Subject:	Getting jobs. Fair rates. Was: Mutual funds: Nervous markets and investor psychology
Date:	1999/09/02
Author:	cory hamasaki <kiyoinc@ibm.XOUT.net>
	Posting History

On Wed, 1 Sep 1999 23:49:37, Frank Ney <croaker@barkingmad.org> wrote:   > My client is desperately interviewing and not finding much.  I'm about the > last good person they've brought on (and I'm kicking myself for charging so > little -- $60/hr + $141 per diem). > > And I just found out this afternoon that the guy who hired me at the client > site is retiring, effective today.  Sigh. > > > Frank Ney  N4ZHG  WV/EMT-B  LPWV  NRA(L) ProvNRA GOA CCRKBA JPFO   Well, this is my kind of thread.   Some of you c.s.y2k'ers may not follow Ed Yourdon's TB2K forum.  There's an "Anita Spooner" there who maintains that she and her pals are all cheap and available, er, affordable programming talent.   She's lobbed a few photon torpedos my way (not as many as our polly-pal, -bks-).  Her point seems to be that since she can't "Get a Job", therefore there is no programmer shortage proving that Y2K is solved.   Sound reasoning, I suppose.   However, here we have Frank, COBOL-head, Farm-boy, and contract programmer who is billing (2000*60 = 120,000, 141*20*12 = 31,840) I make it about a hundred fifty grand a year.  (Why the roach motel?  You should be able to lease a condo for a couple grand a month, it's in the rates. I'm thinking LA, Bevery Hills 90210, scantily clad models.)   Is LA that much more expensive than Waikiki?  Hotels in Waikiki run $120/day but you can rent a condo for a month for about $1,000 plus utilities. That's $35/day for a one bedroom unit, Diamond head view, reserved parking space, pool, in a secured building.   Frank's boss is bailing with 4 months to run on the clock, that's another opening to add to those that Frank says are there.  The rates are not top dollar but certainly good money.  I think any time the total goes above one hundred grand a year, you're doing fine.   I hear daily pleas for more programmers in DC, granted some of the REQs are very specific but I've never seen the demand like we're experiencing.   Another disconnect in the Y2K world.   Perhaps it's just evidence that the system is getting chaotic.   cory hamasaki http://www.kiyoinc.com/current.html 

-- a (a@a.a), September 02, 1999

Answers

With the little time left, it would be difficult to bring a programmer up to speed and have them perform a meaningful contribution! Even more so if the remaining work were system integration testing. The only hope would be if the programmer already had specific experience on the system (such as SAP payroll), which would directly translate to the job at hand. For custom systems...forget it.

This is definitely the end game.

-- Mad Monk (madmonk@hawaiian.net), September 02, 1999.

And in some countries they're just now scrambling to hire.

-- Chris (%$^&^@pond.com), September 02, 1999.

I have 33 yrs total mainframe PA experience, 22 as an independent consultant, and have been out for 14 weeks (I am good and ALWAYS sober). Few contracts available, freezes and layoffs everywhere, lowering rates. Welcome to the recession, someone had to start it off.

-- curtis schalek (cschalek@earthlink.net), September 03, 1999.

That's the problem with consulting, it ain't steady work! Been here 14 years, minus 2 years a while ago, when I went back to work at my other job, but that's a long story. Busy as he.., heck, here, and expect to be that way for quite a while! Well into the next year, I hope...

Tick.. Tock... <:00=

-- Sysman (y2kboard@yahoo.com), September 03, 1999.

Chicago, isn't it, Curtis?

My thanks to the person who E-mailed me about this thread. Geez...Cory...you could at least give my location...DFW area of Texas, y'all. I'm the one who can't relocate because of her mother in a type-B facility nearby, although I know others who are quite willing to take out-of-state contracts. Telecommuting is ALWAYS an option. I, personally, do a lot of that even on contracts locally.

EDS recently offered early retirement to 6000 50-year olds, so Houston and maybe even Plano should have plenty of workers also. Then there's Sabre with their layoffs in Fort Worth.

Seems to me that Texas should be advertised as the programmer capital or something, eh? Send those want-ads to the Dallas Morning News and the Fort Worth Star Telegram! We've got the workers if YOU'VE got the work!

-- Anita (spoonera@msn.com), September 03, 1999.

Anita-- oil is going back up soon maybe you could become a rigger? Ha!Ha! just kidding. seems like things always go bad in Texas first. Oil, S&L crisis, recessions...

Maybe all you programmers shouldn't be so good at your jobs and stretch them out a little.

-- Johnny (JLJTM@BELLSOUTH.NET), September 03, 1999.

After Jan 1, the demand for programmers will suddenly increase due to hiring from management pollys who deny to the end in addition hiring for RE-REmediation. However due to the economic depression, no one will be able to pay programmers their "usual" fees.

Scary thought, but the government will intermediate by either severely capping wages or drafting programmers (or both!)

-- Serio (survival@y2k.com), September 03, 1999.

They may draft you, but they can't make you do the work. And, if they drafted me, I would be the slowest programmer around. I'm surprised we aren't hearing of sabatoge from workers who know they are about to be laid off.

-- ~~~~ (~~~~@~~~.com), September 03, 1999.

Hey, you can draft me! You take care of my family and I'll work for peanuts. Of course, if you disconnect me from my family, and don't look after them, I'm gonna have an awfully hard time concentrating on whatever it is you want fixed. But if my family's living onbase, with PX privileges and all, that's not a terrible deal.

Whatcha want, a 401k and vacations while the world burns? Come on, people, get real.

-- bw (home@puget.sound), September 03, 1999.

There's the carrot and the stick. However, all the carrots will be given to the obedient [slave] drivers as incentives for their toil. There will be no such shortage of reusable "sticks."

-- Serio (survival@y2k.com), September 03, 1999.