Final chapter -- why not do this stuff anyway?

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One of the interesting things about Y2K is that it has raised our awareness about some of the shortcomings and risks of our existing culture. Which raises the obvious question: even if Y2K turns out to be a mere 1,2, or 3 on the scale, why not try to make some improvements anyway?

Is this realistic? Practical? Desirable? Crazy? What do you th

-- Ed Yourdon (HumptyDumptyY2K@yourdon.com), August 05, 1999

Answers

This whole Y2K thing has been a massive wake up call for me. I have always kind of dreamed about living self sufiicently, but had been in the typical American rut of borrow today and work like hell to pay it off so could borrow some more. Last year I had a major change of direction in my life, one of small scale farming selling my products in the community in which I live. I am now thinking of trying to get off the gird, mainly to have more control over my life. I do not like being dependant on some many other people and things as I have become. We never know when something may happen which will take down the grid. Lost of income will cause the plug to be unpluged from the grid, that is just one example. Even if Y2K is only a bump in the road, it has changed my life for the better.

-- chicken farmer (bwana@inna.net), August 05, 1999.

I'm with chicken farmer for my personal perspective. But, a huge wakeup on how we view technology. We love its rewards but have clearly ignored how simple things therein can have unbeliveably huge consequences. I'll bet we're smarter for this mess.

-- Carlos (riffraff1@cybertime.net), August 05, 1999.

For many years I had always admired much of the lifestyle of the Amish even though my life was the exact opposite.

I've even had many thoughts of living that kind of life and wondering what it would be like

I may very well find out in about 148 days.

Joe Stout

-- Joe Stout (joewstout@iswt.com), August 06, 1999.


Three cheers for the chicken farmer. It shows that with the right amount of motivation and determination we could all make a satisfying move toward releasing ourselves from the technological jungle we have cultivated. As far as it being practical or desirable (i really do not believe it is crazy in the least) I think that society as a whole would love to simplify their lives. I just don't think that they remember how to. Perhaps some easy suggestions to start with. Be very careful about using the word "improvements". You may end up with even more technology being tossed your way as a form of answer.

-- Cheryl A. Bairagdar (Ladyfez@aol.com), August 06, 1999.

It seems to me that common sense has been what has been missing in all of the equations....Getting back to what is really needed for basic survival...Roof over head, food in belly, love in heart...golden rule, the ten commandments remembering where all of the good in life really comes from perhaps this will be the legacy of y2k...relearning skills that were never meant to disappear...being self-sufficient yet eager to help the less fortunate-not with a hand out but with a hand. Learning new skills, using the grey matter and never assuming anything.

-- Tina Powers (breadlady@huntel.net), August 06, 1999.


What is being suggested is akin to being prepared for Y2K...which are preparations that we should have taken anyway! Certainly, a more robust infrastructure, with alternatives, is desirable.

-- Mad Monk (madmonk@hawaiian.net), August 06, 1999.

Another cheer for the wake up call! If Y2K is .5 on the scale, I intend to never return to living "unprepared" and dependent on this week's trip to the grocery store. It has caused a sifting in our hearts, priorities and lifestyles, and even the pain of relocating and leaving loved ones notwithstanding, has brought positive changes to my family. A non-thinking lifestyle, expecting your hand to be filled when you extend it, and your brain to be tickled and lulled when punching a remote button, surely spells disaster to the health and survival of a nation.

-- Mumsie (Shezdremn@aol.com), August 06, 1999.

Funny, I read the question entirely differently, which could be fatigue, as I get a bit darker as I get more tired. I interpreted the question to mean why not preposition certain resources, ANYWAY, whether we "agree" on whatever scenario. Why not identify what resources will be needed, regardless of level of ccrunch, identify either sources, or existing stocks of whatever resources will be needed, and skeletize a recovery plan, regardless of scenario. Kind of like a loose, not geographically close group deciding that X will have the plywood and lumber, Y will have the drywall screws, and Z will have a bulk quantity of food, E will have a quantity of fuel , etc., for the worst case scenario gathering location.

If that isn't clear, I'll try to clarify it on Monday. It is MERCIFULLY time to get Mrs Driver up and to switch places in the driveway and bed.

Chuck

-- Chuck, a night driver (rienzoo@en.com), August 06, 1999.


Hello, Ed. This project is a great idea. Here are some psuedo-random pre-coffee thoughts before I return to beating my skull against this @$^%*^!# database:

This chapter could point to the real value of neighborhood organizing precipitated by Y2K. The worst that could happen is we get better communities.

If nothing else, I hope Y2K teaches a large part of the electorate the old Robert Heinlein acronym:

TANSTAAFL There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.

(digression)

Speaking of Heinlein, like him, I'm not sure the idea of Universal Suffrage (one person one vote) is so great. Certainly our founding Fathers never did. Elitist? Hmmm. Mebbe. But the only people who voted then were those who were educated, informed about the issues, and felt an obligation to care for the country. I honestly don't see the problem with that. One of the neatest points in Heinlein's Starship Troopers (forget the movie), was the idea that you could vote only after spending 2 years in government service (not neccessarily military) or you could buy the right to vote for a heck of alot of money. Either way, the result was an electorate invested in the future of the country. (Another suggestion of his I found a bit extreme: You enter a voting booth, close the curtain, and a quadratic equation appears on a screen. Solve it, and you vote. Fail, and the curtain opens to reveal an empty booth...

(/digression)

We are each responsible for our own well being, our own families, and the integrity of our society.

Governments tend to encourage a paternalistic/passive-ist populace view because it reinforces their power. (This is not a conspiracy- it's just a feedback loop)

The country is too big and complex for all of us to Return To The Land and raise our own food. Get over it.

Democratic Capitalism and Communism both depend ultimately on the integrity of the individual and how much he cares for others. Democratic Capitalism just has wider tolerances. How wide? We'll see.

Education determines the quality our future. Give a man a fish, and tomorrow he wants another fish.

One person can have a powerful impact. (Thanks, Ed.)

-- Lewis (aslanshow@yahoo.com), August 06, 1999.


Ed,

Did you realize the American Public had been thirsting for a means in which they could empower themselves? This self reliance and personal sense of self gratification at having become the sole reason for one's successful existence is one that has only just begun to permeate the fabric of society.

Didn't you hear it when the Masacre at Columbine happened? How could those children have lost hope? How could anyone become so morally deficient? WHY WHY WHY?

People KNOW they are dependent on something or someone! If it isn't electricity it's Money, Food, water. You get the point. Now we are these drones in society that function to prop up an elusive economy and we have no tangible self realization other than the Playstation or new sweater we bought last week.

Ed, The simple fact that 80-100 Years ago people were so much more self reliant provided them with a sense of self importance and gratification and even purpose. That has all but dissapeared from mainstream society.

I think that the people who will prepare for what history has taught us to respect and expect will be the ones rewarded.

You may have to write more than one book. I dont' think you can possibly fit it into just One book let alone a chapter.

Father

-- Thomas G. Hale (hale.tg@att.net), August 06, 1999.



Ed, you said "One of the interesting things about Y2K is that it has raised our awareness about some of the shortcomings and risks of our existing culture."

Unfortunately, I think that this "raised awareness" may be true of only one-in-1000, or perhaps even fewer, of the general population. Given that cynical perception, I doubt very much that the "great unwashed" will ever find the leadership or the incentive to "make some improvements". While scholars, academics, historians, and politicians may discuss this concept ad nauseum, I seriously doubt that anything meaningful will ever come of it, at least in our lifetimes.

Geez...I need to get out in the woods with my dogs for awhile!

-- Norm Harrold (nharrold@tymewyse.com), August 06, 1999.


While most of the population is neither GI now nor preparing (they say only 1 in 5 is doing so), after a crisis those who have come out the other side might be hoped to have developed a whole new outlook. The sort of crisis we may very soon be facing is one so great that it could cause a paradigm shift in people's awareness and perspective, and their willingness to explore developing a sounder society. I hope and pray for this positive outcome amidst the bleaker prospects.

Since you, Ed, should have the technical knowledge of how we could simplify the technology, build safeguards into it, and so forth, your input and that of others in your field would be particularly helpful.

We can't all go back to the earth, but the world will surely need many other talents and crafts than the farming and ranching specialties, i.e., the same ones our forefathers traded for their food and meat.

I for one have learned the precariousness of our fragile infrastructure, and have learned much in recent months about self-sufficiency. Never again, under any circumstances, do I intend to be without those supplies which the imminence of Y2K has taught me to own and use.

Ed, may I thank you personally for your help in doing all of this? When I was first aware that I'd better learn how to prepare for Y2K, I sought help from my bookstores. There I found your book on "how to" and it was my beginning. It introduced me to the website and others you listed, where I have had a solid education. I have tried to share this knowledge. You may have people now who insult you as being an alarmist or worse, but remember the words of the greatest teacher of all times, "A prophet is without honor in his own country," and may I add, "and in his own time?" Your day of vindication isn't far off.

Do write this new book...and God bless you!

-- Elaine Seavey (Gods1sheep@aol.com), August 06, 1999.


Y2K has honed priorities for all GI's and might do the same post roll- over for a three or four. Anti-biotics vs cheap goods etc...

-- (y2kfallback@yahoo.com), August 06, 1999.

The coment above about a new paradigm is interesting, and probably a bit optimistic. I suspect that there will be SEVERAL new paradigms struggling for primacy. One of which will be the responsibility, caring paradigm, another of which will be the "YOU %%%$##@@ERS, WHY DID YOU LET US DOWN?!?!?!?!" paradigm. Another of which will be the "We can't POSSIBLY make anything that means anything ourselves. the government HAS to take care of it, and I'm going to wait for them." [whine off]

Somewhere in there, similar to the second, is the Neo-Luddite possibility, which is one of my recurring daymares. VERY similar to the responses alluded to in Brin's "Postman".

There will need to be a leadership group that helps the populace select the paradigm. Hopefully that leadership group is NOW thinking out how to lead.

Chuck

-- Chuck, a night driver (rienzoo@en.com), August 10, 1999.


Ed,

Why not do this stuff anyway??? Exactly.

There are a couple of things I would specifically like to see changed in the coming years.

The first is the use of Fosil Fuels. It would be great if we could finally change the status quo over to natural gases made from grains. No more drilling, no more oil spills, no more contaminated oceans, etc.

The second is the use of nuclear power or coal to generate electricity. I truly believe we need to switch to solar and wind power. Technology is almost at the point where these options can be feasible alternatives no matter what the location is. Of course, right now since solar power is so expensive, the only places that can work on this technology are universities with federal grants. It has not made the mainstream business yet.

There are of course many other areas for improvement in our society. As I come up with a few more, I'll check back.

DJ

-- DJ (reality@check.com), August 10, 1999.



Ed,

Thanks for the new meeting place- hope the new book comes out (and that it's influential but NOT necessary!)

Back in the '70s there was a so-called survivalist movement in response to a number of factors similar in some ways to what's happening now. Such authors as Howard Ruff were well known in some circles at that time. On a parallel course (though starting a bit earlier perhaps), prompted by the same factors and sharing some of the same attitudes came a "back to the land" movement as well. A new generation of homesteaders headed off out back of beyond to learn old skills and seek simpler ways of living. Carla Emery became famous in her own way then, and the _Foxfire Books_ saw daylight for the first time.

How different are things now? A lot in some ways, not so much in others. One cornerstone was and is that people-at least some people- are examining or re-examining lifestyles, goals, the society and their role in it. And they're making new choices, going off in-for them- new directions.

Point is, people ARE 'doing this stuff now.' You included, I might add. Whatever the reasons and whatever the decisions, a lot of people are doing things differently. And it's likely to last for a long time, for some of them the rest of their lives, regardless of what rollover brings.

-- Lee (lplapin@hotmail.com), August 12, 1999.


I think the power (fossil fuel) issue will follow closely on the heals of the y2k crisis, calling upon similar coping mechanisms and solutions.

Money, sex, prowess in sports, formal education are "powers" currently prized as affording a competitive advantage in achieving the desireable position of dominance and control over others. The more "power" you have, the more successful you are as a "man."

Perhaps this definition needs to change to enable some of those lifestyles and activities that we have been given the opportunity to value (anew) through the eyes of y2k.

Under the challenges of y2k, an energy crisis, natural disaster, etc. will the grand poo ba find himself sitting atop a pile of worthless electronic treasure, counting his worthless stock certificates? Will the practical teacher arise to assume the seat of admiration?

Perhaps we will begin to value craft and stewardship and turn from the rabid consumerism that fuels a fragile economy with hysteria. We will take joy in the self actualization of spirit involved in the act of "craft" and the responsibility of stewardship. We will prize the quality of the commodity or service produced rather than the efficiency of process or the number of widgets produced in a day. We will again value calouses and dirt stains on our hands.

Regardless, it is my opinion that you will know that there has been a true paradigm shift when the definition of a "successful man" has changed.

-- marsh (armstrng@sisqtel.net), August 13, 1999.


From: Y2K, ` la Carte by Dancr near Monterey, California

Fail, and the curtain opens to reveal an empty booth...

Hahahaha! That...is...sick! Instead of a math quiz, why not a "did you get it" quiz. :> Multiple choice questions. e.g. When you heard that the Navy had characterized your city as a likely total sewer failure, did you...

a) buy a composting toilet?

b) buy a camping potty?

c) get some lumber to make a neighborhood latrine?

d) flip the TV channel?

-- Dancr (addy.available@my.webpage), September 06, 1999.


Yes, Ed,....realistic, practical and necessary,... learning it anyway. When my sister and I talk about surviving and thriving into the new place so-called civilization is going, we talk about our confidence in our success because we know how to do things. We can cook, grow food, preserve it; do first aid; build and repair things with our hands; create and plan; and perhaps more important we have superior problem-solving skills. Now we are of an age, mind you,...(late 40-somethings)...and never quite abandonned the very un-PC notions that self-sufficiency was critical, and conspicuous consumption was the road to perdition. Use wisely, use it up, repair it, etc. I'm ever-thankful for all my folks taught me about self-sufficiency.

--In my sheet,... surfing the waves of our paradigm shifts

-- Donna (moment@pacbell.net), September 06, 1999.


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