Are You Feeling All Alone re Y2K?

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Yesterday, I spent nine hours at Y2K Preparedness Expo in the two Exhibition Halls at the Washington State Fairgrounds. I was amazed at how many people were there! People ARE concerned, educating themselves, preparing. Many vendors presented their wares, all the way from magnetic bracelets, to survival foods (on sale right there), to heating, cooking, water systems, etc., free of dependency upon the usual utility companies. (A Washington State Representative stated our State dam will not be Y2K complaint! "The power might not even make it to the grid!" He also said, "This is the first global crisis to come on a precise schedule!") All day, there were free seminars, as well as those for a charge of $5.00. There was an early evening panel ($5.00), Craig Smith as host and: Mike Hyatt, David Elliott, Ed Bell, James Talmage Stevens, Karen Anderson, Tim Wilson, and Ken Klein. There must have been 1000 people in the audience, and some wrote questions which were answered at the end. The program lasted about an hour and a half, and was LOADED with info. These seminars are going on in various areas across the nation. They are well worth attending. Access www.y2knews.com to find out if there are any near you. If you cannot attend, you can call 1-888-925-9925 to ask about a subscription to an excellent magazine they produce. We were given free copies, as well as tapes of their Atlanta Roundtable last June. They might be willing to send you one free copy of the magazine, plus a tape. They encourage making copies of the tape. I plan to make many copies for others; it's excellent! Those of us, who have been researching this enough to believe this is for real, do not have to feel alone anymore! And, there's plenty of help to show us what to do...it will increase, I believe. As James Talmadge Stevens said, "THE GREATEST ENEMIES TO THE PREPARED ARE THOSE WHO AREN'T!" Please, folks, get ready...and think "community;" help others!

-- Holly Allen (Holly3325@juno.com), August 09, 1998

Answers

The "greatest enemies to the prepared are those that aren't." Isn't that an interesting thought? Haven't we "infidels" been saying this all along on this forum only to be told we were fanatics, war mongers, guns aren't the answer, and so on and so forth. Glad you went and got your eyes opened up Holly! I hope you practice what you have learned at the seminar. If you do you will have a good chance of surviving. Remember, those that aren't prepared will be showing up at your door. They are your enemies. Are you going to be ready for that? Did they tell you how to turn the enemy away? Just curious.

-- bardou (Bardou@baloney.com), August 09, 1998.

In a word YES!

Thank God (generic form of speech) for my understanding wife, and family, who clearly see the threat to us all.

When my wife and I shared info about this with our (former) best friends who live next door, we were met with a dumb silence at first. Later my wife recieved a call from the neighbor's wife who, beleive it or not, suggested that we seek help!!!! They were worried about us!!! Needless to say we don't see much of them anymore.

My new motto: "To hell with all of them, let them find out the hard way". I realize this is probably counter-productive to the cause, but being looked upon as a nut case tends to make one wary about what one says to others. BTW, being a devious SOB I am hiding my food and other goods in various sneaky ways, and I will NOT share it with idiots who chose to bury their heads in the sand. I will stand around with everybody else and bitch about how hungry I am, and how unfair it was that we weren't warned about how bad this would be, and then go home and eat my cold canned chili in the dark. Good luck to all of us believers, we are going to need it(sigh).

-- Uncle Deedah (oncebitten@twiceshy.com), August 10, 1998.


Mrs. Douglas...

Will you please tell this forum why you cannot allow a Christian to even post exceptionally good (non-spiritual) material without some sarcastic, degrading, cutting, response? You may not be able to honestly answer, because you have no idea of the wretchedness or the evil capabilities of the human heart. The answer is simply this: You hate God, and your stubborn will keeps you from submitting to His authority (we were all that way...once). Therefore, you do all you can to destroy His witness, His testimony, and His people, and your end without true repentance, will be the Lake of fire.

We have friends with an 8 yr. old devilish, hyper-active child who was just plain mean. A few weeks after they got nutritional help for her, she was heard to say: "Grandma, it sure feels good to be nice!" Now, just imagine what the Lord can do for you, Mrs. Douglas.

Paul, the apostle, also killed Christians, but he was wise enough to repent and seek forgiveness. There's still hope for you, Barb!

Arcy

-- Arcy (arcy.w@usa.net.net), August 10, 1998.


We had lunch today with a couple who have been friends of my husbands for years and years. When I mentioned that we had purchased land and we making some preparations --- the wife practically leaped across the table at me. "Didn't I know I was paranoid and creating more paranoia? What were people with no resources supposed to do? She wasn't going to waste her life worrying about something she couldn't control!" I didn't give an inch - and told her that people can ALWAYS do something...even take minor precautions. I also slipped in the word "denial" once or twice. Upshot of all of that. I won't talk to these people - or pretty much anyone else about this unless my opinion is asked. My husband, while agreeing to buy food and some raw land, doesn't want to hear anymore about it. Meanwhile, I've decided to do what I think is best - arrange for alternative power, seeds for gardening, etc...simply because to NOT take every precaution I can would drive me crazy. Since we both work and I have my own income - I can do this.

The isolation that is setting in is becoming difficult. I think this forum serves a vital function in keeping people connected and feeling sane when all around them are looking at them like they have lost it. (Maybe we have -- but I don't think so...) But - no more proseletyzing - people don't appreciate it, they think you're nuts and , come to think of it, I DON'T want all these folks knowing I have these resources...there might come a time I might regret making that publicly known...I agree with

-- Chana Campos (chana@campos.org), August 10, 1998.


sorry...my message was sent over my objections...I wasn't done yet. I agree with Uncle Deedah before. You can't waste precious time wiith people who just don't want to "hear" --- might as well use it productively making preparations to take care of yourself.

-- Chana Campos (chana@campos.org), August 10, 1998.


Thanks, Holly, for the great report! Very encouraging. I have been receiving an increasing number of inquiries from folks looking for resources and hearing more comments from those who are beginning to work with their churches and communities.

It's really frustrating when you see this as a life-and-death issue to have your efforts to inform others rudely rebuffed. But taking a strongly defensive stance doesn't help to convince others. Salespeople--and that's what we are, in a sense, out to "sell" our viewpoint to others--are trained to expect rejection and to take it not as a sign of defeat, but as a sign that they haven't yet given the potential buyer sufficient information. They remain calm and good-natured and after setting the other person at ease, give more information about the benefits of their product or service. When people attack my ideas, I just laugh at myself with them (as much as I'm hurting inside and desperate for them to understand) and use what salespeople call the "feel-felt-found" forumula: "I know it sounds ridiculous! I understand how you feel. It seems impossible that something like two little digits inside computers could wreck global havoc. I felt the same way myself when I first heard about it. I thought people were awfully hysterical over a little technical glitch, some little bug. But when I found out that there's an 80% chance that we could have power brownouts and regional blackouts, and that the railroads might not be able to deliver food to our cities, I started thinking about it as a coming storm that I should be prepared for. I see it sort of like buying insurance. " Then I CHANGE THE SUBJECT. I leave the door open for them. If I set up barriers with a hostile defense of my viewpoints, it makes it awfully hard for them to approach me when they want more information later.

It's HARD for people who have only mainstream media to rely on for their information to simply accept, at first hearing, that such a monumental crisis could be moving at them so quickly and that it hasn't even made the news. . If we didn't have access to the Net and weren't actively researching the issue, our response to someone who approached us with such a preposterous tale would be to dismiss him or her as a nut-case, too.

As someone said on another forum, you have to lead that horse GENTLY to the water. You planted the idea in their minds. They will hear the mentions of y2k on the mainstream media more readily now that you have mentioned it, and wake up to the reality sooner than if you hadn't. It's important to keep our relationships with our neighbors as cordial as possible as we work toward our own preparation. The goal is to keep them from becoming enemies in the long run. To think of them as enemies now simply because they rejected our first warnings is self-defeating.

-- Faith Weaver (faith-weaver@usa.net), August 10, 1998.


Arcy: My name is not Mrs. Douglas. Please address me as Bardou so others know who you are talking to. By all means go ahead and post anything you like on Christians, just be prepared to get answers to it and don't be offended when someone does. Dish it out, but take it too. I think Holly's post was very good. It created dialogue from others who have experienced what we all have with trying to tell friends and neighbors about Y2K. You see, it's like convincing other people of other faiths the same thing you are trying to convince them of. Let people live their own lives, make up their own minds, and look out for #1. That has been my philosophy. I have worked my tail off, spent thousands of dollars to prepare, worked after midnight (so as not to be detected), worked in 110 degree temperatures to make sure me and my family are taken care of. I have sounded the warning, was told I was an alarmist, and when those same people show up at my door, they will be turned away. I will only use a gun when my life or my family's life is being threatened. I am thankful we still have that right and freedom here in America.

-- Bardou (bardou@baloney.com), August 10, 1998.

The majority of people I know have never had to face hardship. They have always been fed, plenty of money, free to travel, and their life is cushy. It takes an effort to prepare and an effort to believe that your life will soon be a struggle. Many people just can't face that fact if and when it does happen. They will be caught unaware, it will be too late for many. However, there's always bartering items you may want to put in your store of goods. Like TP, soap, candles, camp stoves, fuel, canned goods. I wouldn't give anything away without getting something in return.

-- Lioness (bornfree@aol.com), August 10, 1998.

Now THERE is a philosophy to live by. Don't "give anything away without getting something in return." With this attitude, civilization would surely collapse! Heaven help us! Incidentally, good post, Holly!

-- Dave (dave22@concentric.net), August 10, 1998.

Bardou, How big of a family are you protecting? Is your husband helping (if there is one in the picture). It has to be stressful to do it alone. I thought Holly's post was informative. Keep on posting! As for me, I think Y2k will be fixable, but if you are uptight and tense and cause trouble at home and with others...that's the real problem. How many divorces will Y2k cause? Either way you are devastated, if you don't prepare you may die, if you do your relationships may.

-- Human Kind (Human@madness.net), August 10, 1998.


This is an interesting thread. How many of you out there have considered the conditions that MAY exist in populated areas? Famine, rampant crime (to include arson, theft, murder, rape, etc.), disease (aids, diptheria, food poisoning, ecoli, tuberculosis, jaundice, and more). The groups in this area are preparing to prohibit any visits from strangers. Sickness can kill an entire enclave. Hungry people will return with trouble, if you feed them. Gangs will arrive quickly, in the early going, if they find out you exist with food and water. I fear many of you that are making preparations will trust your fellow man and pay dearly for that mistake. Maybe after a few months it will be possible to assist and coordinate with unknown others...

R.A. Mann

-- R.A. Mann (ramann@hotmail.com), August 10, 1998.


Dear Human Kind: My husband and I have been married 29 years, are very happy, have two grown and successful children. My husband and children know the situation and they are acting accordingly. My husband is helping, he makes the money and I spend it. He has helped me pack and store. He is on emergency call out and must leave for long periods of time, so I do it. It is a challenge planning menus, and purchasing food to complete a well balanced diet. No one is uptight in my home because we are all on the same wave length. I have been on other BBs where (especially men), have stated that their wives have left them because of Y2K. They may have intimindated their wives, or maybe there was trouble beforehand and this was an excuse to end it. Maybe Y2K won't be bad, but from what I have read many experts are putting it on a scale of 1 - 10 around a 7 or 8 being bad. By the way, my husband is the gun lover. I buy the food, he buys the guns and ammo, we compliment each other. By the way Human Kind, who are the other's to cause trouble with? None of my neighbors (except for maybe 1), have any interest in doing anything for themselves. They are too busy with their country club and vacations to even think about anything bad happening. You wipe the dust from your feet and get on with your life. We may not even stick around here if and when TSHTF. It really will be every man for himself. I have elderly parents to care for and I will have my hands full there.

-- Bardou (bardou@baloney.com), August 10, 1998.

Dear R.A. Mann: You are so right about disease and hungry people asking for a hand out. If people are prepared to do that, then that's their business. But isn't it like at Thanksgiving and Christmas, we give food and money to help the homeless and hungry, but what about the day after, and the day after that? Do we do it out of guilt? Will it be the same when TSHTF? At what point do you say no? I say right from the start for the same reasons you gave. You endanger your whole families lives, because word soon gets out that you have food and water.

-- Bardou (bardou@baloney.com), August 10, 1998.

My family and I also spent a few hours at the Preparedness Expo in Puyallup, Washington, while traveling back to our home in eastern Washington state after our vacation. As we were walking out of the fairgrounds, I looked around at the surrounding metropolis that has grown up in the Puget Sound area in the thirty years since I last lived there, and asked myself this question: What about those three million people in western Washington who did not attend the Preparedness Expo, those who have no clue about Y2K, because no one has told them about it just once, and in a way that at least gives them the opportunity to judge for themselves? The failure of our national, state, and local leadership on this issue is nothing short of incredible. Responsible citizens must try as best they can to step in where politicians have failed. We will all sink or swim together with Y2K. Prepare as best you can, but the fate of those many millions out there who haven't prepared is ultimately your fate as well.

-- Scott Brim (sbrim@3-cities.com), August 11, 1998.

Dear Holly Allen and Scott Brim. You visited the Puyallup Fair and Preparedness Expo. Since we have some good friends living in W. WA and the wife is being treated for breast cancer we are very concerned about them. Would you please elaborate about the highlights of this Y2K expo? Did you find any proof from credible sources about the severity of the Y2K impact? Why do so many people assume that people will riot and kill? I have lived for many years in TEOTWAWKI and did not experienced such behavior. Respectfully, Have already lived in TEOTWAWKI

-- Have already lived in TEOTWAWKI (winners@magiclink.com), August 11, 1998.


Does anyone know of any Y2K expos in Texas...? I live in the Dallas area and am interested if one is coming to town soon. If not I will host one.

-- scholty (scholty@waymark.net), August 11, 1998.

You are asking the kinds of questions I like to help with, but to give even a partial report here would use up too much space. Please go up to my original post, at the top, and access the website and the 888 number. In addition, you can access www.y2knet.com -- Ken Klein's site. You will find a place to post your name, address, etc., and request a free tape and magazine. They will do a more thorough job of informing you, and send products you can physically share with others--not just my "word-of-mouth." Incidentally, The Tacoma News Tribune had a lengthy, front-page Y2K report yesterday. It didn't pull any "punches." Here are the first two paragraphs: (headline) "Computers not only likely victims of Year 2000 bug "State worries that any of its facilities using 'embedded chips' could be at risk of foul-ups "Joe Turner; The News Tribune "OLYMPIA - The state is spending $83 million to get rid of the Year 2000 bug that infests many of its computers, but it may have to spend just as much to purge the defect from its buildings and other facilities. "'It could be as big or bigger,' said John Saunders, Year 2000 program manager for the state Department of Information Systems. 'Nobody has an answer at this point. It's just an open question'." The report goes on to say that prison doors might not lock, hatchery fish may die; concerns are mentioned about State hospitals, veterans' homes, and much more. "Some programs have been fixed and tested - and they work..." Among them, the systems that cut checks to state and school retirees, the system that disburses money to 50,000 Dept. of Social and Health Service doctors, hospitals and others, as well as the drivers licensing system. "We know we can't do everything. There are some things that are not going to get fixed. But of the mission-critical systems, it looks like we're pretty much on track. "The big unknowns are the facilities and the embeded chips,' he (Saunders) added." I could go on, but I've already used up enough space, haven't I!

-- Holly Allen (Holly3325@juno.com), August 11, 1998.

Good news! You can order tapes of the Y2KCPR Atlanta, Critical Preparedness Roundtable--at a price you shouldn't resist! -- $1.50 each for less than 10; $1.00 each for more than 10. This is an excellent tape to give to others, believe me! Ed gives some very valuable info, along with several others. I was going to make my own copies, but couldn't do it for this price, or with as good quality. I think this may be THE best way to get the word out! One can pop it into his or her car tape player. This tape is a real eye-opener! Send a check, made out to Swiss America Trading Co. and address the envelope to them at: 14455 No. Hayden Rd., Scottsdale, AZ 85260. The price even includes shipping! Such a deal!

-- Holly Allen (Holly3325@juno.com), August 12, 1998.

I think that some of us may be missing the point. While I have had mixed reactions when bringing up this subject, I do not think that we can just abandon the people in denial. I have decided to stop bringing up the subject since I have been accused of being an alarmist, tryin to scare people.

I believe that when the time comes, commmunities need to band together . I don't care if anyone believed me or not. I will do whatever I can to help them.

I think that Y2K may be the human race's chance to press the reset button on technology. It has become a necessity in our culture. We have forgotten how to do things for ourselves. Today children can't add without a calculator. They can't write without a word processor. They don't learn to spell, they use the spellchecker.

If we have this chance, shouldn't we try to do something better. Help your neighbor

-- John Gray (jmg13@netscape.net), August 22, 1998.


y2k has been the topic of discussion in my family alot. very few other people seem to know or care. even my 19 year old has the common sense to know that even if nothing happens, something will happen. in florida, even with just a threat of a hurricane, people are in a state of semi-panic, stores are cleaned out, everyone stays home, and no hurricane. i wonder how many of these same people will be prepared for y2k. with the world being in the state it is, y2k might be the remedy.

-- Melody Nolfi (adidas9962@aol.com), January 03, 1999.

Great point melody, my feelings exactly - a wake-up call!

-- Andy (2000EOD@prodigy.net), January 04, 1999.

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