Dear Mike, Patrick, "d", and the others

May I ask you a few questions?

If life in these United States is so unfair, by not taxing the citizens to the hilt or regulating us into submission why do you and your friends stay here? You must have ulcers from thinking of all the social programs that are unfunded because the people just don't agree with you when it comes to taking their pay checks to use as you see fit.

Does seeing people driving around in BMW's, Lexus or a new truck just tick you off so bad, because the money they spent on it could have gone to some deadbeat or protection of the snail darter?

Does seeing people have a good time and enjoying themselves send you scurrying back home to read Marx or Mao to show you the true way?

At what in your life made you go to the dark side?

I have read most your post on this site stating that will you will vote no on I-695, and trying to convince others. Okay, vote no, which is your right and I would be the first to defend them for you and I might say I have. But please don't say that this state or this country knows best how to spend my money or your money for that matter. They don't. As for electing the people who we think will represent us best, I do. But when they vote on a bill while their asleep or haven't even read the bill what recourse do we have then. Yes we will try and vote them out of office next time but the damage has been done.

This week in the Tri-City Herald on the front page the headline read "Local governments looking at tax increases". Why do we never read "Local governments looking for ways to lower taxes"? The city manager for Richland says it won't be easy to lose $1 to $1.5 million dollars. I guess because their budget is $127m for about 40,000 people (that's more than $3,000 per person in taxes for the slow ones) I guess less then 1% would be tough. Oh by the way they gave almost $50,000 to the last city manager when the city council didn't renew his contract because they didn't want to seem like bullies. Of course he had a new job within a week. Then there was the human resources director who made harassing phone calls to an ex-girlfriend and sexually harassed another woman, hell they just gave him 6months severance pay to go away quietly.

I guess this is how you think governments can spend our money best.

I know this will have the lot of you fuming but tough. If you don't like being called communist and socialist please move to some other country so Bill and call you a campaign donor.

P.S. you might do better trying to convince your liberal friends to vote no, as the ones I talk to on a daily basis are voting yes. But maybe not.

ED

-- Ed (ed_brigdes@yahoo.com), September 16, 1999

Answers

Ed writes:

"If life in these United States is so unfair, by not taxing the citizens to the hilt or regulating us into submission why do you and your friends stay here?"

You think we're taxed into submission? Try going to Europe sometime. Then you'll see what being taxed into submission is like.

"Does seeing people driving around in BMW's, Lexus or a new truck just tick you off so bad, because the money they spent on it could have gone to some deadbeat or protection of the snail darter?"

No, it makes me laugh because they're stupid enough to waste their money on a horrible investment like a car. They have fun in their car, I have fun with the fact that I bought AOL three years ago when it was in the crapper instead of wasting my money on some dumb yuppie mobile. I mean look around, buy some stocks or mutual funds or something instead of buying a car! When have you ever heard of a car appreciating in value?

Look Ed, I know that you'll find this hard to believe, but I'm opposed to 695 mainly because I think that it'll cause the most problems for local governments, not the state. Quite frankly I think that even the most die-hard 695 supporters would admit that the more local government is, the more responsive it is to its citizens. 695 will hurt this responsiveness.

Local taxation districts are almost always completely ignored by their citizens. Have you ever gone to a fire district meeting? A hospital district meeting? School district? Water district? Probably not. 99.9% of the public never does.

The people that get elected to the lower district positions don't do it for the money or the politics, they do it because they care about their communities. And I think that 695 will cause so many problems for these small districts that the people who run them will decide it isn't worth putting up with the hassle any more. And why should they? The stress of dealing with 695's consequences won't be worth the benefits they receive. Community pride only goes so far.

Everybody's so blinded by their anger at the state that they can't see that the biggest impact of 695 isn't going to be on the state. It'll be on the little guys, not the big one.

BB

-- BB (bbquax@hotmail.com), September 17, 1999.

Dear BB

I never said buying a car was an investment, it isn't to me. What it is is a way to get to work to support my family. Because I buy a new car I figure I am buying something that is safe for my wife and me. Something that gets reasonably good mileage and will get me to where I need to go. By the way I'm glad that your AOL stock has done so well for you No, I don't want to go to Europe. I like it here. One of the arguments is always that our taxes or gas prices are lower then in Europe. Great, this isn't Europe. But it seems that the politicians in D.C. want us to be with socialized health care. And finally the poor local communities. What will they do. If the services they provide are in line with what the people of that area needs, I don't see a problem. The people living there will approve a tax increase to fund it If not then yes they will have to cut some people (of which I may be one). If they are going to lose so much by the state losing less then 2% of its budget I am sure they will be knocking on the capital doors telling our illustrious leaders to help them by going back over the budget to get rid of any waste that is in it. On other thing (I know I said finally in the last paragraph but) people talk about how much better it is to ride the bus, do to less pollution. I will have to do some digging to find it, but the last I read, bus exhaust was a worst carcinogen then cigarettes.

-- Ed (ed_brigdes@yahoo.com), September 17, 1999.

So ED, we should all stop riding the bus or pick up smoking, what are you saying? Let's simplify. What makes less pollution. A bus with 50 passengers on it, or fifty cars with one person in each?

You will never be one of the people that are cut of from state social services because if you are typing on your computer right now, or having your Volvo and eating it too, you have never had to stand in line for a hand out in your life. Give a little Ed. It does not need to be when we have a little money and we don't have to know who it specificaly goes to, what do we care, we already have enough, just for the sake of giving.

-- ac (calavo@hotmail.com), September 17, 1999.

ac-- "Give a little Ed. It does not need to be when we have a little money and we don't have to know who it specificaly goes to, what do we care, we already have enough, just for the sake of giving."

Individual giving is good. Everyone should do that. But you should no more expect me to willingly give to support every cause of value to you, than you would willingly give to support causes of value to me. It's fine for you to encourage Ed to "give a little" by the power of your written words. Ed should not be compelled to "give a little" by the police power of the state.

-- Craig Carson (craigcar@crosswinds.net), September 17, 1999.

ac -- "So ED, we should all stop riding the bus or pick up smoking, what are you saying? Let's simplify. What makes less pollution. A bus with 50 passengers on it, or fifty cars with one person in each?"

Gee, lets think about this a little. What does make less polution, the 60's era Dodge Dart down the street that leaves a black smoke cloud (and happens to be exempt from emissions checks) behind it everywhere it goes or my two year old SUV that barely registered on my last emissions check. I pay almost $600 annually for license fees while the guy down the street probably pays less than $40. I worked hard to get to the point that I could buy that SUV. I didn't buy it for an investment or to be a yuppie, I bought it because I'm in the woods almost as much as I'm on the freeway and I wanted something that could handle both environments and still keep my family safe.

I agree that I-695 may go to far in some ways, but the politicians had their chance (actually many chances!) to correct the problem; now its our turn. We as a people can always vote to raise the taxes; that right is not being taken away.

Mike

-- Mike (smithm@pos-data.com), September 17, 1999.

Avocado man, quit holding your hand out and begging for our money. Maybe you have sttod in line waiting for your deserved welfare check and now you are rich and powerful.

Well you feel so strongly about helping your fellow man, so give him more of your money. Let him sleep in your home.

But quit demanding that everyone else do the things YOU want done with OUR money.

Maybe we don't like supporting your bus riding habits. Maybe we think you should buy an SUV and spend a lot of money on gas so you can help take care of the roads..

-- maddjak (maddjak@hotmail.com), September 18, 1999.

"But quit demanding that everyone else do the things YOU want done with OUR money. " I've seen a lot of this frustration / sentiment in pro 695 posts.

I agree there is a continuum and taxes are spent inneficiently and need to be tied more closely to the services that people use.

But there is plenty of good that YOU have derived from MY money... that is if you were immunized or didn't get sick because your neighbor was, or if your community was free of sewage and other real life burdens that it makes sense for us to get together and pay for as a community.

I believe subsidizing transportation for the poor pays me back by allowing them to get to they're low paying service jobs and schools, both of which profit everyone quite directly if you've ever enjoyed a clean floor or conversation with an educated person.

-- Billy Morton (leftodo@deja.com), September 18, 1999.

" I believe subsidizing transportation for the poor pays me back by allowing them to get to they're low paying service jobs and schools, both of which profit everyone quite directly if you've ever enjoyed a clean floor or conversation with an educated person.

" You are justifying subsidizing transit so you can EXPLOIT POOR PEOPLE!!!!

What a friggin humanitarian you are! Think you'll be canonized before Mother Theresa? In hope that you'll get professional counseling

The Craigster

-- (craigcar@crosswinds.net), September 19, 1999.

Dear ac

First one thing, I don't drive a Volvo. Never have, never will. And yes I typed this on MY computer, how do you think I posted it on the net? Smoke signals? Or maybe you were thinking that I was using the free computer at the library or one of the school.

You also stated "Give a little Ed. It does not need to be when we have a little money and we don't have to know who it specifically goes to, what do we care, we already have enough, just for the sake of giving." (corrected your spelling, sorry). Ac I do give and more then Gore gave. I just like to give to people and organizations that I choose to. Not ones picked for me by you or the government. People in my office come to me for charities, fund raisers and other such things because they knew I like to help people in trouble or kids.

Also where do you get off saying, "you have never had to stand in line for a hand out in your life". Pal you don't know me so I'll let you in on a secret. I was injured on the job as a police officer. That state in their infinite wisdom decided I could get by on $360 a month on disability (as I was making about $2300 a month, I can see their and your thinking, this guys rich we need to bring him down to the rest of the masses). Anyway, back to the story. I called the Crime Victims Assistance Dept in the state to see if I could get some help. When they found out I was a cop they told me I didn't qualify because it was my job to get beat up. Needless to say I got no help from them and never tried. Also called LEOFF to see what I was entitled to. They had no idea. So I guess this what I was paying for all these years, government apathy and ignorance.

On last thing "ac". Sorry I didn't post this sooner but I have been working to support the above mentioned incompetence and your idea of what society needs. Also I guess that black sooty cloud rolling out the tail pipes of buses is good for you.

Ed - using my multi-thousand dollar computer for what it was designed for, Solitaire.

-- Ed (ed_brigdes@yahoo.com), September 19, 1999.