Geez. I just have to vent. Showed new business insurance statement to co-worker. Statement had the y2k disclaimer -- you know, won't cover any losses due to y2k. Co-worker said he figured that after 1/1/2000, people would realize that y2k had all been a bunch of hot air. This from the same guy who just bought a house, is trying to get his wife pregnant, wants to invest in the stock market, and thinks I talk about y2k too much (I've only mentioned it 3 times in the last 7 months and then only saying we needed to upgrade some equipment). What an idiot! Oh yeah. Context: electronic publishing firm which processes a lot of information which comes from the feds. from Libby who is frustrated with the DWGI!

-- Libby Alexander (libbyalex@aol.com), August 03, 1999

Answers

How dare you try to push your cultish thoughts on normal people who want to buy houses, start families and invest in our country?

After, for all you know, y2k IS a bunch of hot air. Why don't you just shut the hell up and let everyone else live their lives while you run off into your fortified bunker caves and wait for the sky to fall.

-- DWGI- Doomers Woefully and Generally Incompetant (Annoyed@"DWGI".com), August 03, 1999.

DWGI is right. Who are you to try to help your company and coworkers survive the roll-over? You, me, the CIA and the Inst. of Electrical Engineers - we are all a bunch of "cultists" just out to spoil the party.

My sympathies Libby. Good luck in Oblivia.

-- R (riversoma@aol.com), August 03, 1999.

Because so many "don't bother me" Persuiters of the American Lie brush off Y2K, those who understand the possibilities will be safer and better off in fortified bunker caves. Time Will Tell soon now. Libby, be sure to line your hardened sanctuary with Dilbert cartoons ;^)

-- Ashton & Leska in Cascadia (allaha@earthlink.net), August 03, 1999.

Hmm. I think we need less of the ignorants who need to cuss at actual events. No gloomer here. Just the facts Jack.. Libby your input was welcomed. I too have seen some obvious changes. Thanks for sharing. Isn't that what this forum is about.. Information is a vital element in or society,we all have opinions,some are rash thoughts, others highly researched. Some people wanted to be informed, others do not. I personally thought this site was for those that want to be informed.

-- Cassandra (american_storm@usa.net), August 03, 1999.

Annoyed justs makes me feel good knowing I am not like that.

Libby, I can relate to you. I have some very DGI male co-workers and I like to bring up y2k just to see the how far their eyes CAN roll back. I really don't care if they are preparing or not. I use to care, but I gave that wasted emotion up.

-- Carol (glear@usa.net), August 03, 1999.

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Carol: Do you like to mudwrestle?

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.com), August 03, 1999.

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If Y2K can do it, I would throw the switch in a New York second.

-- Paul Milne (fedinfo@halifax.com), August 01, 1999.

Well, I for one would love it if the lights went out in my neighborhood at midnight. I have tried to warn friends and co workers and have become the laffing stock of the office. I would just LOVE to see the lights go off, just long enuff to make them really sweat, but not enuff to hurt anyone. Wonder how long that would be in time before they started lining up at my pump for water?

-- Hannah (Hannah@Colonial America.com), August 02, 1999.

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I'd like to see complete failure of the grid and phones for 48 hours. Long enough for people to understand how fragile their existence is, but short enough for nobody to die. Hospitals have fuel for that long, so sick folks could be cared for. JUST long enough..... Preparation ofor unforseen events is a GOOD thing. We should ALL do it, ALL the time. Someday we may REALLY NEED IT.... (5 months from now? Hmmmm. We'll sure find out, won't we?)

-- Dennis (djolson@pressenter.com), August 02, 1999.

Everyone over there has an agenda to see Y2K be big, bad , and scary because they have all invested in the idea and emotionalism since they first heard about it. To back down now would to be admitting defeat.

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Carol, I'll just assume your one of these idiots who will be "anxiously awaiting the big surprise".

-- DWGI= Doomers Woefully and Generaly Incompetant (Annoyed@DWGI.com), August 03, 1999.

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KIng of Spain

No sire, but I make a mean mud pie.

-- Carol (glear@usa.net), August 03, 1999.

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Annoyed:

That is why I am preparing, so I won't be surprised. Any more questions?

-- Carol (glear@usa.net), August 03, 1999.

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Libby, you're spoiling his fun with all your doom talk.

Here they are, eating a ten-course gourmet meal in the Titanic's main dining room, & you keep talking about how they're going too fast through a field of iceburgs, & how there aren't enough life boats...

What a spoil sport. I say let them enjoy their last meal. There's a kind of natural selection process going on. Just make sure that YOU get your place in that life boat...

-- what (a@great.analogy), August 03, 1999.

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Isn't it marvelous how individuals like Dennis and Hannah actually wish for some sort of failure of limited duration to push their points across. Wow, great thinking, you two. Maybe it'll justify the over-the-top preparations you've done, eh?

Look, the point is, I think doing nothing is quite simply ridiculous. And I don't think one can do too much in this day and age. If it's not y2k, then surely, the weather comes into play.

But wishing for problems? Unbelievable.

-- Bad Company (johnny@shootingstar.com), August 03, 1999.

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This may turn out to be good practice for us all - we may be faced with continous frustrations and the dilemna, do we try again, or move on at the risk of seeing some suffer. After later times, we will have to make hard choices and still have some element of internal peace. Every one is different, there is no formula that says what will be convincing, and when it is time to move on.

All you can do is your best evaluation, then practice reducing the internal stress so you can be clear thinking for those that agree.

-- Living in (the@real.world), August 03, 1999.

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No Carol, no more questions , it would be a waste of time.

Orderly! More thorazine over here, this one is getting unstable again!

-- (DWGI@because.It's INSANE!!!), August 03, 1999.

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Center OFF fer chrissakes!

-- (DWGI@this dumb.html), August 03, 1999.

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Center off?

-- (HTML@tragedy.com), August 03, 1999.

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how now brown cow?

-- formatpolice (formatpolice@format.com), August 03, 1999.

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Try this.

-- Wingman (-@-.-), August 03, 1999.

Was it just me, or did anyone else think that the formatting glitch caused the thread to seem like it was actually spiralling down a drain? Most strange...

-- Mac (sneak@lurk.hid), August 03, 1999.

Bad company said:

Isn't it marvelous how individuals like Dennis and Hannah actually wish for some sort of failure of limited duration to push their points across.

No, I wish it to WAKE PEOPLE UP to the fragility of supply-systems, and how slowly "emergency response" organizations often respond. A well stocked larder USED TO BE a very important part of American life. Now, anyone that promotes that lifestyle is automatically labelled a "survivalist wacko nutcase". And THAT is my "point".

...and...

Wow, great thinking, you two. Maybe it'll justify the over-the-top preparations you've done, eh?

Ask victims of hurricane Andrew what "over the top" preparations might be...? Or victims of the Montreal ice storm. Yup. "Over the top" is in the eye of the preparer. For me, it's MY EYE, not YOURS.

I have the means, opportunity and motive to prepare as I see fit; who are YOU to second guess me (or anyone ELSE, for that matter!) You do what YOU want; I'll do what *I* want, and we'll let the chips fall where they may. I'm REAL happy with that action. How about you?

A "small event" is MUCH better than a large one. I think we can ALL agree on that one, right?

-- Dennis (djolson@pressenter.com), August 03, 1999.

Hey there. Thanks all for your input. I'm feeling much better now. My co-worker is representative of a lot of folks right now who are deep in denial. I just keep my mouth shut about my preps and just hope they don't manage to conceive a kid until things calm down a bit. Whenever that is...

For now, I'm off to clip some Dilbert cartoons!

-- Libby Alexander (libbyalex@aol.com), August 03, 1999.

Dear Libby,

I know what you mean. Over a year ago I bought and gave away several copies of Mr. Yourdon's book, Time Bomb 2000, to several people I care about. Only one read it -- and "got it". I find it interesting that when people who know I'm a Programmer Analyst see something on TV about Y2K, they ask me what I think -- then just ignore whatever I say if it doesn't agree with what they think (which is usually just some wishfull thinking that their lives not be "bothered" at all).

I used to try and educate people. Even thought about doing some type of "casandra project" in the St. Louis area. But figured it would just get bogged down by the DWGI's arguing why nothing was going to happen to "disrupt" their lifestyle or stock market gains. Plus, figuring how lots of people think these days, I would most likely get "blamed" in some/many ways by all kinds of dumb clucks. I figured who needs to go thru some Y2K version of the Salem witch trials? Not me!

Over the last several months, I've noticed my general attitude changing. It still is "do my professional duty" during whatever Y2K brings. But as for wasting my breath -- and TIME -- trying to help others -- and just "reading them" that they don't want to think about it, much less get it", my attitude has "evolved" thusly:

Step 1) "Live and let live"

Step 2) "Live and let die"

Step 3) "Whatever"

Now, I'm tired of always helping so many other adults over the last few years anyway. Started to "prune" my social circle. Figure doing so now will cause thoughts of me and what I might have for them to "beg, borrow or steal" after Y2K to diminish as much as possible. But I KNOW they will remember anyway. Really tired of several aspects of how most people are. Getting much more selective.

Getting much more perfunctionary and "professional" -- read superficial/uninvolved/indifferent to others 'cause I know that if TSHTF, they would "turn and tear me to pieces" like the swine in that Biblical parable (Don't throw your pearls before swine, for they will trample them underfoot, turn, and tear you to pieces). I DON'T think this is a wrong attitude. I'm one person with one income. How much can I do for how many? I figure two things I can do. First, not be part of the problem! Second, go to work so as to minimize whatever problems I can with the computer system I have production responsibility for.

Am I my brother's keeper? Right now I've been feeling more and more like an only child. Just don't want to get beat up on the "playground" next year by a bunch of bullies!

My thoughts on preping are as follows:

What's the downside? Pay off all debt. This would reduce my monthly expenses by about $400 a month. Good!

Give up time "preparing" and changing my buying/consumer habits? About damn time! I had eaten EVERY meal out for over two years before I decided I had better change my ways. I'm single, have a good income, and don't like to do dishes. I figure eating at home -- and more healthy -- will be better for both my health and my bank balance.

What about all that "stuff" I'm wasting my money on? I don't think I'm wasting my money. First, if Y2K isn't, I'll just use most of it next year; in essence, I've pre-purchased, that's all. Second, some of it is stuff I've thought about getting for awhile anyway. Hey, I could stand to go camping some weekends over the next few years!

Moreover, I live in an earthquake zone. The New Madrid fault is overdue to "belch". Having some preps is a good idea at all times, let alone during the next several months. I figure my biggest possible wasted expenses are storage locker rent and ammunition.

Plus, for a while, I've wanted to take the time to get into nutrition and more nutritious eating. How better than to learn about one's food choices in a Y2K rice & beans scenario. I'll probably not go the home cooking route. Probably rely on canned, prepackaged stuff I don't need to cook. Stuff I can eat "on the go". Peanuts and pears and peaches? Remember, I'm a 36 year old batchelor...been asked a few times, but always said "no thank you"...so far.

Look at this as a "growth opportunity", an opportunity to "unencumber yourself" from old ways of thinking, feeling and relating...so you can "soar like an eagle" instead of "flock with turkeys"!

Sqwaaaaak!! (not gobble, gobble!!),

Hey, my point is that I don't think indifference is all bad....

Best wishes,

-- Louis (StLouisLouis@Yahoo.com), August 03, 1999.

As is so often the case with closed minds, you are missing the point here, Dennis. Since you feel so obliged as to delve into innuendo and accusation and entirely miss the point, let's reduce it to a primary level even you can understand:

who are YOU to wish disaster on mankind simply to justify your mindset?

Unless I read your original post wrong...and Hannah's, for that matter...I got the distinct impression that you childishly stated that you wanted something of short duration to transpire to have the joy of thumbing your nose at all your brother man.

How neaderthal.

Here's hoping that for your sake, you are never in need of some stranger who doesn't necessarily share your philosophies.Here's hoping THAT stranger will overlook your prepubescent, mental masturbatory babblings.

Get a clue, jackass.

-- Bad Company (johnny@shootingstar.com), August 03, 1999.

Bad Company:

Truth hurts those who don't want to see it -- the population has exceeded the stable carrying capacity. Stupidity has been rewarded and is endemic.

"To protect fools from the effects of their folly is to fill the world with fools" [Herbert Spencer]

The herd is long overdue for a thinning. Evolution in action.

Libby's co-worker, however "intelligent" in what's needed in the corporate world, is the type that should be thinned first. Along with the wife (for choosing to mate with someone of that type). And any spawn (so as not to pass their genes along).

Here's to evolution in action. BTW, if it makes you feel better, I'm not in the top 10 percentile for survival. So we'll go down together. Yabba-dabba-doo!

-- A (A@AisA.com), August 04, 1999.

A, where do you people come from? What an incredibly stupid line of posts. I say this with all due severity: I come from a family that has spent years in the government and also fought the first two world wars. With that in mind, it is no understatement to say that you and your ilk would be the first out of the bunker to try and save his own ass, and the first to get a bullet in the back as he ran away from the battle.

'Thin the herd', indeed. You bring new meaning to the word 'coward'.

-- Bad Company (johnny@shootingstar.com), August 04, 1999.

Bad Company:

It may be hard to believe, given the tone of my posts, but I was once an "officer and gentleman" in the service of the U.S. government, and served active duty.

That was when I was young and stupid. Knowing what I know now, and had it to do over, I'd either be in jail as a draft resister or in Canada or somewhere.

Jerkoff blind patriots like you are one reason this country has gone down the tubes. Congenitally stupid, willfully ignorant, and smugly righteous. I wouldn't walk across the street to save your sorry ass.

If need be, I'd take you on in a firefight any day. This country was once head and shoulders above any other. No more, and in many respects worse. Yes, we still have relative prosperity, but "man does not live by bread alone."

-- A (A@AisA.com), August 04, 1999.