Lets hope the military is on the streets when we need them.

greenspun.com : LUSENET : TimeBomb 2000 (Y2000) : One Thread

As a general rule, police are lousey at riot control. Police are trained to act immediately and independently to a given situation. Police are not trained day in and day out to act as a member of a team. Think about the few times you have seen policemen march in a parade. One time, we had to march and for an instant we all got in step. The crowd applauded. A good cop thinks he knows better than anyone else how to handle a situation.

Soldiers in disciplined formation on the other hand, with bayonetted rifles, tend to get the attention of even the most unruly of folks. You should be able to argue or reason with a cop but not with a soldier in formation or a german shepherd for that matter.

The latest from the Dod is that the civil authorities must not expect assistance just because they ask for it. I pray that is not the case. I have been through many riots in L.A. The cops are not going to risk their lives or careers to snipers, law suites and civil rights complaints just to keep someone from burning your store or your car. We looked forward to the presence of the National Guard just like the honest ghetto residents and shop keepers did. Just like there are no athiests in foxholes, there is no pride when trying to contain a riot. If the soldier boys don't come when your mayor calls for them, look out! The police cannot handle a full scale 'Uncontained" riot. I doubt that the soldier boys could.

Bill in South Carolina

-- Bill Solorzano (notaclue@webtv.net), September 04, 1999

Answers

Bill, this will no doubt enrage the doomer camp who foresee nothing but great calamity for next January, but I have come to believe that life within the US will probably go on unabated. No, I'm no polly, and I DO think a plethora of companies will be caught with their pants down, leading to their demise. In essence, I do think there will be problems, but not the sort which would lead to military action here....unless....

I am no fan of conspiracy theories and I am not a paranoid, but when I look up in the sky and see things I've never seen before, well, you can understand that the mind starts to wonder. During the past few months, I have seen numerous occasions when 3 military transport planes will fly low and in a straight line---in close succession---over different parts of Ohio. Today I saw the same thing in Pittsburgh and a couple of weeks ago I'd seen the same thing in Maryland.

Why?

Why didn't I ever notice it before? Simple answer.....because it never happened beofre.

Also, I really enjoy the incredible patterns of lines in the sky I see quite often here and in other parts of the country. These aren't the kind of 'skywriting' lines we saw years ago, but akin to jets dumping something into the atmosphere. Look and see X's and +'s all over the sky.

And sorry, it doesn't take a conspiratorialist to say that this has never happened before.

All the while, the Air Force claims it knows nothing.

Yeah, Bill, I hear you....and I just wonder if the military is to be considered a friend of the citizen should it all hit the fan.

Regards

-- Bad Company (johnny@shootingstar.com), September 04, 1999.


Bill, As a recent retiree of the US Army, I have to say that the military is sadly unprepared these day for the upcoming problems. Albeit with the Posse-Comitatus act preventing the infusion of Active duty troops into a civil-policing issue this has effectively tied the Hands of the DOD on helping out JQP in civil matters. The reality of the problem is also due to the broadening of the current crop of missions and tightening of the budget, we were hardly capable of performing the missions we were presented with. I was in the Army for ten years, and proudly served during the Gulf as an Airborne Infantryman. Jest a good ole' boy grunt. Back in those days we think of it as "The Golden Age", the bush-ray-gun era, the days when there was a budget, and safety and training were not skimped on. However, in light of Ole' Willy's cuts, and the improper use of us as the World's Cops, we, (rather they) are unable to even deploy here in the States if all hell broke loose. And the Gaurd...jeez...no offense intended to anyone out there, but my experience with the "Professional Citizen Soldiers" of this country has been far from satifactory. FACT: During the aftermath of Hurricane Andrew in FLA, several National Gaurd members, having been issued full combat equipment, (ie masks, weapons, sidearms et al) were refused ammunition as it would "create potential safety hazards." Several members, having foolishly disclosed this to the wrong people found themselves forceably relieved of those nice new weapons (select fire and other such nastieness) by said individuals with LOADED pistols. This was the same kind of mistake made in Beirut in 83 that killed 250+/- American Marines. Whatever makes you think that these guys are ever going to be out there...much less the lack of faith I have in the Gaurd, as the quality of troops these days is unfortunately appauling. I figure if the Gaurd gets deployed, and they send out the word, and the S**T really hits the fan, count on, roughly 20-35% DESERTION. Sure...Troops LOOK good, but man...will they be ALLOWED to train/perpare/and be ready to play when the time comes? Effectiveness is measured in performance...not image or attitude. (FYI I was medically retired after a bad jump)

-- Billy-Boy (Rakkasn@Yahoo.com), September 04, 1999.

Hey Bad, better watch it, somebody might send ya a roll of tinfoil like mine! :)

-- FLAME AWAY (BLehman202@aol.com), September 04, 1999.

All good reasons to live out of populated areas....with protection of course.

-- Charles R. (chuck_roast@trans.net), September 05, 1999.

I agree with Billy-Boy and his analysis.

Bill, just one comment from someone who doesn't agree with you. I do appreciate your concerns about riots and lawlessness in the streets. The problem is that there is no difference in moral character between the "bad guys" rioting and the "good guys" in uniform. What makes you think the uniformed guys won't be doing what looters will be doing when the S*** hits the Fan bigtime? I mean if Y2k is TEOTWAWKI, why will they behave? No followup actions on them, no paychecks in the future, no "glory." I'm not saying that there aren't ethical military men. I'm saying there aren't enough.

In the end, I'd rather see property owners taking their defense into their own hands. It's called personal responsibility. I believe that if the military takes control of the situation, in a few months you will have a civil war on your hands, which, on top of Y2k is the last thing we need. To put the military on the streets will make things much, much worse.

-- Jim the Window Washer (Rational@man.com), September 05, 1999.



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