I'm not a Troll -- just wondering....

If there are a lot of deaths due to Y2K, how should one react to maximize their chances of survival?

I've heard that you want to stay away from any such nightmare, but what if you have no choice? You found a dead body on your property, and the coroner is waaaay too backed up to drive by and pick 'em up for 'ya -- your on your own, unfortunately. Or you HAD to shoot some looters -- whatever. What are the concerns and issues here for the living? Rubber gloves and quick Lime? How much? A bonfire? What?

Y2K humor: Hey, there will be plenty of food come Y2K -- it will just be walking around on two legs is all...

Seriously, in a "grave" situation, with you and the wife and kids starving, fido already a "vet" of your stew pot, what do you do with the looter you just shot? Dress 'em out and salt 'em down? What?

Unfortunately, this is just HALF in jest...I figure best to think about this stuff before the hunger pangs set in...

If TSHTF, the above will be serious questions. What do you think?

-- Wondering (Anon@This.time), July 28, 1999

Answers

Just bury 'em...

-- (dot@dot.dot), July 28, 1999.

Oh bury me not

On the lone prairie

Where scavengers dig

And the stew is free.

-- Randolph (dinosaur@williams-net.com), July 28, 1999.

If you need the food, eat them. If not, bury them or dump them somewhere far from you (like down a cliff).

Either way, just make sure you don't end up like them.

-- (its@coming.soon), July 28, 1999.

Looks like we've sunk to even lower depths.

I thought "poly vs. doomer" or "shoot thy neighbor" was low enough.

Many of the people on this board have a crisis of faith, regardless of Y2K. Get prepared, but don't live it!

Did anyone here even read Ed Yourdons Time Bomb 2000 book?

He layed out several scanarios, from mild to a depression. 1-10 scale.. Are you trying to invent an 11 or a 12?

What do you think you would do with someone that was dying in your yard? Would you:

A. Try to help them. B. Try to get them to help and even risk yourself to do it. C. Let them die, and eat them..

Nearly all people that I associate with are A or B. People on THIS strange board seem to be at C and they are working on a 'D'.

Thoroughly disgusting.

-- Bryce (bryce@seanet.com), July 28, 1999.

Wondering

You don't want to contemplate the thought of canabalism. Just try to avoid it. A hard core subject that even the toughest bush folk will rarely talk about. It has happened in North America.

Regarding the other issues, what is the link for the thread posted awhile back that covered the more grizzly aspects of worst case Y2K?

I have looked for the thread "Not for the squemish" or something like that. Anyone have it bookmarked?

-- Brian (imager@home.com), July 28, 1999.

What do you think you would do with someone that was dying in your yard? Would you:

A. Try to help them. B. Try to get them to help and even risk yourself to do it. C. Let them die, and eat them..

Nearly all people that I associate with are A or B. People on THIS strange board seem to be at C and they are working on a 'D'.

The people that you associate with are either lying, don't know themselves very well, or will end up dead sometime in January. Y2K ITSELF is very difficult to think about, nobody wants to deal with the possibilities - certainly not the pollies. But if you don't deal with them, you'll end up dead. It's really that simple. If you're gonna set yourself up to have your head blown off, why even bother to prepare at all??

-- (its@coming.soon), July 28, 1999.

'D' is kill them before they kill you.

-- (pollys@gonna.die), July 28, 1999.

its,

I've heard you make similar statements before. The problem is your just plain wrong.

Most people will starve before they kill someone else. If you want proof, look at what happened during the Great Depression. Rich people died in their houses because they were too proud to admit they needed help. They times old guys endured are worse than anything a modern american can even imagine.

During the Great Depression and the hardest times imaginable people did not resort to cannibalism or even looting. Many people died of starvation.

You are wrong about human nature, flat out. There is NO precidence in human history for what you are talking about. There is no widespread tendancy for people to commit canablism in hard times, period.

It's just a sick fantasy. Ultimate cynacism.

Don't try to pass this off as, "you are just naieve". I'm not. It's plain to anyone who has studied history that you are factually incorrect.

-- Bryce (bryce@seanet.com), July 28, 1999.

I was really hesitant to post to this thread but thought I could share some info that others may find interesting. Do a search for "donner party". For those that don't know, the Donner Party was a group of early American Pioneers who had the great misfortune of being forced into a very bad survival situation while traveling out west across America. Their story is documented by journals that they kept. By reading the journals, you can get a general feel of what they must have gone through both physically and mentally. It was truly a sad and desperate ordeal. And yes, the did resort to murder and cannibalism. If I remember correctly, the things the survivors did were generally accepted by others after the fact.

-- Ready & Waiting (not@home.com1), July 28, 1999.

Wondering,

You've brought up an ugly subject with responses to prove it. Unfortunatly it has to be within the realm of our consderations.

Disposal depends on numbers. A body or a few could be burried with a not unreasonable amount of effort. Famine or widespread disease wouldn't leave the living with spare calories for digging. Gotta burn them. "Ashes, ashes we all fall down" and all that. Terrible thought.

Canibalism? For me only if there was hope and the flesh considered sacrament.

-- Carlos (riffraff1@cybertime.net), July 28, 1999.

In answer to "its@coming.soon"

My philoshophy is wrapped up in this sign to be posted out front:

"Tresspassers will be shot. Survivors wil be shot again"

-- Paul Milne (fedifo@halifax.com), July 28, 1999.

Who is the bigger idiot? The original poster? Or the idiots who answered him? (yeah, I know this now includes me, but where else am I going to ask it?)

-- Uncle Deedah (unkeed@yahoo.com), July 28, 1999.

DiEtER: WhERe ARe YoU WHeN We NEed YoU???????

-- jeanne (jeanne@hurry.now), July 28, 1999.

He's on the Shoot or Feed thread.

-- Look out (Dieter@spotter.org), July 28, 1999.

Wondering:

I just recently read something and I can't find it to pass along, but what it amounted to is that there are several ways to get sick.

Bacterial infection is one, bacteria are fairly complex critters.

Even more complex critters are bugs like amoebas and parasitic worms.

Supposedly we have insects like "bed mites" who live in skin and lice who live in your eyebrows, etc.

Viruses are less complex and basically consist of complete proteins with DNA or RNA codes intact that cause a host to replicate em, thus increasing to the point that you get sick.

An even less complex type of sickness comes from ingesting (or otherwise being exposed to) some really nasty protein molecules. Mad Cow disease is one of them and another is that sickness that those New Guinea folks got when they ritually ate their mom or dad's brains after they died.

It's bad to eat people.

Dogs and cats are good.

Rats and mice and birds are good.

Snakes and lizards are good.

Fish and crawdads and juahalote's are good.

earthworms and bugs are OK with a bit of salad dressing or salt and pepper.

Eat human flesh, you get sick and die.

One thing to always keep in the back of your mind, when you start running really short on bullets, save the last one for a special occasion.

-- Roger (pecosrog@earthlink.net), July 28, 1999.

Ready And Waiting,

Hello, I've read about the Donner party. It's a common story because of our horror and shock over what happened.

I think the Great Depression is a MUCH more fitting example of human behavior. People suffered and died from starvation, exposure and disease, and even through this there was no widespread looting or murder.

The Great Depression severly affected the entire nation in much the same way that doomers predict that Y2K will.

IMO, A series of date rollover bugs will never compare to the Great Depression. I'm basically a GI, but you might as well be trying to tell me that Y2K started as a plot by aliens.

Someone who really wants to survive hard times should start by not being mislead by negative fantasy.

-- Bryce (bryce@seanet.com), July 28, 1999.

Nobody's gonna die from Y2K - sheesh!

Regards,
Andy Ray

-- Andy Ray's Biggest Fan (andymansfan@hotmail.com), July 28, 1999.

Bryce,

Calm down. We are not going to eat anyone. I promise. If possible we will help. If not possible we will give some comfort. If not possible we will give a decent burial--if possible.

-- Mara Wayne (MaraWAyne@aol.com), July 28, 1999.

Bryce wrote...."A series of date rollover bugs will never compare to the Great Depression...."

But, it ain't JUST y2k anymore.

-- J (jart5@bellsouth.net), July 28, 1999.

If the ground is be frozen burying them would be difficult. I think you would have to burn them but you will need A LOT of wood or fuel. If possible add something to cover the smell, which I understand is nastier than just burnt meat. Do it downwind of your house.

If you can't spare the wood or fuel, you might have no choice but to dump them somewhere as far from you, and as far from anyone's water source as possible. This is one reason that living near the ocean might be an advantage. Just bury them at sea.

If you have access to a backhoe you might want to dig a trench ahead of time.

What if someone was dying in my yard? Even if I just shot them how do I know that they don't have a contagious disease? Don't go near them. If they can't or won't leave, stay away untill they are dead so at least they can't breath on you. If they ask you to put them out of their misery, do so from a safe distance. If you absolutely can't get the police or someone (well, if you shot them maybe you shouldn't get the police) to take them away, and you don't have a bodybag, tie a rope on them and drag them far away from your house and water source. Wear disposable gloves and a surgical mask (made out of paper towels ?).

got bodybags?

-- biker (y2kbiker@worldnet.att.net), July 29, 1999.

If there were a lot of bodies and you couldn't find a backhoe & fuel, you could put them in an abandoned building and torch it. Obviously you choose a building that is not near other buildings or trees.

-- biker (y2kbiker@worldnet.att.net), July 29, 1999.

test

-- (hey@hey.hey), July 29, 1999.

Paul's got the right idea!!

If you're not prepared to kill, be prepared to die.

-- (its@coming.soon), July 29, 1999.

Turn off Andy's stupid font.

-- (kill@the.font), July 29, 1999.

This is NOT a new topic. I recall reading stuff like this a year ago, or longer.

If things get so bad that there are dead bodies lying about, I expect I'll be one of them, so won't have to deal with that particular situation.

Hope I'm tasty at least... ;->

-- yum yum (pass@the.tenderloin), July 29, 1999.

If things get so bad that there are dead bodies lying about, I expect I'll be one of them, so won't have to deal with that particular situation.

Giving up so easily, Yum Yum?? I just hope you don't have a family who's counting on you to survive!!

-- (its@coming.soon), July 29, 1999.

Read "Lucifer's Hammer", by Larry Niven & Jerry Pournelle, for insights into cannibal theory. This book is a great analogy to Y2K worst case scenario!

Roving bands of renegade military troops force new members to eat people or die.

-- No Cannibal here (I@tastebad.com), July 29, 1999.

Nobody,

Members of the Donner Party did commit murder. There were Indians with them (2 believe). If I remember correctly, the Indians became worried about what the others had in store for them and snuck away at night. At least one of the Donner Party tracked them down and murdered one of them (maybe both, I can't remember). The Indian(s) were then eaten. Read their journals.

-- Ready & Waiting (not@home.com1), July 29, 1999.

D) Move far away from potential cannibals..eh.

Wow, Uncle Dedah and Hardliner are back...(they had left, life here had no more meaning, so I left too ;-)) I think I'll continue on reading :-)

-- Chris (back by curiousity) (%$^&^@pond.com), July 29, 1999.

Threads like these do wonders to get your message out.

Very, very impressive!

Deano

-- Deano (deano@luvthebeach.com), July 29, 1999.

I recommend getting outta da cities.Otherwise,Loomponics.com has a new book on butcherind and sectioning humans for meat.Looks like a great coffee-table book.

-- zoobie (zoobiezoob@yahoo.com), July 30, 1999.

Bryce;

Unfortunately, history is littered with examples of poeple eating other people. As to your comparison to The Great Depression, society was VERY, VERY different then. It may be a grave (!) error to compare today's society to one which existed only 60-70 years ago.

I believe there is potential for some of us who have never seen a dead body (outside of a Funeral Home) to have to deal with the issue. I hope I'm not one of them but I will do whatever becomes necessary (bury or burn 'em).

By the way, there is no doubt in my mind that otherwise sane, normal people will resort to ANY means to feed their children - I will. Fortunately for my family I GI and have been preparing in earnest for awhile.

Thanks, Brian

-- tangbang (get@yours.now), July 30, 1999.

I'm suprised no one has mentioned the true story (book and movie) "Alive" about the soccer team whose plane crashed in the mountains. They resorted to cannabalism (no need for murder, some of them were fatally injured in the crash). Some of the guys who were dying asked their friends to eat them so they at least could survive...

-- biker (y2kbiker@worldnet.att.net), July 30, 1999.