OT waco... read the Davidian's last words in court

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http://home.maine.rr.com/waco/speech.html

(I don't know how to make the link glow green)

Whether you agree with their religion or not, you will find the statements they made just before being railroaded into prison, to be quite prophetic.

Words like this were spoken by unamed countless millions in this century, to the executioners and jailers of Hitler, Mao, Stalin, Pol Pot, Milosevic, Hussein, Pinochet, Castro.......

In this decade, in our lifetimes, these words have been spoken in America.

The meaning of Waco is that we defeated the dictators of the world in battle and economically, only to succumb to their disease. We won the physical wars against tyranny, but lost the moral conflict. We are becoming like them ! We are doing as they did!

Did millions of decent Germans and Russians bother to act, to prevent their nations from descending into hell and darkness ? No more than decent Americans are. That's why we are losing this battle to save freedom.

How do you slap a whole nation upside the head and get them to wipe their eyes, to see what is plainly before them?

WAKE UP, AMERICA!!!!

WAKE UP!!!

-- Forrest Covington (theforrest@mindspring.com), September 21, 1999

Answers

X-RATED SOCIETY,S ALL FALL. SOONER OR LATER. 1ST CORRUPTION THEN DEATH.---STRIKE UP THE BAND,LOOK THE OTHER WAY--UNTIL THAT day.

-- WATCHING U.S.A. DIE, (dogs@zianet.com), September 21, 1999.

I don't know how to spell the sound of an M-14 chambering a round, but if you ever hear it you won't forget it. PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN!!! I MAY NOT LIVE FREE BUT I'LL DAMN SURE DIE THAT WAY.

-- Nikoli Krushev (doomsday@y2000.com), September 21, 1999.

I CATCH HELL, BECAUSE I MENTION GOD.& ON OUR MONEY'WE SAY [IN GOD WE TRUST] ????

-- GOD BLESS AMERICA? (dogs@zianet.com), September 21, 1999.

this is old, but it still is pertinent. Opening post to thread entitled no more mr. nice guy...

I think it's time for a reality check here. There are estimated to be over two hundred million pivately owned firearms in this country. Those weapons have a useable lifetime of around a hundred years on average. I don't know about you but I'm not turning my guns in no matter what kind of stinking unconstitutional law they pass. I'd bet a pretty penny that far more than half of all the other gun owners wouldn't either. And that half of gun owners who would refuse own far more than half the guns because that's just the kind of son of a bitches we are. I don't know ANY gun nuts who own just one gun. More like ten or fifteen and thousands of rounds of ammo to go with them. the goobermint isn't completely idiotic. They know that guns can never be succesfully outlawed in this country. They know that any attempt at door to door confiscation is going to result in instant civil war, and Washington will be burned to the ground. They know that liberal pansies will vote for them if they make a lot of noise and attempt to pass laws but they also know just how far they can go, and they have almost reached that point.

As far as I'm concerned none of the gun control laws that have ever been passed are constitutional. Not one. The second amendment is very clear on the point that the people shall have the right to keep and bear arms so that they shall be able to defend against foreign invaders and domestic government run amok. Not guns, ARMS. The militia is expected to appear if called bearing arms of the type and kind currently in use by the armed forces. The militia consist of every able bodied male in this country between the ages of eighteen and 50 I think. If I am not mistaken the types of arms in use by our military are all either full automatic or selective fire with full auto capability. Therefore every man in this country is legally obligated under the constitution of the United States to posess a weapon capable of full automatic fire.

Further, since the Illegal standing army the government maintains in direct violation of the constitution also uses Tanks, Jet fighters, bombers, missiles, poisonous gasses, biological weapons, and nuclear weapons the constitution clearly states we must have equal arms as citizens. The constitution is VERY clear on this point. At no time is the government to maintain a standing army with superior firepower to the citizens it represents.

That sounds pretty hysterical I know, but if any of you watched what went on at Waco, you realize it is still a valid argument. While the Branch Davidians were heavily armed with semi-automatic weapons they were absolutely defenseless when the government brought in tanks and helicopters. And I guarantee you if they had the weapons to take out those tanks and helicopters the government would have brought in B- 52's and carpet bombed that place into a moonscape. And if they had the missiles to take out those B-52's the government would have nuked them.

Somewhere back around the time of world war one governments became obsolete. With the invention of nuclear weapons they became obscenely obsolete. I'll tell you a little secret too, the governments know it. They know their era is over and they pass law after law, bind the shackles tighter and tighter, take away freedom bit by bit in their ongoing effort to hold that power over the people. There can be only one end to this road we are following. The genies of nuclear and biological weapons are forever out of their bottles and it is only a matter of time before these obsolete governments destroy the planet in one last desperate attempt to hold onto power. 1999. It's later than you think.

Now before some of you blow a gasket thinking I've turncoated to the NWO let me assure you that is exactly the opposite direction I am going with this. Recent trends towards global corporations and banks in the interest of increased productivity and profits clearly show that they leave disenfranchisement and economic devastation in their wake. Major segments of the population are left unemployed with no hope of reemployment short of migration to chase ever more elusive and technologically demanding jobs for which they are ill prepared to compete. While the collective Bankers and major obsolete governments work towards one world government the fatal flaw in their plan is never mentioned. The flaw is simple, and as old as time. Power corupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. There is and never has been any human or group of humans capable of weilding that kind of power without abusing it. The fact that the greediest and most power hungry among us are the most ardent pursuers of this ponzi scheme absolutely assure that it will be corrupted from the start, and decline rapidly to the point of global slavery from which there will be no hope of escape.

The answer to these problems and the model for the type of government needed to adress these concerns already exist. It lies in decentralization of power with local governments empowered to react to local situations. The stripping of power from a central government, and the weaponry maintained by a civilian militia united under the auspices of a collective of local governments. In short the Constitution as origionally written.

The more I study the Constitution the more amazed I become. The sheer brilliance of this simple elegant document completely belies it's human origins. When in the history of mankind has such a collection of genius assembled under one roof at one time dedicated to a unified goal? Like the works of Mozart, Beethoven, and Michelangelo this document rears like a monument immune to the ravages of time from the disposable junkyard society mankind has created. It dances in eternal point counterpoint waltz with the enigma of the pyramids. A manifest refutation to the theory of elitism. Who can doubt that the hand of God was as surely involved in its creation as the Earth itself. Like a postscript to the Bible it roars, "SET MY PEOPLE FREE!!!"

-- Nikoli Krushev (Doomsday@y2000.com), April 28, 1999

Answers

-- Nikoli Krushev (doomsday@y2000.com), September 21, 1999.


I will turn my weapon in if I must. I will then hide the other six.

-- Charlton (x@y.come), September 22, 1999.


MR.KRUSCHEF, GETS IT'GETS IT' GETS IT. OUR NATION WAS FOUNDED BY IMPERFECT [BUT] GOD FEARING MEN.--WE,VE DISSED GOD FOR YEARS, NOW WE ARE REAPING A BITTER CROP.[PARTYING WHILE IT DIES]

-- liberty-or-death? (dogs@zianet.com), September 22, 1999.

I agree with some of Nikolai' points.

I doubt the Framers intended for the yeoman soldier to go to the expense and trouble of maintaining artillery, for instance. Their idea was the individual citizen posessing his personal weapon sufficient for military use. Guns were quite expensive then (still are) and one intent of the Second Amendment was to reduce the expense as well as to speed up the deployment of militia forces.

The Branch Davidians were holed up in a fixed defense. Also they had no actual intention to fight, else they would have fired on the alphabet soupers during the seige. They didn't. They also could have killed more of the original raiders had they intended, they didn't. They were caught mostly by surprise, the little warning they had probably reduced their casualties until the final "non-assault".

A number equal to theirs, even if only lightly armed, dispersed throughout the countryside, would have tied up hundreds if not a couple of thousand troops. The People don't need missiles, check the history of any major guerilla war in this century. The guerillas normally win. Add to this the vast number of Bubbas who are disgusted, have military experience, and can stalk within bowshot of a deer, and you have an unwinnable scenario for the government. That is why they are boiling the gun control frog so very slowly- although the recent mass shooting hysteria has raised the temperature a notch, just in time for Y2K.

A number equal to theirs

-- Forrest Covington (theforrest@mindspring.com), September 22, 1999.


IF WE AS A PEOPLE, WOULD''HUMBLE'' ourselves & PRAY, THEN GOD WOULD HEAL OUR [VERY] SICK NATION. AT THIS POINT IN TIME, IT,S OUR [ONLY] HOPE.--MORE LAWS & PROGRAMS=WON,T DO IT.

-- PRAYER CHANGES THINGS. (dogs@zianet.com), September 22, 1999.

I hope you are right. I fear you are discounting one very important thing,...that the younger generation has been conditioned successfully and perhaps will not be so eager to sacrifice themselves for liberty.

There arose a pharaoh who knew not Joseph....

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 22, 1999.


Amen Nik, Amen Mumsie-and THAT is why we don't stand a chance of remaining a free people.

-- INVAR (gundark@sw.net), September 22, 1999.


it,s called reaping & sowing. 70 years of turning away from GOD' now it,s payday. & we,re getting an UGLY-CROP.

-- a fallen eagle IS AMERICA. (dogs@zianet.com), September 22, 1999.

Mumsie is correct about the younger generations. We lost many of them in the current pulic school system. What history instruction they received has been significantly slanted.

Many of us have the same concerns about the subversion of the Constitution. The question here is 'How do we correct the course of government and turn the government back to the people?'

Armed rebellion gets you only so far. We had a revolution in 1994 and essentially got us no where. That is why I remain so very concerned about Y2K. Look at the number of interest groups and tell me that they will all agree to implement the Constitution and re-establish the government. The politics of these groups is extremely diverse and often contrary. We have in the recent past had presendential candidates (specifically Ross Perot on the Larry King show) propose holding a constitutional convention to eliminate the second amendment.

Some of you have brilliant ideas for answering the question above. We must get these in the open so that we can implement them.

-- Tom (nomail@nomail.com), September 22, 1999.


The biggest instrument of global control is not a UN army. It's the Federal Reserve that is the instrument of tyranny. I fear we will fall without a shot being fired. All they have to do to bend our knees is deprive us of money.

-- Tim the Y2K nut (tmiley@yakko.cs.wmich.edu), September 22, 1999.

I have a radical suggestion for anyone out there who

1) Believes liberty in America may be lost and

2) Has children that are school age.

Pull your children out of the public schools, and teach them yourself. Public education should have been a concentration on the best methods to teach the three R's, but it has a much greater agenda (and has turned out semi-illiterates with no understanding of critical thinking by the droves). Public education is really about socially educating children into the proper attitude and worldview. Remember that other nations have used this agenda in the past, and were successful to the point of children turning in their own parents to the government.

If your children are older, start some adult family time to discuss history. It's never too late. Adult children are still influenced by their parents. They will still respond to you taking a stand for Truth. They may not show it at first, but you will have an influence.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), September 22, 1999.


A question for all of you patriots that I have been wishing to ask for many weeks, but now sparked by recent threads, including the link to the April/May lengthy one: how do likeminded people converse, other than on this forum and others?

-- Elaine Seavey (Gods1sheep@aol.com), September 22, 1999.


I'd draw the line on nuclear weapons, but otherwise, right on! :-) But read your Jeff Cooper, a good long-range rifle and corresponding skill makes up for a lot. One Allied guy in WWII jumped off an Axis ship that anchored for repairs, brought a good rifle with him, and singlehandedly kept that ship tied up at anchor for months. Every time the crew went on deck to repair, he shot a guy and moved. Didn't need his own ship.

-- nope (not@thistime.com), September 23, 1999.

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