Thankfully we've found a rental with almost everything we need. It's 20 minutes from the nearest large town (no clue where the nearest 7-11 is located, but more than 5 miles), has a woodstove and a wood cookstove, creek, apple trees, propane, garden space, secluded in trees. Now come the rollover, is some government agency going to come and yank us out of there? Gee, I'd hate to think that we went to all this trouble for nothing.

-- CD (CDOKeefe@aol.com), October 03, 1999

Answers

CD, I would imagine that the powers that be will be so dang busy dealing with city and suburb folks, that it'll be a while before they even give a thought to those out in the country. In any case, just refuse to go, especially if you have animals. They always refuse to let folks take their animals, and that was a big problem in Floyd's path.

-- (formerly known as nobody@nowhere.ret), October 03, 1999.

For the life of me, I can't figure why anyone would want to move anyone anywhere, and how they could possibly do it.

If I move you from point X to point Y, how does that solve any problem? How will you go to your job? How will I feed you, clothe you, heat you, bathe you, occupy your time, keep you free from public health menaces that proximity with unwashed others, and overfilling toilets, will quickly breed?

Assuming this were even possible, it makes very little sense. Instead of making it easy for you to get to work to fix things, they waste their valuable time shuttling people around. Shouldn't they instead be plowing roads, providing medical attention, protecting lives and property?

Sorry, I'm not buying that anyone will be shuffling the populace about.

-- Scarecrow (somewhere@over.rainbow), October 03, 1999.

I think being removed from ones home would be indicative of: (A) non-mortgage or non-rent payment beyond whatever the arbitrary deadline is, (b) violence, scuffles, obstruction of law or threats to others originating from the homes or institutions where removal happened, (c) health threats: diseases, viruses and plagues within the said structures, (d) collapse or unlivable structures, (e) strategic location the home is to the military or F.E.M.A.

Any other reasons you can add cannot hurt.

-- Feller (feller@wanna.help), October 03, 1999.

Scarecrow, the thinking seems to be that -- in a bad or worst case situation -- the authorities would seek to confiscate (especially from those who prepared) generators, fuel, vehicles, food, cattle, medicine, etc., with the intention of re-distributing those items to those who didn't prepare. Having taken all your stores, they would then have to put you in a shelter.

Don't think it could happen? The City Council in Eugene OR recently tried to enact a local ordinance that would have given the City Manager unilateral authority to enter private property and confiscate anything he felt he needed. Word of the plan was broadcast on the net and under pressure from concerned citizens, the proposed ordinance was revised...somewhat...but the incident is indicative of the thinking and intentions of local authorities. I suspect they'll wait until the dust settles, then try it again.

In my own situation, living in a sparsely-settled rural area in SW Oregon, I doubt we'll have that problem. Should it occur, though, I will just have to refer the erstwhile confiscators to my assistant, Mr. Mossberg.

-- Norm Harrold (nharrold@tymewyse.com), October 03, 1999.

If that's the case, where the local officials would confiscate, then why not look at other options for storage. I'd like to hear others responses to this as on could bury it or transfer it into hiding somewhere!

-- RuralWise (RuralWise@afar.distance.com), October 03, 1999.

No.

-- Gus (y2kk@usa.net), October 03, 1999.

maybe you are too young but i remember the old civil defense shelters that were located in the basements of public buildings. they all had a yellow and black sign on the outside of the building which indicated their presense. well they've been gone for years and they haven't been replaced. there aren't any shelters folks. go ask the people in north carolina about all the wonderful shelters. shure their were a few but the numbers were woefully inadequate.

find a spot you feel safe at, stock it and quit wasting your time worrying about being relocated to some imaginary shelter.

an unsheltered smooch t

-- corrine l (corrine@iwaynet.net), October 03, 1999.

I think it depends on where you live, and if you are lucky enough to still have electricity. For instance, if you live in MN, like my family, if the electric goes out in a rural area,esp. in January when its so bitterly cold, you could very well be located to a place with a source of heat. My guess is though, that the authorities will leave you alone since you already have a woodstove and supplies. Never know, though. My parents live on a farm about 30 miles from me. It's secluded a nice big area. Would be a wonderful place to bug out to if they would bother to prepare, except for their electricity is provided by the local rural electric cooperative (REA) which is produced in - get this - GARRISON NORTH DAKOTA!!!! That is a mere 300+ miles from them. Alot can go wrong and probably will 01012000. Find out where your electricity is produced. If it is produced locally, you may not have the problems distance can cause, and the authorities will be more likely to leave you alone. My big fear is that since rural co-ops seem to be the furthest behind in remediation, local authorities will be taking that into consideration. My parents live in the same county I do, and I have talked with alot of people who are knowledgable about y2k remediation in the county, and they are all very worried about the local co-op. Instead of ME going to bug out at their house I may be taking THEM in. Besides, they live closer to the metro Mpls.-St. Paul area than I do. They are actually in more danger than I am, not to mention that I have a woodstove, a way to cook food, water stored, etc. and they do not. (They are DWGI's so I just pray for them ALOT.) If you live in a cold northern state, the authorities may have some kind of contingency plan in place. If there is the slightest chance that they believe you would suffer from hypothermia, you MAY have to relocate. ALWAYS have a bug out bag ready CD. It's just good common sense. Above all, take one day at a time. That's all we can do anyway - right? Keep prepping and you will do ok, and you WILL SURVIVE. You can e-mail me if you want. E-mail is real. God's peace to you and yours.

-- luann (flataufm@hutchtel.net), October 03, 1999.

I wouldn't be worrying about the government coming in trying to take your goods, they can try, but they will have a blood bath on their hands. I know a lot of people that have recently purchased guns and ammo and I am sure you have heard news reports of a huge rise in gun purchases. The firing range near me is standing room only and it's the busiest I have ever seen it even on weekdays! Your biggest worry should be your unprepared neighbors and loser relatives coming to your door. Have your stash in several nearby locations if you have to. Now's a good time to find a cheap storage unit close to your home and stash some stuff there. Think ahead and be prepared.

-- one step ahead (onestepahead@onestepaheaddd.xcom), October 03, 1999.

I work with an emergency manager with the Dept. of Emergency services in my state (Also mutual aid responder for FEMA). I asked her the question about evacuation of rural areas of the state. She said that state emergency management will pretty much ignore those in the country and concentrate on the large cities and population centers. They feel that those living in the country are hearty enough and resilient enough to handle it without some basic infrastructure (they've had to deel with ice storms, blizzards, etc.).They believe the problems will arise in the cities and only have a limited number of emergency workers, most of which are being assigned to our state capitol for the role over.

I also asked her this about the allocation of resources: If basic supplies are scarce or locked up elsewhere, and there is a finite percentage of the pop. without the means to subsist, also a finite percentage of the population who stocked up and prepared, what steps would be taken in terms of the allocation of resources?

Her answer: "In that case, we will just have to take them from the land of plenty"

Kinda sobering!

-- loveitinthecountry (marshall2@iname.com), October 04, 1999.

There is far more risk that the government will require you to take in 'x' number of strangers from the city than the risk of the government making you enter a shelter.

Imagine this....."Since you proved last week to us that you are capable of taking care of yourself and don't need our services, we feel that under the Orders of the Governor your family can assist at least two innercity families that cannot survive where they are. The trucks will be here in an hour. What do you mean, where's the food? This is now YOUR problem to solve!"

With the breakdown in transportation of foodstuffs due to the potential explosion in petroleum products, it would not make sense (I know, I'm talking about the government...it doesn't HAVE to make sense) for the government to shift people that are capable of caring for themselves into shelters where TPTB must provide everything. The logistical tail for the implementation of that idea is mathmatically improbable...not impossible, but very improbable. (Of course, a baby is improbable by mathmatics too....but they do happen). It would make far more sense for the government to identify all those that 'prepared' and force them to use their stash to assist the 3 or 4 or 5 or 6 etc, that the government has brought out of the cities. the government then 'wins' the admiration and allegiance of those they 'rescued' and forces the prudent stockpiler to part with a percentage of his holdings. All without guns, threats or incarceration. Plausable?? You bet! They did it in WWII on the West Coast in the Japanese-American communities.

'Those that do not learn from the lessons of history are forever doomed to repeat it".

-- Lobo (atthelair@yahoo.com), October 04, 1999.

A recent PBS television program, Tony Brown's Journal, featured an ex- FBI agent (10-year veteran of the FBI, with PhD in Criminal Justice) who explained the intelligence community's "Mad Max" (worst Y2K scenario) planned response to disruptions next year. At least Jan - June, maybe the whole year... (The Mad Max response was one of three levels of scenarios ... just in case) He explained there were plans for Hostage Recovery Teams to go in and restore order, for mass relocations of people, for acceptable civilian losses, and rounding up of dissidents. This would be in the larger cities, and involve African American communities. Tapes are available of the Tony Brown program.

-- (Oxsys@aol.com), October 04, 1999.

Pol Pot moved everybody. It's called the KILLING FIELDS and it can be done and there are plans for just that.

Get used to it.

-- K. Stevens (kstevens@ It's ALL going away in January.com), October 04, 1999.