closets. Overseas, did you know that if they put in a closet it is considered a room on which they must pay taxes? So there are no kitchen cupboards or closet in the entire house. Storage takes on a new meaning. I live in Italy. My storage items are somewhat unique.

I have ordered the net (FD stuff), but I pay a premium in shipping even if I pay less for the product on sale. They get me coming and going. If you think that you face ridicule and derision by DGI's in the States, try overseas. Less than 2% (according to some quotable source here) of the Italians have even heard of Y2K. I've informed the neighbors, but they are uninterested.

Hubby is lukewarm on the subject...He objects to my storage areas. Thank you so much for all of your creative ideas! I am very impressed with the TP bed. I can't find large containers here. I use rubbermaid until it is coming out of my ears. Hubby always asks, "another one?" He is very sweet, but still a DGI.

I love the suggestions and shared experience. I think it has hit its peak because our supplies are maxing out. It is Late October as I write this. We have been living with this thing hanging over our heads like the sword of Damocles for a couple (or more) years now and as I hear in the background (hubby is reading Dr. Suess to our two year old)...."The time has come, the time is now...." (from Marvin K. Mooney, Will You Please Go Now)..

So, I guess as we all make our last minute preps, nerves will get more frayed, children more boisterous, neighbors more nosy, friends more teasing, and DGI's more oblivious.

I'm gonna send hubby off to stock up on the Bailey's Irish cream later. All of a sudden he is a GI...with regard to liquor and beer anyway. Heaven forbid we should run out of the IMPORTANT stuff. Ha!

Thanks for answering friends. I really needed to hear I wasn't alone. I appreciate all of you so much. Keep the support and ideas coming. I enjoy them all.

-- Ynott (Ynott@incorruptible.com), October 23, 1999.

From: Y2K, ` la Carte by Dancr (pic), near Monterey, California

Here's the prep forum thread referred to above: Organization of Preps.

-- Dancr (addy.available@my.webpage), October 23, 1999.

What a great thread! I'm not quite to the point reached by some but will be before long. Good ideas on camouflage! Keep them coming please!

-- Francesca (--@--.--), October 23, 1999.

Preparing, If your windows are like mine, nobody could see in. No time to wash them.

-- Lori (ABaby72@aol.com), October 23, 1999.

Lori: LOL! Mine are FILTHY!

FUNNY PREPPING STORY, GALS: I realized this morning, I had the blinds pulled up to the window over the stairwell and I was lugging up all the canned food I had just bought at the store (another $200 worth--will I EVER feel done???) when I realized our local Mrs. Kravitz (remember "Bewitched"?) was in her front yard looking quizzically into our stairwell window as I was lugging #10 cans of cherry pie filling UPSTAIRS. I closed the blinds. Saw her later and sure enough, she asked me about it and I just said that I do a lot of holiday baking (pies and such) and don't have the room for it in the pantry so I am using the guest bedroom. She laughed and said it's a good thing we only have one kid or I wouldn't have the room to do that! Oh, yes, I said, HA HA HA HA!!! HA HA HA HA!!!

CLose call. SHe is a BIG DGI and still asks me every time I see her "Why haven't you given that sweet girl a baby brother or sister? They NEED siblings!" to which I always want to scream "IT'S A MYTH!!! THEY DON'T *NEED* SIBLINGS!!! BESIDES, WE ARE HAPPY WITH ONE NOW! BESIDES, I ALMOST DIED TRYING TO HAVE ANOTHER!!!!! TWO ECTOPICS, RUPTURED TUBES, EIGHT, COUNT 'EM, EIGHT MISCARRAIGES, LADY! MYOB!!!"

But I don't. Sorry that was way off topic. I really really don't like her.

Happy prepping! BTW, for whoever said they are starting to have to search for their cats, I haven't seen my female cat Clarissa in a day or two. And she is an indoor cat!!!

-- Preparing (preparing@home.com), October 23, 1999.

italics off!

-- K. Kz (k@k.com), October 23, 1999.

We had a friend from overseas who said that her family had moveable cabinets and wardrobes, kitchen, pantry, linen -- everything. When they moved the cabinets were like furniture, and people supplied their own. No built-ins.

Good cover-up ideas! :-) Yes, keep them coming. And any ideas on constructing a moveable loft to use some air space up there ...

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), October 23, 1999.

Is there a hyphen in "anal retentive"?

Al

-- Al K. Lloyd (all@ready.now), October 23, 1999.

Preparing and Old Git, This is way, way too funny. I have a Mrs. Snoop too, whose picture window is right across from my drive way. She sits in from of that window in her rocker all day. I call her Grandma. Anytime we come or go, she has her head out that window. I hate it when my husband beats me in the garage. (Only have room for one car in there now) I can almost bet she has a pair of opera glasses so she can read the store name on the bags I'm carring in. I can't always leave stuff until dark. I am beginning to stock up on meat. Sometimes I wave at her when I leave the drive and she quick pulls her head back from the window. Nosey Old Bitty !!!

-- Lori (ABaby 72@aol.com), October 24, 1999.

Truly a humorous thread, ladies. Lily: Erma Bombeck comes to mind. Previous poster (whose name I already forgot): I believe you meant to say "I hate it when my husband beats me TO the garage."

-- Anita (notgiving@anymore.com), October 24, 1999.

Hint to men...

You come home and MAYBE notice the clutter and think..."The house is a little messy."

A woman comes home, surveys the piles, and thinks..."I am a terrible mess!"

This is why the disparity in reactions.

Get it?

-- Toofunny (still@laughing.com), October 24, 1999.

burn the bed,baby!W're all equal when we sleep(more when we drink).

-- zoobie (zoobiezoob@yahoo.com), October 24, 1999.

K. Stevens, Hubby is attached to Staff with the Navy out here. We are both civilians however. Italy is a rush...wonderful, unique, and very, very different. I love it out here, but am concerned as it is ALWAYS listed as a potential disaster area...Y2K-wise, anyway.

This thread has taken many turns and I am delighted! I so enjoyed the stories about the busybodies watching you unload. My italian neighbors are MUCH more sophisticated...They come over and lounge against my fence until I notice them and then they strike up a conversation...should I say, dissertation on some subject as they eye the place. Most amusing. I adore them all, but none are preparing. I discussed the idea with them about 6 months ago and now don't mention it at all...obvious reasons...

We are sure living in interesting times. I am still moving stuff up into the extra bedroom and I can't find anything anymore. It took me over an hour to find the thank you notes for my daughter's party. She would have killed me if I'd lost them!

-- Ynott (Ynott@incorruptible.com), October 25, 1999.